Coronavirus

[blueeyes]

https://www.newsweek.com/controversial-wuhan-lab-experiments-that-may-have-started-coronavirus-pandemic-1500503

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[oldno7]

AZ Woman Who Blamed Trump for Chloroquine Ingestion Now Subject of Homicide Investigation

In their effort to attack the Trump administration as it battles the Wuhan coronavirus outbreak in the US, the anti-Trump opposition press has peddled Chinese propaganda and now it looks like they’ve rallied around someone who is now under a homicide investigation. Remember that Arizona couple who ingested chloroquine phosphate because they thought it could ward off the virus? Wanda Lenius and her husband, Gary, ingested the fish tank cleaner with soda and the effects were dire. The husband died, while it left Wanda in critical condition. Now, she’s being investigated for homicide. Alana Goodman of the Washington Free Beacon has the scoop (https://freebeacon.com/coronavirus/police-investigating-death-of-arizona-man-from-chloroquine-phosphate/). One thing that struck friends of the late Gary Lenius as odd was this notion that this retired engineer would just take poison willingly.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/2020/04/29/az-woman-who-blamed-trump-for-chloroquine-ingestion-now-subject-of-homicide-inves-n2567839

[blueeyes]

AZ Woman Who Blamed Trump for Chloroquine Ingestion Now Subject of Homicide Investigation

In their effort to attack the Trump administration as it battles the Wuhan coronavirus outbreak in the US, the anti-Trump opposition press has peddled Chinese propaganda and now it looks like they’ve rallied around someone who is now under a homicide investigation. Remember that Arizona couple who ingested chloroquine phosphate because they thought it could ward off the virus? Wanda Lenius and her husband, Gary, ingested the fish tank cleaner with soda and the effects were dire. The husband died, while it left Wanda in critical condition. Now, she’s being investigated for homicide. Alana Goodman of the Washington Free Beacon has the scoop (https://freebeacon.com/coronavirus/police-investigating-death-of-arizona-man-from-chloroquine-phosphate/). One thing that struck friends of the late Gary Lenius as odd was this notion that this retired engineer would just take poison willingly.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/2020/04/29/az-woman-who-blamed-trump-for-chloroquine-ingestion-now-subject-of-homicide-inves-n2567839Wow...I was in Arizona watching the news when they first reported this. I seriously wanted to know why anyone would do that. I couldn't comprehend someone truly being that stupid.

This makes more sense. What an awful way to die.

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[oldno7]

https://i.imgur.com/z45rgu2.gif

[oldno7]

https://i.imgur.com/XJ40eH0.jpg

[oldno7]

https://i.postimg.cc/6Qj2kJxj/DACB8-F89-BB86-43-A6-8-FE9-7258776-C7-C94.jpg

[BasinCruiser]

AZ Woman Who Blamed Trump for Chloroquine Ingestion Now Subject of Homicide Investigation



In their effort to attack the Trump administration as it battles the Wuhan coronavirus outbreak in the US, the anti-Trump opposition press has peddled Chinese propaganda and now it looks like they’ve rallied around someone who is now under a homicide investigation. Remember that Arizona couple who ingested chloroquine phosphate because they thought it could ward off the virus? Wanda Lenius and her husband, Gary, ingested the fish tank cleaner with soda and the effects were dire. The husband died, while it left Wanda in critical condition. Now, she’s being investigated for homicide. Alana Goodman of the Washington Free Beacon has the scoop (https://freebeacon.com/coronavirus/police-investigating-death-of-arizona-man-from-chloroquine-phosphate/). One thing that struck friends of the late Gary Lenius as odd was this notion that this retired engineer would just take poison willingly.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/2020/04/29/az-woman-who-blamed-trump-for-chloroquine-ingestion-now-subject-of-homicide-inves-n2567839



That is too funny. Not for the dead husband, but for the blow to the LSM (Lame Stream Media) narrative that the things Trump says has real consequences of people actually listening to him, misinterpretting what he says, and then getting hurt by trying to 'follow his direction'. This would be the 2nd time the media has tried tying Trumps remarks to real cases of people getting hurt trying to follow what they think he is suggestin, that has now been debunked.

Remember last week the blow up over the 'disinfectant' remarks he made, and how the LSM accused him of telling people to drink and inject chlorox and Lysol, and that people were going to get hurt or die by listening to him? And sure enough a day or two later, headlines appeared stating that recent spikes to poison control for disinfectant accidents are evidence that people are actually trying to injest disinfectants following Trumps remarks, and that he is responsible. Turns out, that also was fake news - gasp, shocker. While it is a fact that there has been spikes in disinfectant poisonings to poison control, those spikes started over month ago in early March. How could what Trump said a week ago cause spikes in poisonings over a month ago? Did he let sometihng slip a long time ago about disinfectants that the media missed, but other people picked up on? Or, due to the hightened concerns about germs and sudden rush to buy disinfectants to blanket everything, including food by some, by the masses in early March cause a spike in incidents of people misusing those products - splashes into eyes and mouth, getting cleaner on hands and then transferring to eye/mouth, result in a sudden spike in calls to poison control?

[oldno7]

https://i.imgur.com/zBbyfpi.jpg

[rockgremlin]

Costco says face masks are now mandatory for all shoppers in their stores. :roll:

https://www.ksl.com/article/46746754/costco-to-require-shoppers-to-wear-a-face-mask

Sam's Club here I come...

[BasinCruiser]

So, with the 'opening up' of Utah, the guvna has started an initiative for a mask for every Utahn (2M masks availage upon order, Salt Lake County is requiring them be used at reopened businesses https://www.ksl.com/article/46746778/salt-lake-county-officials-face-coverings-required-at-reopened-businesses, Costco is requiring them for all customers at their stores https://www.ksl.com/article/46746754/costco-to-require-shoppers-to-wear-a-face-mask,


Personally, I've thought them to be overkill, but whatever. 2 weeks ago, 1 in 20 people at the grocery store had one on. Funny - the other day my wife and I went to the grocery store, and we were like 1/20 that didn't have one one. After leaving the grocery store, we went straight to Maverick, which had about 20 patrons, and nobody had one on, not even the store employees. Seems a completely different demographic of mindset at the Maverick than there was at Smith's.

So, what about anyone else - what are your thoughts on wearing masks? Have you already been wearing one for the past week+? Don't think it's necessary, but will comply with local governement regulations? Won't wear one, unless the store itself requires it, and will honor the private property request rights? Or, refuse to wear one at all - if they don't want my business as I am, I'll go somewhere else, and screw the government regs?

If you don't have a mask already, but want to start wearing one, where do you get one, now? Especially now that the government and some stores are requiring them, it's going to be the TP rush all over again - And we can see how that hasn't recovered, yet. I see these mask wearing requirements likely to be eased/reduced if nobody can buy one anywhere. Apparently, the website that Herbert set up keeps crashing due to overload.

[rockgremlin]

if they don't want my business as I am, I'll go somewhere else, and screw the government regs


^^^THIS^^^


I'd say about 99.8% of all masks worn by the general public are not going to do anything because they're either worn wrong, or recycled one too many times, or the fabric is too porous. Or all three.

That said, wearing face masks has now evolved into more of a statement than a safety precaution, and wearing it states loud and clear that you're drinking the Kool-Aid, and are willing to live under the thumb of manufactured fear.

Well.....I'm not. And I refuse to drink the Kool-Aid, and I refuse to wear a stupid rag on my face against my will.

[BasinCruiser]

^^^THIS^^^


I'd say about 99.8% of all masks worn by the general public are not going to do anything because they're either worn wrong, or recycled one too many times, or the fabric is too porous. Or all three.

That said, wearing face masks has now evolved into more of a statement than a safety precaution, and wearing it states loud and clear that you're drinking the Kool-Aid, and are willing to live under the thumb of manufactured fear.

Well.....I'm not. And I refuse to drink the Kool-Aid, and I refuse to wear a stupid rag on my face against my will.


Glad I’m not the only one to feel this way. You put it much more eloquently than I could.

[stefan]

^^^THIS^^^


I'd say about 99.8% of all masks worn by the general public are not going to do anything because they're either worn wrong, or recycled one too many times, or the fabric is too porous. Or all three.



just to understand, you don't believe that a face mask can reduce the spreading of respiratory droplets into the air from a person who has the virus (maybe unknowingly) which is a main way the coronavirus is transmitted.

[oldno7]

just to understand, you don't believe that a face mask can reduce the spreading of respiratory droplets into the air from a person who has the virus (maybe unknowingly) which is the main way the coronavirus is transmitted.

Just to understand more--so social distancing doesn't work?:ne_nau:

[Iceaxe]

No, I will not be wearing no dumbass mask...

Unless I'm robbing a bank, then I'll be wearing a mask.

[BasinCruiser]

If you pay attention, the narrative shift is slowly moving like this:

Shutdowners: Stay at home. If you go out, you're going to die, or kill someone. It's irresponsible and selfish.
Openers: What if we go out and wear masks and social distance?
Shudowners: No, no, no. That's not how it works. The media has said that masks don't work that well, and we need to save them for the healthcare people because there is a shortage. You want to just kill people for your 'freedom' and stock prices. I hope you get the virus and die.

(is now shifting to)

Shutdowners (now mask wearing virtue signallers): I'm a responsible, considerate, patron of society, because I wear my mask everywhere when I go out in public, and I care about other people.
Freedom Lovers: Can we just social distance, and not wear a mask?
Maskwearers: No. No. No. You must wear a mask. The experts on TV has said that this will save us all. The sooner everyone does that, the sooner we can get back to normal.
Freedom Lovers: But, if you're wearing mask, why do you care if i wear one or not?
Maskwearers: You just want to be difficult. That's not how this works. It only works when everyone wears masks and social distances. You just want to be selfish, and kill people. I hope you get the virus and die.

[rockgremlin]

If you pay attention, the narrative shift is slowly moving like this:

Shutdowners: Stay at home. If you go out, you're going to die, or kill someone. It's irresponsible and selfish.
Openers: What if we go out and wear masks and social distance?
Shudowners: No, no, no. That's not how it works. The media has said that masks don't work that well, and we need to save them for the healthcare people because there is a shortage. You want to just kill people for your 'freedom' and stock prices. I hope you get the virus and die.

(is now shifting to)

Shutdowners (now mask wearing virtue signallers): I'm a responsible, considerate, patron of society, because I wear my mask everywhere when I go out in public, and I care about other people.
Freedom Lovers: Can we just social distance, and not wear a mask?
Maskwearers: No. No. No. You must wear a mask. The experts on TV has said that this will save us all. The sooner everyone does that, the sooner we can get back to normal.
Freedom Lovers: But, if you're wearing mask, why do you care if i wear one or not?
Maskwearers: You just want to be difficult. That's not how this works. It only works when everyone wears masks and social distances. You just want to be selfish, and kill people. I hope you get the virus and die.


Ding! Ding!!

Exactly my sentiments.

Wearing a face mask for many folks is just blatant virtue signaling -- an excuse to judge and look down upon those stupid, irresponsible Drumpf followers who insist that money is more important than human lives.

[twotimer]

Personally, I've thought them to be overkill, but whatever. 2 weeks ago, 1 in 20 people at the grocery store had one on. Funny - the other day my wife and I went to the grocery store, and we were like 1/20 that didn't have one one.

So, what about anyone else - what are your thoughts on wearing masks?
Yep...same thing happened here in Denver. People are out walking their dogs with no one else near them and they have a mask on. Walking down the street, in the park all by themselves...driving the friggin' car with a mask on. I can't figure if most of them are just going along with the program or if they're scared shitless and believe this virus if floating around in the air...just waiting to attack them. Like people that freak out and run when they see a spider...I tell them "The damn thing isn't going to chase you down, so just relax". Same thing with snakes...or these psycho feminists that see a rapist lurking in every dark corner. I always keep my mouth shut with those but always think "Who the hell would want to rape an ugly old hag like you?". Hypochondria of the brain is what I call it.

I haven't put a mask on since this whole thing began. I peruse the grocery store, the hardware store, etc...and no one has said a thing to me. Hopefully no one will, because my response is likely to be "No one tells me what to do and you can kiss my ass". A month ago they were telling us it was useless to wear one. And if anyone reading this is shaking their heads then it sucks to be you.

Just a nasty strain of the flu, and everybody shit their pants. Like I said nearly two months ago, it should have been allowed to run it's course...warn everybody it's a nasty one and do a "lockdown" type thing with the old folks homes so they aren't wheeling out body bags on a daily basis. Instead it was hyped into a catastrophe and the Congress gave itself a pass to gang rape the Treasury...after slipping a few bucks into everyone's pockets, of course. It was a no win situation for anyone but those that are going to rake in the cash that have friends in high places. A "perfect disaster".

Blows my mind...I was wondering what was next after the Impeachment nuke they dropped in Trump's lap didn't go off...so they dropped one in the lap of all of us. Crazy huh? They couldn't get him so they went after everyone else...friend and foe alike.

Some may read what I just wrote and think "That's absolute nonsense"...well, how about this: They reacted like a bunch of stupid kids in a pitch black room throwing frisbee's around. "They're not that smart Byron, they're just a bunch of idiots". Does that make it better?

Of all the crazy bullshit in the past three years plus, the last few months have been absolutely off the hook. Almost surreal.

[stefan]

Just to understand more--so social distancing doesn't work?:ne_nau:

i think it's a common practice to take more than one approach to address a larger problem, particularly if it may have a greater effect or provide a redundancy

[middlefork]

The way 90% of people are wearing masks is a big fat joke. I guess I trust people without them more than those with. At least I'm reminded to take my own precautions rather than rely on someone else.

[rockgremlin]

Elon Musk just became my new hero:

Tesla CEO Elon Musk lambasts 'fascist' coronavirus stay-in-place orders

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesla-ceo-elon-musk-lambasts-fascist-coronavirus-stayinplace-orders-000243948.html

[blueeyes]

If you pay attention, the narrative shift is slowly moving like this:

Shutdowners: Stay at home. If you go out, you're going to die, or kill someone. It's irresponsible and selfish.
Openers: What if we go out and wear masks and social distance?
Shudowners: No, no, no. That's not how it works. The media has said that masks don't work that well, and we need to save them for the healthcare people because there is a shortage. You want to just kill people for your 'freedom' and stock prices. I hope you get the virus and die.

(is now shifting to)

Shutdowners (now mask wearing virtue signallers): I'm a responsible, considerate, patron of society, because I wear my mask everywhere when I go out in public, and I care about other people.
Freedom Lovers: Can we just social distance, and not wear a mask?
Maskwearers: No. No. No. You must wear a mask. The experts on TV has said that this will save us all. The sooner everyone does that, the sooner we can get back to normal.
Freedom Lovers: But, if you're wearing mask, why do you care if i wear one or not?
Maskwearers: You just want to be difficult. That's not how this works. It only works when everyone wears masks and social distances. You just want to be selfish, and kill people. I hope you get the virus and die.The narrative has definitely shifted. This stay home was to keep from over loading the hospital systems. Clearly that didn't work for parts of NY which is crazy populated and on top of each other. I do think it helped but if you are part of a family that has lost loved ones you might disagree. Or healthcare workers dealing with the numerous patients.

Other places like here the system is not overwhelmed. And honestly you can't keep everything shut down the domino effect of this quarantine is a nightmare. The narrative some how turned to "stop the spread" and shaming people who don't do what is expected to stop the spread.

Messages from media and from leading politicians ALL of them are mixed. That video the cute blond made that someone posted is exactly what you hear on TV. Do this but not this.

For people who are naturally anxious this is freaking them out. For those that are skeptical
..well they are just freaking out those anxious beans even more. And the anxious beans just piss off the skeptics. Wicked never ending cycle.

My take on masks. Yes they will stop the spread of your germs to someone else if you wear one. And you are less likely to pick up someone else's germs if you are wearing one. That is why they wear them at the hospital with any patient that has an easily spread communicable disease.

I now have to wear one ALL the time in the hospital. No longer is it an option to wear one. Working in the lab I have virtually no exposure to the rest of the hospital. We kind of hold up in lab always. No one ventures in we don't venture out. We like it that way. But it is mandated we wear a mask as we walk into the hospital and everywhere in the hospital and when we get to the car we are supposed to put it in a paper bag to keep it clean and wear it the next time we come to work. Because I am in the lab I can wear a homemade mask. Higher risk areas have the N95 masks. They have a system for who wears what type of mask and other PPE.

So at the hospital I will follow their recommendations. I like getting paid.

At PT if they require me to wear one I will. Both therapist have been wearing them consistently they haven't required the patients to wear one yet but a lot of them do there are a few of us who don't. No one has said anything but if they ask me to I will. We do have to stay 6ft apart wash our hands when we walk in and they wipe everything down as we go.

I don't wear one at the grocery store. I am more concerned with touching things than I am breathing in someone's exhaled breath. Especially the freezer or fridge door handles. I have to be mindful not to touch my face before I can wash my hands. I am terrible about that. However if I show up at the grocery store and am told I can't shop unless I wear a mask. I will put one on. I don't have the energy to give a shit about being spiteful and not shopping somewhere because they want me to cover my face. I will cover my face and go about my business.

I am just hoping that we don't have to wear a mask nonstop at the school this fall. But I am afraid that will be the case at this point so if I want a paycheck...I will wear that mask.

Do I think it is necessary for a healthy person to wear one. No. But if what they say is true about this virus that asymptomatic people spread this then wearing the mask does help and how do you know if you are asymptomatic? You don't.

So just like in the lab where we treat every tube of blood, every cup of urine, every bodily specimen as if it were infected with HIV or something worse. Then I guess you treat every person like they are spreading SARS-COV-2 including myself.

Death from this virus doesn't scare me. I am worh more to my kids dead than I am alive. [emoji4] But getting infected and being one of the bad cases that does survive...I am not going to lie that does worry me a bit. This particular bug is really good at messing with your inflammatory system and coagulation system and when you screw with both those you do some serious internal, potentially permanent damage.

Also I am very annoyed with the whole disinfectant hoopla. I seriously can't stand Trump. I didn't like him before he took office. He is the ultimate con artist. Even with my dislike of him he didn't say go ingest or inject disinfectant. He was thinking out loud and he should never do that. Especially in front of the press. But then he probably did that just so he could go around screaming fake news fake news I have decided those are his two new favorite words. He loves repetition.



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[Iceaxe]

Also I am very annoyed with the whole disinfectant hoopla. I seriously can't stand Trump. I didn't like him before he took office. He is the ultimate con artist. Even with my dislike of him he didn't say go ingest or inject disinfectant. He was thinking out loud and he should never do that.

Hahaha... one of the things I like most about Trump is you always know what's rattling around in his head. Trump is very transparent and direct, which are things your normal politicians are not.

[twotimer]

Nice post, Blueeyes...sounds reasonable to me. Speaking of reasonable, although I'm certainly not a fan of the "mask thing" as it is, if they require me to wear one when I want to buy eggs and milk I will. I have an American flag bandana that'll work just fine. It just seems half assed to require them now (Costco, for example) this far into it. Kinda like taking birth control after pregnancy has already happened. People like me and some of the other dudes around here just check out when conflicting "orders" are being spewed from both sides of the mouth. Personally, I'm really not bothered too much with this nonsense...as I've seen so much of it in my nearly 57 years that to get yourself upset about things you cannot possibly control is foolish. Can't help but snarl a little bit, though.

Can't disagree with you about Trump, either. I can certainly see why he's so objectionable to some. Heck, even I don't like to listen to him ramble on. However, if you can stomach it, listen to his speech at the end of February 2017...his first address to Congress. It was outstanding...and THAT is the reason we forgive his transgressions.

Anyway, if you're curious as to why he has so much support that speech hits all the buttons. And he meant it, as he's been proving it as he gone along.

A con man? Oh heck, they're all con men...and women. Except for those that can't do a damn thing about the good 'ole boys club as it is. It's just the way the game is played.

[blueeyes]

Hahaha... one of the things I like most about Trump is you always know what's rattling around in his head. Trump is very transparent and direct, which are things your normal politicians are not.Actually I take back what I said...he should keep thinking out loud in front of the TV and cameras off script.



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[twotimer]

Actually I take back what I said...he should keep thinking out loud in front of the TV and cameras off script.



Sent from my SM-G975U using TapatalkHa! I see what you did there. Even if he did that, he'd still mop the floor with Biden...at least Trump knows what day of the week it is.

[blueeyes]

Ha! I see what you did there. Even if he did that, he'd still mop the floor with Biden...at least Trump knows what day of the week it is.Trump mopping the floor with Biden really isn't that impressive. Why? Biden mops the floor with himself.



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[Iceaxe]

Actually I take back what I said...he should keep thinking out loud in front of the TV and cameras off script.


Hahaha... Trumps base... aka the deplorables... love it any time Trump goes off script... that's like tossing raw meat to the lions... it's something liberals and the media can't wrap their brain around.

Liberals and the media always take Trump literally, but never seriously... Trump's supporters always take him seriously, but not literally.

[blueeyes]

Hahaha... Trumps base... aka the deplorables... love it any time Trump goes off script... that's like tossing raw meat to the lions... it's something liberals and the media can't wrap their brain around.

Liberals and the media always take Trump literally, but never seriously... Trump's supporters always take him seriously, but not literally.He isn't worth taking literally or seriously.

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[Sombeech]

My wife is a nurse so I can post this jab;

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/i8csHjvgVsQ7iQAN6IezGEjE6wKmywR5jzwU771JaA_SSYYpm2 GqVO-ASUMSXMuh306uqLmsdxtHqDMf7mba_kB7flv1xJ3Tebalk6LnO xOQSARcWjQosascd2KWI-n6Bbkref5BgN3CwVER4k617tgCEE9n6n1kCDKrWIiVcGMpt7vU ojgVwWw8-Pw1sfFPn8b_mCV1iGby34TWnSRm56rfLoF6kTqDrgZK6DHjtR6 csNvS-jfvizv-_2kBXPSPOJrtyoSNzoOG9EPdRvbfuw8bkTXcPHtz69REi-7QX3Mm73H7hgoZuWMvIUsgXHZrErIe8OZsMZEG_FmCUluAuWVK SCTK4M7AMKa4dRg9PT-OhkUiGuhhrF685BCvyTvmO-m8xfeGX8QpxNZP4FuUEnt9SkxEEHTB2Gp881oCY-VbsSxWBP6rXp2aQ2QLA6HGvhWhliTOCKJZNWSdnrdC9JLWLVcq 8FG6wCOnEy3aINnOHSElkXE9hgBZnCQlnY98pGxW47_ZaIOnDp zXbX0FETSgbXVvY3IWjyzsmsPvr1NdNas-NRVNan3ZRB8YBiB3M09aq4v0PkQ0DlgzIlH4YzgFbewG85wvy0 R9fEGYc5zsgFiBkx3FGZMQrBv1HxvCP0qB_B54TeXVhWqj8Da6 DBHLcrsiqa-9EeZzyAX9stk25GXWisM-xaCgdJ-C1w=w590-h960-no

[Iceaxe]

He isn't worth taking literally or seriously.

But that's the issue... you don't have to like him, but until the left understands why Trump is so hugely popular with his base they will never beat him.

I couldn't stand Obama, but I understood why he appealed to many.

[blueeyes]

But that's the issue... you don't have to like him, but until the left understands why Trump is so hugely popular with his base they will never beat him.

I couldn't stand Obama, but I understood why he appealed to many.

I understand why he appeals to his base. If you think I am left you are wrong.

If Trump continues to show is true colors with this crisis I doubt he wins the election. Then all of his base and Trump can keep screaming how unfair the pandemic was to his campaign. And we will be stuck with another idiot in office because neither party can find decent candidate.



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[oldno7]

i think it's a common practice to take more than one approach to address a larger problem, particularly if it may have a greater effect or provide a redundancy


OK--"common practice"?(common to who?)

So in order to keep your wife from getting pregnant,

She is on the pill, that is 90%+ effective

But to help matters along, you wear a condom, that should be 99% effective.(redundancy)

But wait--If we don't have sex, that will be 100% effective.

And if we do all three---that should really work.


The goal is to prevent something(virus, pregnancy)

The ultimate solution is out there.

The question is--how far are we as a society willing to go to prevent either from happening.

The only way to prevent pregnancy, 100% is to choose not to have sex.

The ONLY way to prevent a virus from entering our body is to live in lockdown, forever.(complete abstinence from society)

How far are we willing to go?

How will our immune system grow and develop with zero exposure to virus and germs?

At what point are we destroying ourselves by being afraid to live?

Everyone has become so afraid of dying that they are unwilling to live.

[twotimer]

How far are we willing to go?

We just found out. We're lucky they didn't...

Require everyone to wear a "mask" every time they leave the house, for any reason.
Fine/Arrest anyone straying from a line that goes from their front door to the nearest grocery store.
Roadblocks.

That's really all that was left....strange to me that some people think we didn't go far enough.

[Iceaxe]

I understand why he appeals to his base. If you think I am left you are wrong.

I don't know what your are... but I know you're not on the right as Trump's approval rating among conservatives is over 90%.

[Iceaxe]

...https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200430/4fc95e6e4f45e94fa4968c2d55dff5be.jpg

[twotimer]

I understand why he appeals to his base. If you think I am left you are wrong.

If Trump continues to show is true colors with this crisis I doubt he wins the election. Then all of his base and Trump can keep screaming how unfair the pandemic was to his campaign. And we will be stuck with another idiot in office because neither party can find decent candidate.



Sent from my SM-G975U using TapatalkBeing a painter, I can tell you that some people see green, some people see blue. Some are colorblind.

A decent candidate? All those other people that ran for the Dem slot didn't even have a chance...all of them were rejected, quickly. The reason that senile/pedophile/creepy freak got the nod is because he's the man THEY wanted.

Who are they? That's a good question...but whoever these people are, if Biden wins then it'll be them that are calling the shots...and most likely things will be done that serve THEIR best interests. Vote "Anonymous" for prez? Not me.

[oldno7]

https://i.imgur.com/Mv5o8j3.jpg

[oldno7]

Do as I say--not as my wife does.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=34&v=KK_Ts418grY&feature=emb_l ogo

[rockgremlin]

The newest numbers are in for Utah:

https://www.ksl.com/article/46747234/utah-sees-177-new-cases-of-covid-19-1-new-death-on-eve-of-looser-economy-restrictions

So far, 108,501 people have tested positive for Wuhan Coronavirus in Utah, and 46 have died. I'll even be nice and do the math for you:

46 / 108,501 = 0.042%

LESS THAN A 0.05% CHANCE OF DYING FROM CORONAVIRUS IN UTAH, BUT BY ALL MEANS LET'S COMMIT ECONOMIC SUICIDE! :facepalm1:

[devo_stevo]

Not quite. That 108,501 number is the number of people that have been tested. The number of positives from that is 4,672 with 46 deaths reported.

So that's 4.3% positives from those that are tested, with a death rate of 0.1%.

Either way, it's looking pretty good here in the beehive state.
https://coronavirus.utah.gov/case-counts/

[rockgremlin]

I've always thought that the percentages that are thrown around are way too high anyways, because they're not taking into account the hundreds, if not thousands of people who got the virus and never knew they had it.

[oldno7]

I believe the more accurate and meaningful number would be deaths to total population.

ie. what are any individuals odds of dying in Utah from the commie cold.

[Iceaxe]

Not to mention nearly all death's were folks not long for this world anyway.

This lock down is the dumbest and most stupid event I have witnessed I my lifetime.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200501/6220af927049cbe4c14704f2677d78c6.jpg

[Sombeech]

If Trump continues to show is true colors with this crisis I doubt he wins the election.

Respectfully, if Biden remains to be the competition, Trump could go to the Bahamas until November and still win. Joe Biden is having some real trouble. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a plot to label him unfit to be the candidate, or he dies, or becomes mentally ill, and they have to bring in the "backup plan". It wouldn't surprise me at all if that was the plan all along.

I mean, Biden, really, there is no way he has a chance. The only way people will vote for him is because they hate Trump so bad. It won't be because of Biden's accomplishments.

[twotimer]

Biden is it, or more appropriately, his VP candidate is it. They're down to the emergency chute...and it's gonna fail.

Biden is burnt toast. We don't know who's actually running against Trump yet. A lot of talk about Michelle Obama "saving the day"...but I don't think she wants to get her ass kicked, either.

Personally, I'm just looking forward to Trump unleashing hell for the next four years. He's gonna kick them while they're down. Make 'em pay. I know that sounds "not nice" but they certainly deserve it. Kill 'em all.

Bernie, gone. Warren, gone. Soon Biden, too. Then Pelosi. Who's gonna be left standing to represent these clowns?

[accadacca]

A friend posted this on Facebook.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200501/4142f94fce2cc1085cb8a3b664b9a51e.jpg

[Iceaxe]

Am I the only one noticing that it's many of the liberal strongholds (sanctuary cities) that are getting hammered by the Chinese Virus?

Coincidence? I think not...

[rockgremlin]

A friend posted this on Facebook.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200501/4142f94fce2cc1085cb8a3b664b9a51e.jpg

But...but...but... They keep telling us "this is NOT just a nasty strain of the flu!"

You know, I think they're right. This ISN'T a nasty strain of the flu... it's a softer, weaker version of the flu. But just with much better marketing.

[oldno7]

So how many death certificates labeled covid-19 are in reality the flu?:ne_nau:

Seems everyone including fauci were saying this year was going to be a very bad flu year, prior to the commie cold hitting us.

[accadacca]

Another friend posted this one and she got it from the CDC website.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200501/2e22e522b8832841149f8386ff1a849b.jpg

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/health_policy/Provisional-Death-Counts-COVID-19-Pneumonia-and-Influenza.pdf

[blueeyes]

But...but...but... They keep telling us "this is NOT just a nasty strain of the flu!"

You know, I think they're right. This ISN'T a nasty strain of the flu... it's a softer, weaker version of the flu. But just with much better marketing.
So back when this all started I said I didn't think SARS-CoV-2 would kill as many as Flu based on what CDC reported for the flu. Which is an estimate. What I didn't realize is how inflated that estimate is.

Some information to ponder.

A few paragraphs from an article I read this morning written by a doctor.



When reports about the novel coronavirus SARS-CoV-2 began circulating earlier this year and questions were being raised about how the illness it causes, COVID-19, compared to the flu, it occurred to me that, in four years of emergency medicine residency and over three and a half years as an attending physician, I had almost never seen anyone die of the flu. I could only remember one tragic pediatric case.

Based on the CDC numbers though, I should have seen many, many more. In 2018, over 46,000 Americans*died from opioid overdoses. Over 36,500*died in traffic accidents. Nearly 40,000*died from gun violence. I see those deaths all the time. Was I alone in noticing this discrepancy?

The 25,000 to 69,000 numbers that Trump cited do not represent counted flu deaths per year; they are*estimates*that the CDC*produces*by multiplying the number of flu death counts reported by various coefficients produced through complicated algorithms. These coefficients are based on assumptions of how many cases, hospitalizations, and deaths they believe went unreported. In the last six flu seasons, the CDC’s reported number of actual confirmed flu deaths—that is, counting flu deaths the way we are currently counting deaths from the coronavirus—has ranged from 3,448 to 15,620, which far lower than the numbers commonly repeated by public officials and even public health experts.

The question remains. Can we accurately compare the toll of the flu to the toll of the coronavirus pandemic?

To do this, we have to compare counted deaths to counted deaths, not counted deaths to wildly inflated statistical estimates. If we compare, for instance, the number of people who died in the United States from COVID-19 in the second full week of April to the number of people who died from influenza during the worst week of the past seven flu seasons (as reported to the CDC), we find that the novel coronavirus killed between 9.5 and 44 times more people than seasonal flu. In other words, the coronavirus is not anything like the flu: It is much, much worse.



The link in case you want to read the entire article.

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/comparing-covid-19-deaths-to-flu-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[blueeyes]

Respectfully, if Biden remains to be the competition, Trump could go to the Bahamas until November and still win. Joe Biden is having some real trouble. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a plot to label him unfit to be the candidate, or he dies, or becomes mentally ill, and they have to bring in the "backup plan". It wouldn't surprise me at all if that was the plan all along.

I mean, Biden, really, there is no way he has a chance. The only way people will vote for him is because they hate Trump so bad. It won't be because of Biden's accomplishments.Maybe with a "little tiny" luck both parties will have to come up with a back up plan. You know both of their current candidates are pretty ancient.

I know it is a pipe dream. But one could hope there is a higher purpose to this pandemic.




Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[oldno7]

Mayors taking action

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/152525/47d65da09f66a972370bc56616365327e41da9ad-1395559.JPG

[oldno7]

Good for thee--not for me


Michelle Obama Asks DC Residents to ‘Stay Home’ While Barack Goes Golfing
Former First Lady Michelle Obama and former President Barack Obama do not appear to be on the same page regarding Washington, DC’s stay-at-home orders.
Michelle Obama recorded a message for Washington, DC, residents, urging Americans to stay home, even though her husband went golfing in Virginia two days earlier.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/04/30/michelle-obama-asks-dc-residents-to-stay-home-while-barack-goes-golfing/

[Sombeech]

Surprising admission from Yahoo, hydroxychloroquine has 90% effectiveness

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/hydroxychloroquine-90-percent-chance-helping-155637974.html

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[Sombeech]

CALLED IT ....and CDC is quietly admitting it, the real COVID deaths, and then the COVID "OR" Flu "OR" Pneumonia

As of 2 weeks ago, only 11,356 from COVID

vs

54,217 from EITHER Flu, Pneumonia OR COVID

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/health_policy/Provisional-Death-Counts-COVID-19-Pneumonia-and-Influenza.pdf

94645

[accadacca]

Another thought from a friend...

For people who think the lock down is working.
Current cures for Corona virus: None
Current population of Utah 3.2 million people.
At the current rate of infection in Utah 180 per day it will take 1,777 weeks get over this pandemic.
We are on week 7.

[jman]

Another thought from a friend...

For people who think the lock down is working.
Current cures for Corona virus: None
Current population of Utah 3.2 million people.
At the current rate of infection in Utah 180 per day it will take 1,777 weeks get over this pandemic.
We are on week 7.


He isn’t wrong on the numbers...but...

The current infection rate is BECAUSE we are social distancing and cleaning 1000000x/day.

That’s the whole purpose of social distancing.

That’s only a sliver of the puzzle too. The big picture is limiting numbers so that our EMS environment isn’t flooded all at once. That’s all it’s ever been about.

Since this is new for everyone in a way, guess we will find out in the coming year of all the lessons learned.

It’s kind of crazy to think that we are learning together about this and people are already polarizing the issue and are already shaming those who (because obviously they have the only truth) believe this or that way. [emoji15]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Sombeech]

As per the "cure" to COVID, has anybody asked HOW IN THE WORLD Trump could know about HCQ - HydroxyChloroquine (with Zinc) so early on?

[blueeyes]

Another thought from a friend...

For people who think the lock down is working.
Current cures for Corona virus: None
Current population of Utah 3.2 million people.
At the current rate of infection in Utah 180 per day it will take 1,777 weeks get over this pandemic.
We are on week 7.
[emoji15]

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[rockgremlin]

The current infection rate is BECAUSE we are social distancing and cleaning 1000000x/day.

That’s the whole purpose of social distancing.


OK but...nobody is recommending that we do away with social distancing. I just want to see this country get back to work again.

How is it that our economy is being held hostage by a virus that statistically is less lethal than the common flu that goes around every year? Why can't we just social distance and go back to work? Why do we need to force everyone into quarantine and grind the economy to a halt? Have you ever read the Grapes of Wrath?

I keep asking folks who oppose restarting the economy when they think it would be safe to stop the lockdown and I haven't been given a straight answer yet. It's almost as if they don't want to ever commit to a stoppage of the lockdown until every case of Covid has been eradicated. But that is an utterly irrational and nonsensical mind set. Covid is here to stay - at this point we have to adapt to it and work around it because hiding from it forever will never work.

[Iceaxe]

Covid is here to stay - at this point we have to adapt to it and work around it because hiding from it forever will never work.

Well that's just pure commonsense... logic like that has no place with liberals or on the interwebs.



https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200502/d0e6b35c6b2b35a2203f9cf57537008f.jpg

[twotimer]

I came home from my road trip because my neighbor told me people were working, the grocery stores were stocked up and things seemed "reasonable"...I figured it would be good for me to come home and start working otherwise I'd get behind schedule and then be stuck working my ass off all summer to get caught up. I've had half this summer booked since last fall. I like my work, and I get paid very well but...been there, done that. Those days are over...I'm not going to work that damn hard anymore.

So today a little bomb went off...the stinking piece of shit, loser knucklehead stupid fool mayor of Denver threw down an "Everyone must wear a mask in public" order effective next Wednesday. I haven't put a mask on anywhere and now it appears that you have to wear one when visiting any business or even working outside your house.

That 'ain't gonna friggin' happen. Time for another big road trip. I just got off the phone with a bunch of my customers and told them to expect me...when I show up. Everything is up in the air now.

Hopefully they'll open up the parks in Utah this month. That'll sure be nice.

[oldno7]

Here ya go Byron

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/202_jpg-1386942.JPG

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/205_jpg-1386945.JPG

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/215_jpg-1386955.JPG

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/223_png-1386963.JPG

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/zaabkMcH.jpeg

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/q2nSBviR.jpeg

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/205_jpg-1388272.JPG

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/o0e5iHpP.jpeg

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/214_jpg-1389884.JPG

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/216_jpg-1389888.JPG

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/uGfgKU8o.jpeg

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/220_png-1391972.JPG

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/tkBdnA6T.jpeg

[twotimer]

Here ya go Byron

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/202_jpg-1386942.JPG

Indeed...they tell me to turn left, I'm going right just in spite of them. I booked out of here initially because I didn't want to be in town if they threw up roadblocks...I'm glad that didn't happen but now that they're trying to force me to behave like these freaks driving around with a mask on? No friggin' bueno.

Geez...I came home because it appeared things were starting to loosen up. Instead I come home and 8 out of 10 people are wearing a mask damn near anywhere they are.

Hey, you guys don't mind if I move to Utah, do ya? I can assure you I won't be bringing any butterfly, fairy, liberal "do as I say, not as I do" nonsense with me. Damn near moved to St. George 25 years ago to escape the craziness of So. Cal. but chose Denver instead. Worked out well, and I made a fortune here, but it may be time to say goodbye.

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/461570/Lootie_jpeg-1393158.JPG

[Iceaxe]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/216_jpg-1389888.JPG
I love a good loophole big enough to drive a semitruck through...

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/264818/IMG_1296_jpg-1393508.JPG

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/216_jpg-1393635.JPG

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/217_jpg-1393637.JPG

[oldno7]

https://i.redd.it/0segsmmqdrv41.jpg

[oldno7]

get tired of this crap

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/200_jpg-1395394.JPG

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/210_jpg-1395404.JPG

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/217_jpg-1395413.JPG

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/UtRF53gj.png

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/1Q45vgkN.jpeg

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/459941/671EB7B0-C962-4FED-A1EA-BB1079A1B86C_jpe-1395891.JPG

[Iceaxe]

The strip clubs in Utah are now open... the world is healing itself.

Funny thing is I have a friend that lives literally next door to The Bears Den and she says it's been packed since opening.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200502/e6d1218c9ee32617f498ee0d5b19ea02.jpg

[BasinCruiser]

94649

[BasinCruiser]

Just to add a little more to the conspiracies.

94650

[BasinCruiser]

94655

[blueeyes]

94655Fear of being sued if prisoners died of anything right now. I swear we are the worst society for suing for anything and everything.

Yes. Masks and lockdown....

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[oldno7]

https://66.media.tumblr.com/3ccdcfb152c610b5f308634aa462b1ca/efef0f766573d349-e3/s1280x1920/1e1b3b6d757e25c139db4af7a83947c020f23094.jpg

[BasinCruiser]

Don’t argue with the experts.

94656

[Sombeech]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/459941/671EB7B0-C962-4FED-A1EA-BB1079A1B86C_jpe-1395891.JPG

We all know this is satire, but it's not far from the truth

[oldno7]

Have seen this quite a bit..

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/922/QYm7GK.jpg

[oldno7]

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/923/ZFQkwk.jpg

[BasinCruiser]

We all know this is satire, but it's not far from the truth

Not far? it is the truth. It's sad when a satire page is correct more often than the majority of the MSM.

I've often commented that i liked it better when the Babylon made up stories poking fun at society rather than writing the truth that it does today.

[rockgremlin]

Don’t argue with the experts.

94656

Well, thanks for this little tidbit of truth that I will now proclaim loudly and frequently to everyone within earshot. :2thumbs:



I believe the basic gist of this post was the reason why the CDC officially came out very early on and proclaimed that facemasks were useless and claimed they would not be very effective. I remember this distinctly because I got into a tepid discussion with my wife about this issue after she was going to volunteer to make masks. I told her not to because the CDC had recommended against it.

So why the sudden shift in narrative? When did that take place, and why? :ne_nau:

[twotimer]

So why the sudden shift in narrative? When did that take place, and why? :ne_nau:I think it's because it makes people feel better. Like a placebo effect.

Also, those that are troubled, angry, disgusted or otherwise bothered by "other people's behavior" tend to make the most noise. Those that don't bother with the whole facemask thing aren't saying much...but those that think EVERYONE should be wearing one are calling and emailing the politicians. Squeaky wheels get the grease.

[accadacca]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200503/a4968dee4d87458ba231f927292d5191.jpg

[oldno7]

https://i1.wp.com/www.powerlineblog.com/ed-assets/2020/05/Untitled-copy-14.jpg?resize=374%2C564&ssl=1

[oldno7]

https://i1.wp.com/www.powerlineblog.com/ed-assets/2020/05/IMG_2902.jpeg?resize=578%2C600&ssl=1

[oldno7]

Subject: A crucial Chess Game
READ & RE-READ/ BILL O'REILLY ON CHINA.

Written by Bill O'Reilly

China’s Bio weapon, and Pelosi.. My wife Angie will tell you that I study history and world events fluently every day. I have studied China for many years. To get answers I need to questions, I call many I know in Washington on Capitol Hill (from my tenure on two Presidential campaigns and Presidential talks) and I ask them for straight up answers to better understand what affects us as a nation.

Well, in 2016 America elected a new Sheriff: Donald J Trump. For decades the Chinese walked all over America but the new President said “not anymore”. Trump literally strangled China’s economy to the point their economy was in its worst free fall ever. Trump negotiated a new 50 billion trade agreement. He had Xi by the proverbial balls. America’s economy was on fire and unstoppable. President Xi Jingping knew he could not beat the USA militarily and he knew any domesticated economic attack would fail as our economy was too strong. He had to act. But how?

Enter the USA democrats led by Pelosi and Schiff. Impeachment. A hoax. A distraction for our people and President. Xi Jingping and his thugs see this. They aren’t stupid. They have very intelligent intellectual thinkers in their government. Now you must understand , the Chinese regime are truly Barbarians. Notice I did not say ALL CHINESE. The Chinese people are a good people. I enjoy my interactions with them.

The communist regime has millions of its own citizens slaving in gulags simply for speaking against the government or openly practicing Christianity. Knowing they could not attack us openly they needed to be coy, like a deceptive fox. In my opinion, I believe the regime released a biological weapon upon the world that doesn’t kill everyone, but kills “enough,” especially the elderly and in-firmed. Back in WW 2 Hitler thought the same way. He got rid of what he considered the useless and rejects of society.

Trumps task force uses models to figure things. Xi used and uses “models” too. China's president figured that if he killed a few of his own (a few hundred thousand to them would be a few out of 1.4 billion people) and spread the virus to other nations (especially to the USA) they would “level the economic playing field” and not have fired a shot.

Losses of his own people were acceptable costs of a new war. When China’s own doctors attempted to sound the warning, they were immediately silenced. In fact one died and another has simply disappeared. Trump and the other allied leaders indeed KNOW this is what happened. They have under reported their own deaths. Trump knows he cannot outrightly seek retribution. His news conference today showed me this when he balked publicly about no outright retribution over Xi’s handling of this and he immediately brought up the “trade deal”. However, Trump wasn’t being weak, he too was now being coy. We know this was a biological weapon. The food market story is bullshit.

Xi knows we know it. Trump also today announced he sent two battle groups of destroyers and other ships to sea several days ago to fight drugs and rogue actors like Iran should they try anything.

I say he did this to show Xi he knows what has transpired (we have the greatest intelligence assets) and that they (the Chinese) should rethink further action. Politics is premier. We cannot overtly attack China for what they have done as we would also suffer greatly. We all know this.

But China has temporarily achieved its goal. America was literally consumed by Trumps phony impeachment brought by the ultra left democrats (supported by democrat rank and file and one Republican Mitt Romney) and Xi Jingping saw an opening. He took it. Xi did what Trump usually does...he walked onto the world stage and threw a grenade into the “room” and left. It exploded in the form of this worldwide pandemic. It brought the USA and the rest of the world to its knees and leveled the economic playing field.

Our economy is now near depression. Xi didn’t fire one bullet. Trump needed to up his game of chess and putting our Naval ships to sea was his next move. He said he is a “war” President. He is.

But now on not one but two fronts. One front is the virus and the other front is the Chinese. While the Saudi’s and Russians are screwing with oil prices they aren’t overtly doing what this pandemic is doing. The drug smuggling story for dispatching the Naval Force is bullshit and the world knows it. I am of the opinion Trump can indeed bring us back from this catastrophe albeit with a changed playing field.

But Trump is a genius in chess and financial matters. He’s become a champ at international politics too. I am sure Trump can once again lead the economy to even stronger strength and greatness the it was . He can do it quickly I’m sure of it. He has proved it. Xi Jingping needs to be sent a message loud and clear. NEVER AGAIN. We need to bring all of our critical manufacturing back from China beginning with our medicines they were recently threatening to withhold. We can do it immediately. Again, another reason for Trump putting to sea such a sizable Naval Force. Sending a clear message.

We all must ride out the next few weeks. Then we and the world pick up the pieces and move on. The democrats who have given Xi this opening wrapped in a bow must pay a heavy price in November as they (the democrats) truly have cost and continue to cost America precious lives by the phony scandals. Nancy Pelosi continues to help the Chinese by her daily shameless attacks upon the President and meddling in stimulus packages as she did this last weekend. Yesterday’s statements she made were truly appalling and the lowest of low. I didn’t think she could go any lower. What a disgrace she is to our nation.

But, Pelosi aside, make no mistake, China must and will be taught a lesson the likes they have never seen before and Trump is the man to pull the trigger.

We the people must teach the democrats the same lesson at the polls. They (the radical wing of the party) are the enemy of a free America. I am certain of it. The entire democrat party of our forefathers is dead. Remember people, Trump indeed tried to warn us all of the Conavirus in his State of the Union Speech. He spoke of it. He said he was on top of it.

After he spoke , Nancy Pelosi ripped up the speech calling Trumps words “a manifesto of lies”. She disgraced the country and all of our fellow honored citizens present in the House Chamber. Well she now has American blood on her hands. She is very majorly responsible for these needless deaths as well as the Chinese. Her and Adam Schiff.

The left and democrats laughed as she tore up his speech. Well, as they laughed the disease he just spoke of in that speech came to our shores. Republicans and Democrats alike are now dying. Your family members and mine. Our grandparents and middle aged citizens alike. Bodies are being loaded in trucks with forklifts in Brooklyn outside of hospitals. No one is safe. Our liberty is for the most part suspended. As we bury our dead (without proper funerals) from this calamity let’s drive the nails into the coffin of the Democrat party as well in November.

It’s time people. Stand up for your rights and your country! Our Liberty and survival is at stake! I am praying for God’s blessing on our nation. But, God also gave us the ability to think for ourselves and it’s time we placed blame for all this death where it belongs: on the doorsteps of Nancy Pelosi, Adam Schiff and Xi Jingping directly. Wake Up America. WAKE UP!

Written by: Bill O'Reilly

[Iceaxe]

^^^I've seen that posted before... but I can find nothing that proves it was really posted by Bill O'Reilly.

So unless someone can point me to a realiable source take it with a giant grain of salt.

[oldno7]

Not to sure on O'reilly either but it really doesn't matter

[accadacca]

Vaccination Activists Are Growing Force at Virus Protests

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200503/150afb4639ef814f1185d8de135f58ec.jpg

“One of the things that we’re finding is that the rhetoric is pretty similar between the anti-vaxxers and those demanding to reopen,” said Dr. Rupali J. Limaye, who studies behavior around vaccines at Johns Hopkins University. “What we hear a lot of is ‘individual self management’ — this idea that they should be in control of making decisions, that they can decide what science is correct and incorrect, and that they know what’s best for their child.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/02/us/anti-vaxxers-coronavirus-protests.html?smid=fb-share

[BasinCruiser]

Well, thanks for this little tidbit of truth that I will now proclaim loudly and frequently to everyone within earshot. :2thumbs:



I believe the basic gist of this post was the reason why the CDC officially came out very early on and proclaimed that facemasks were useless and claimed they would not be very effective. I remember this distinctly because I got into a tepid discussion with my wife about this issue after she was going to volunteer to make masks. I told her not to because the CDC had recommended against it.

So why the sudden shift in narrative? When did that take place, and why? :ne_nau:

What hasn’t the WHO/CDC changed its position on the last few months? Mask wearing, human to human transfer, lockdown (China) vs open society (Sweden). Funny how consistent and reliable ‘science’ can be if it can be used to manipulate and control the everyday actions literally millions of people.

[rockgremlin]

Vaccination Activists Are Growing Force at Virus Protests

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200503/150afb4639ef814f1185d8de135f58ec.jpg




My man with the gauged ears shamelessly copping a feel. :lol8:

[twotimer]

My man with the gauged ears shamelessly copping a feel. :lol8:Yeah, no kidding. Poor gals, no wonder so many are pissed off...look what they gotta put up with. Dudes get close enough to grab some tittie and they do. Reminds me of 8th grade...

Speaking of...if that cute Mexican chick in the back of the bus ever comes out with what I did my reputation (as it is) would be toast.

[twotimer]

^^^I've seen that posted before... but I can find nothing that proves it was really posted by Bill O'Reilly.

So unless someone can point me to a realiable source take it with a giant grain of salt.You posted it yourself about 20 pages back.

I agree with this with the exception of the Dems being involved. I reckon China did this all on their own...the Dems are too dimwitted to pull this off. Besides, I don't think there would be enough of them in the "loop" that would go along with being cold blooded killers. Those Chinese on the other hand, they don't give a rat's ass about anybody. They'd slaughter the last living (whatever) if its bone soup gave 'em a good hard on.

The Dem politicians and their media comrades milking the chaos for all it worth to degrade Trump in any way...oh yeah.

[blueeyes]

You posted it yourself about 20 pages back.

I agree with this with the exception of the Dems being involved. I reckon China did this all on their own...the Dems are too dimwitted to pull this off. Besides, I don't think there would be enough of them in the "loop" that would go along with being cold blooded killers. Those Chinese on the other hand, they don't give a rat's ass about anybody. They'd slaughter the last living (whatever) if its bone soup gave 'em a good hard on.

The Dem politicians and their media comrades milking the chaos for all it worth to degrade Trump in any way...oh yeah.

I do not believe that for one second. Have you ever been to China? The citizens are very gracious. I have been and it was a most humbling experience. Real easy to sit over here and lay blame on an entire population when you have zero connections.



Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[BasinCruiser]

I do not believe that for one second. Have you ever been to China? The citizens are very gracious. I have been and it was a most humbling experience. Real easy to sit over here and lay blame on an entire population when you have zero connections.



Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

I believe he’s referring to the CCP, not the Chinese citizens.

[twotimer]

I do not believe that for one second. Have you ever been to China? The citizens are very gracious. I have been and it was a most humbling experience. Real easy to sit over here and lay blame on an entire population when you have zero connections.



Sent from my SM-G975U using TapatalkWith all due respect, you sound like a typical liberal throwing a wet blanket over the whole damn thing.

You know the problem with stereotypes? They don't apply to everybody. I'm hardly talking about every single human being that lives in China...their government however, is ruthless and cruel. Tiananmen Square, anyone? Not to mention their obsession with rare and endangered animal parts. Are you familiar with that? If not, look it up.

Now if I really wanted to be racist I'd call them all dog eating yellow chinks...but I certainly didn't say that, now did I?

[Iceaxe]

You posted it yourself about 20 pages back.

Yup.... I started to research it after I posted it and that's why I think it's bullshit... I could find no proof it came from Bill O'Reilly.

I posted a disclaimer in the other places I posted it... I guess I missed this forum, sorry about that...

[blueeyes]

With all due respect, you sound like a typical liberal throwing a wet blanket over the whole damn thing.

You know the problem with stereotypes? They don't apply to everybody. I'm hardly talking about every single human being that lives in China...their government however, is ruthless and cruel. Tiananmen Square, anyone? Not to mention their obsession with rare and endangered animal parts. Are you familiar with that? If not, look it up.

Now if I really wanted to be racist I'd call them all dog eating yellow chinks...but I certainly didn't say that, now did I?

Sure I am your typical liberal...whenever someone doesn't buy into the crap some of you spout the first thing you throw out is you must be a liberal. Speaking of stereotypes. Whatever...

And with absolutely no respect you sound like the typical racist privileged male prick.

Yes I am familiar with their culture and using rare or endangered animal parts. Wording the way you do as you bring that up confirms to me your racist tendencies and lack of understanding as to where this virus came from.

Here is a hint....

They. Don't. Know. There is no proof it came from a Chinese person consuming rare animal parts. Or from the Wuhan market.

There are only hypotheses at this point. It has been proven there were earlier cases of COVID-19 then the cases they originally tracked to the Wuhan market. With the market being a major place people buy food, there is good chance it was simply spread from person to person at the market.

I think I will call you a pork bovine eating cracker. Is that a bad thing? Naw... but the practice of some Chinese eating dogs is no more repulsive than you or I eating pigs and cows depending on what culture you are from.









Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[erial]

from Bush Baby the Raccoon facebook page which also advises that CORONA rearranged spells RACOON

94662

[Iceaxe]

Sure I am your typical liberal...whenever someone doesn't buy into the crap some of you spout the first thing you throw out is you must be a liberal. Speaking of stereotypes. Whatever...

And with absolutely no respect you sound like the typical racist privileged male prick.

Yes I am familiar with their culture and using rare or endangered animal parts. Wording the way you do as you bring that up confirms to me your racist tendencies and lack of understanding as to where this virus came from.

Here is a hint....

They. Don't. Know. There is no proof it came from a Chinese person consuming rare animal parts. Or from the Wuhan market.

There are only hypotheses at this point. It has been proven there were earlier cases of COVID-19 then the cases they originally tracked to the Wuhan market. With the market being a major place people buy food, there is good chance it was simply spread from person to person at the market.

I think I will call you a pork bovine eating cracker. Is that a bad thing? Naw... but the practice of some Chinese eating dogs is no more repulsive than you or I eating pigs and cows depending on what culture you are from.









Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
I don't know if you're a liberal or not... but I can 100% guarentee you that you're not a conservative if that makes you feel any better...



https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200504/35780155f951239d7f9eba2c858c922b.jpg

[blueeyes]

I don't know if you're a liberal or not... but I can 100% guarentee you that you're not a conservative if that makes you feel any better...



https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200504/35780155f951239d7f9eba2c858c922b.jpgI think a better statement is that I am not 100% conservative.



Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[twotimer]

Sure I am your typical liberal...whenever someone doesn't buy into the crap some of you spout the first thing you throw out is you must be a liberal. Speaking of stereotypes. Whatever...

And with absolutely no respect you sound like the typical racist privileged male prick.

Yes I am familiar with their culture and using rare or endangered animal parts. Wording the way you do as you bring that up confirms to me your racist tendencies and lack of understanding as to where this virus came from.

I think I will call you a pork bovine eating cracker. Is that a bad thing? Naw... but the practice of some Chinese eating dogs is no more repulsive than you or I eating pigs and cows depending on what culture you are from.

Sent from my SM-G975U using TapatalkWhen I posted that, I thought "She's either gonna have a good laugh or get all bent"...I figured it 50/50 and it looks like you got triggered pretty good. Words can start wars, huh? Funny thing is, if you were standing next to me I would have said the same thing. Calmly and with a smile, of course.

So I reckon ever hooking up for a bike ride is out of the question?

I was hoping the "wet blanket" thing wouldn't go over your head. It's analogous to what liberals tend to do...using a sledgehammer when a finishing hammer will do. Know what I mean? Overkill.

"Typical racist male privileged prick"...yep, you got me. Yet at the same time, I'm proudly generous, considerate and loyal to those I trust. What a combo, huh?

I'm Italian, so if you want to dig for a sore spot, try something along these lines for starters...columbus-day-italian-american-racism.html (https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/10/12/opinion/columbus-day-italian-american-racism.html)

The pork, bovine eating cracker isn't going to cut it, honey.

TBH...I don't want to fight or argue with you, or anyone else for that matter. If things that I write are so objectionable, then use the ignore feature.

[Iceaxe]

I think a better statement is that I am not 100% conservative.

Nothing wrong with that :-)

[blueeyes]

When I posted that, I thought "She's either gonna have a good laugh or get all bent"...I figured it 50/50 and it looks like you got triggered pretty good. Words can start wars, huh? Funny thing is, if you were standing next to me I would have said the same thing. Calmly and with a smile, of course.

So I reckon ever hooking up for a bike ride is out of the question?

I was hoping the "wet blanket" thing wouldn't go over your head. It's analogous to what liberals tend to do...using a sledgehammer when a finishing hammer will do. Know what I mean? Overkill.

"Typical racist male privileged prick"...yep, you got me. Yet at the same time, I'm proudly generous, considerate and loyal to those I trust. What a combo, huh?

I'm Italian, so if you want to dig for a sore spot, try something along these lines for starters...columbus-day-italian-american-racism.html (https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/10/12/opinion/columbus-day-italian-american-racism.html)

The pork, bovine eating cracker isn't going to cut it, honey.

TBH...I don't want to fight or argue with you, or anyone else for that matter. I things that I write are so objectionable, then use the ignore feature.

I wouldn't turn down an invite to ride bike with anyone including you. I am far from bent out of shape over this topic. But probably out of shape to keep up on a bike.

I am discussing maybe had one two many beers tonight. I will take back the prick statement. I was being a bit trollish.




Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[twotimer]

It's alright Blueeyes, I'm not offended at all. I'm well aware that my crass personality can sometimes be a bit heavy. But I like it that way.

If you knew me, you'd understand. I never mean harm.

I became friends with a guy that used to frequent this forum. We did a lot of canyons together. Soon after getting to know me, he said "You know Byron, I used to think a lot of stuff you posted was pure bullshit, but now I know...you're just a jokester".

My apologies for being so crass. I'll go easy on the Chinese from now on...but don't hold it against me if I slip up now and then. Sometimes I can't help myself.

[Iceaxe]

This....https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200504/d8609d39a7045c648fbaa809cf5bda0b.jpg

[BasinCruiser]

Well, thanks for this little tidbit of truth that I will now proclaim loudly and frequently to everyone within earshot. :2thumbs:



I believe the basic gist of this post was the reason why the CDC officially came out very early on and proclaimed that facemasks were useless and claimed they would not be very effective. I remember this distinctly because I got into a tepid discussion with my wife about this issue after she was going to volunteer to make masks. I told her not to because the CDC had recommended against it.

So why the sudden shift in narrative? When did that take place, and why? :ne_nau:

Do you mean this proclamation?

https://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/article/960679?fbclid=IwAR2vTQImvzQflIVc3RAZkNMOzTrBPQ-YqrsG0741rmu7AcTQOGW3EyNIYeg&section=us&keywords=surgeon-general-adams-masks&year=2020&month=03&date=31&id=960679&oref=m.facebook.com

[oldno7]

So why is the CDC only reporting 37,308 deaths as of May 1?:ne_nau:

I know there is a lag but--look at the flu--5846.

This was supposed to be a terrible flu season, prior to covid-19

Data as of May 1, 2020

Week ending date in which the death occurred
COVID-19 Deaths (U07.1)1
Deaths from All Causes
Percent of Expected Deaths2
Pneumonia Deaths
(J12.0–J18.9)3
Deaths with Pneumonia and COVID-19
(J12.0–J18.9 and U07.1)3
Influenza Deaths
(J09–J11)4
Deaths with Pneumonia, Influenza, or COVID-19
U07.1 or J09–J18.9)5


Total Deaths
37,308
719,438
97
64,382
16,564
5,846
90,165


2/1/2020
0
57,266
97
3,688
0
469
4,157


2/8/2020
1
57,615
97
3,672
0
494
4,167


2/15/2020
0
56,878
97
3,693
0
517
4,210


2/22/2020
0
56,806
98
3,557
0
536
4,093


2/29/2020
5
56,843
99
3,626
3
619
4,247


3/7/2020
25
56,212
97
3,719
14
583
4,312


3/14/2020
49
53,968
95
3,676
25
578
4,277


3/21/2020
493
53,979
95
4,150
226
496
4,907


3/28/2020
2,712
57,430
103
5,624
1,235
410
7,463


4/4/2020
8,082
64,313
115
8,724
3,875
432
13,148


4/11/2020
12,262
66,577
120
9,841
5,468
430
16,744


4/18/2020
10,408
55,062
101
7,606
4,402
215
13,663


4/25/2020
3,271
26,489
49
2,806
1,316
67
4,777





https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/index.htm

[blueeyes]

So why is the CDC only reporting 37,308 deaths as of May 1?:ne_nau:

I know there is a lag but--look at the flu--5846.

This was supposed to be a terrible flu season, prior to covid-19

Data as of May 1, 2020

Week ending date in which the death occurred
COVID-19 Deaths (U07.1)1
Deaths from All Causes
Percent of Expected Deaths2
Pneumonia Deaths
(J12.0–J18.9)3
Deaths with Pneumonia and COVID-19
(J12.0–J18.9 and U07.1)3
Influenza Deaths
(J09–J11)4
Deaths with Pneumonia, Influenza, or COVID-19
U07.1 or J09–J18.9)5


Total Deaths
37,308
719,438
97
64,382
16,564
5,846
90,165


2/1/2020
0
57,266
97
3,688
0
469
4,157


2/8/2020
1
57,615
97
3,672
0
494
4,167


2/15/2020
0
56,878
97
3,693
0
517
4,210


2/22/2020
0
56,806
98
3,557
0
536
4,093


2/29/2020
5
56,843
99
3,626
3
619
4,247


3/7/2020
25
56,212
97
3,719
14
583
4,312


3/14/2020
49
53,968
95
3,676
25
578
4,277


3/21/2020
493
53,979
95
4,150
226
496
4,907


3/28/2020
2,712
57,430
103
5,624
1,235
410
7,463


4/4/2020
8,082
64,313
115
8,724
3,875
432
13,148


4/11/2020
12,262
66,577
120
9,841
5,468
430
16,744


4/18/2020
10,408
55,062
101
7,606
4,402
215
13,663


4/25/2020
3,271
26,489
49
2,806
1,316
67
4,777





https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/index.htmThat page explains why the numbers don't match on the same page the numbers are listed.

*Data during this period are incomplete because of the lag in time between when the death occurred and when the death certificate is completed, submitted to NCHS and processed for reporting purposes. This delay can range from 1 week to 8 weeks or more, depending on the jurisdiction, age, and cause of death.

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[oldno7]

That page explains why the numbers don't match on the same page the numbers are listed.

*Data during this period are incomplete because of the lag in time between when the death occurred and when the death certificate is completed, submitted to NCHS and processed for reporting purposes. This delay can range from 1 week to 8 weeks or more, depending on the jurisdiction, age, and cause of death.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Right--so my point is--The flu number is 5846, in what was supposed to be the worst flu season in years.

The average is what--35,000-65,000

So the flu numbers are 5846 and the flu season is winding down?

These are china type numbers..

[oldno7]

(CNN)This flu season is shaping up to be one of the worst in decades, according to the United States' top infectious disease doctor.
Mon January 6, 2020
Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, said while it's impossible to predict how the flu will play out, the season so far is on track to be as severe as the 2017-2018 flu season, which was the deadliest (https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/26/health/flu-deaths-2017--2018-cdc-bn/index.html)in more than four decades, according to the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
"The initial indicators indicate this is not going to be a good season -- this is going to be a bad season," Fauci said.


https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/03/health/flu-week-52/index.html

[BasinCruiser]

:roflol::haha::bootyshake:

94667

https://genesiustimes.com/newsom-reminds-californians-to-only-go-outside-to-defecate-on-the-sidewalk/

[blueeyes]

Right--so my point is--The flu number is 5846, in what was supposed to be the worst flu season in years.

The average is what--35,000-65,000

So the flu numbers are 5846 and the flu season is winding down?

These are china type numbers..

On my phone that all looked like a jumbled mess including your beginning statement was lost in that mess. I hoped on the laptop and see everything now.

I posted an article a couple posts back that talked about the estimated numbers of flu vs actual cases.

Here are 2 links to CDCs answer for this.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/faq.htm


https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/how-cdc-estimates.htm

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[BasinCruiser]

The ultimate troll in chief strikes again.


94668

[devo_stevo]

Ha.

I gotta say, reading the facebook comments on the KSL stories this weekend about the mass of people showing up at Sand Hollow State Park this weekend, and xenophobia is so hot right now.

It's unbelievable how many people want to keep everyone but the locals out of there town. Most don't even want you there is you're from anywhere but Washington County. Don't even think of coming from Nevada. You're dirty and unworthy.

[Sombeech]

(CNN)This flu season is shaping up to be one of the worst in decades, according to the United States' top infectious disease doctor.
Mon January 6, 2020
Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, said while it's impossible to predict how the flu will play out, the season so far is on track to be as severe as the 2017-2018 flu season, which was the deadliest (https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/26/health/flu-deaths-2017--2018-cdc-bn/index.html)in more than four decades, according to the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
"The initial indicators indicate this is not going to be a good season -- this is going to be a bad season," Fauci said.


https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/03/health/flu-week-52/index.html

It's a MIRACLE, this season has turned out to be the lightest and safest Flu season EVER recorded in recent history. It's just weird that the numbers are so low this time. Weird.

[Iceaxe]

Ha.

I gotta say, reading the facebook comments on the KSL stories this weekend about the mass of people showing up at Sand Hollow State Park this weekend, and xenophobia is so hot right now.

It's unbelievable how many people want to keep everyone but the locals out of there town. Most don't even want you there is you're from anywhere but Washington County. Don't even think of coming from Nevada. You're dirty and unworthy.

I just spoke with a nurse friend of mine that was down in St. George this weekend and she said social distancing anywhere in town is nearly non-existent. She said it was crazy down there. She was at Sand Hollow and was in before the 10 am shut down. She said if you were in before the close you were golden :-)

[devo_stevo]

I just spoke with a nurse friend of mine that was down in St. George this weekend and she said social distancing anywhere in town is nearly non-existent. She said it was crazy down there. She was at Sand Hollow and was in before the 10 am shut down. She said if you were in before the close you were golden :-)
Yeah, one of the national news channels sent a reporter to Washington City a few weeks ago, and it was hilarious. Basically, it was life as usual. She even had some rednecks hanging out in the parking lot of a grocery store invite her to come party with them. You know, typical Thursday night in small town Utah. Seems strange that people aren't just dropping dead all over down there. I'll try to find a link to that story.

[devo_stevo]

Found it. Funny as heck. She was really looking for some controversy, and boy they found it at the salon. :roflol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHw8E08Tivs

[Iceaxe]

^^^Very eye opening... it seems to be working just great... follow some commonsense instead of devastating the entire economy.

[devo_stevo]

Exactly. I'll also say that life in Brigham City hasn't really been that different for me either other than the kids being home from school and driving my wife nuts. A lot of places simply stayed open and operated as usual with a few changes to things to keep people as safe as they possibly could.

If you look at the case counts for the Bear River health district, which covers Box Elder, Cache, and Rich counties, I think we're up just over 60 positive cases. The one death that is credited to us is a guy from Willard that was serving a mission for the church and died in Wisconsin. I'm not sure why we got the credit for that. He didn't get it here, or die here, so...

I'm so glad that all of the whiners in Salt Lake and Summit County didn't persuade the governor to shut the whole state down. In most places, it's just not needed, and it would have done so much more damage then it needed to.

Also, there is a ton of freedom going on in Cache County. I went o Logan last week, and you'd never know anything was going on over there. People everywhere.

[rockgremlin]

Found it. Funny as heck. She was really looking for some controversy, and boy they found it at the salon. :roflol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHw8E08Tivs


Unbelievable... Almost villainizing Utahns, really.

I'm glad they at least pointed out that even though folks in SW Utah are living life as normal that there are only 35 cases of Covid. Shouldn't that be a telling stat?

I still haven't gotten a straight answer about exactly when would be a good time to lift quarantines country wide? I posed that question last week when Jman was trolling and nobody responded. So I'll ask again. For all you who are cheerleading the efforts to continue shelter-in-place orders further.....so what's the plan? When do you consider it safe to come out from quarantine again? July? November? Next year? Throw me a bone here...

[Iceaxe]

^^^easy question I can answer.

The shelter in place crew wants the ban lifted when Trump is out of office.

[stefan]

Don’t argue with the experts.

94656

this person is talking about the size of the virus itself (and there is evidence it is also airborne as an aerosol on smaller particles)

but a main way the covid is spread it is thought is through respiratory droplets which are bigger. there is evidence that both homemade masks and surgical masks can reduce the spread of microorganisms from an infected person's mouth and nose (surgical masks more).

[devo_stevo]

Unbelievable... Almost villainizing Utahns, really.

I'm glad they at least pointed out that even though folks in SW Utah are living life as normal that there are only 35 cases of Covid. Shouldn't that be a telling stat?

I still haven't gotten a straight answer about exactly when would be a good time to lift quarantines country wide? I posed that question last week when Jman was trolling and nobody responded. So I'll ask again. For all you who are cheerleading the efforts to continue shelter-in-place orders further.....so what's the plan? When do you consider it safe to come out from quarantine again? July? November? Next year? Throw me a bone here...
I'm not sure if they were trying to make us look bad or if they were just genuinely shocked to see so many people that weren't scared for their lives. I took it more as a group of people that were coming from LA, where they are under total lockdown, and can't go to the park without getting arrested or harassed pretty badly to a place where people were just living their lives. I did laugh pretty hard at the dudes in the trucks and mullets inviting here to party with them.Why not, right? She's cute. Take a chance, I guess.

As for when it ends, I'm afraid Ice is right. The goal posts keep moving so much, it's hard to tell, but the one they really want is Trump out of the White House. So whatever it takes to make him look the worst is when this ends.

[rockgremlin]

there is evidence that both homemade masks and surgical masks can reduce the spread of microorganisms from an infected person's mouth and nose (surgical masks more).

But the message in the article you replied to directly contradicts this -- see point #2. A kerchief against the face provides a warm, moist reservoir for bacteria and other virions to produce. Which is I believe one of the points brought out in this article:

https://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/ar...m.facebook.com (https://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/article/960679?fbclid=IwAR2vTQImvzQflIVc3RAZkNMOzTrBPQ-YqrsG0741rmu7AcTQOGW3EyNIYeg&section=us&keywords=surgeon-general-adams-masks&year=2020&month=03&date=31&id=960679&oref=m.facebook.com)

[rockgremlin]

^^^easy question I can answer.

The shelter in place crew wants the ban lifted when Trump is out of office.


Ya but....that would mean that Biden would have to beat Trump. And we all know that ain't gonna happen, so....now what? :ne_nau:

[stefan]

OK--"common practice"?(common to who?)

So in order to keep your wife from getting pregnant,

She is on the pill, that is 90%+ effective

But to help matters along, you wear a condom, that should be 99% effective.(redundancy)

But wait--If we don't have sex, that will be 100% effective.

And if we do all three---that should really work.



ever backed up a rappel?

[twotimer]

ever backed up a rappel?I'd say the thing to do is not to let anyone spew snot all over your face and you're good to go.

Wear a mask everywhere you go as a "backup" against snot spew? Knock yourself out. Heck...why not wear a hazmat suit and goggles? Doesn't the green meanie virus make its way into your eyes, too? What aren't people wearing goggles?

Oh that's right...they're waiting for someone to tell them to put 'em on...then they'll insist everyone should do it. That's it boys and girls...goggles next week.

[rockgremlin]

ever backed up a rappel?


I have backed up a rappel....but never by peer pressure nor by government decree.

[stefan]

But the message in the article you replied to directly contradicts this -- see point #2. A kerchief against the face provides a warm, moist reservoir for bacteria and other virions to produce. Which is I believe one of the points brought out in this article:

https://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/ar...m.facebook.com (https://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/article/960679?fbclid=IwAR2vTQImvzQflIVc3RAZkNMOzTrBPQ-YqrsG0741rmu7AcTQOGW3EyNIYeg&section=us&keywords=surgeon-general-adams-masks&year=2020&month=03&date=31&id=960679&oref=m.facebook.com)

one can clean it or use a new one.

rock, there is a difference between the use of a mask to prevent yourself from becoming infected and using a mask to prevent the transmission by you because you're infected.

if you read the first sentence in the article you posted you would see "Surgeon General Jerome Adams Tuesday doubled down on his advice against healthy people wearing face masks to protect themselves from coronavirus."

what i am referring to is not about the uninfected protecting themselves from becoming infected (which is what your article is about) but rather about the infected transmitting it to the uninfected because they aren't aware they're contagious (since one is contagious before symptoms appear and many are asymptomatic).

[twotimer]

I still haven't gotten a straight answer about exactly when would be a good time to lift quarantines country wide? I posed that question last week when Jman was trolling and nobody responded. So I'll ask again. For all you who are cheerleading the efforts to continue shelter-in-place orders further.....so what's the plan? When do you consider it safe to come out from quarantine again? July? November? Next year? Throw me a bone here...Heck...I thought when this whole thing began in mid March that it would largely be "over" by the end of April...so I'm not even going to venture a guess. Especially in regards to the liberal states and cities. Here in Denver they're going to make everyone wear a mask until the end of May, at least. Also, a couple other suburb cities have done the same thing. Starts on Wednesday.

I can tell you this...I went to the grocery store last evening and Target today and there were a lot of people not wearing them. More than I expected and of those with them on, many had them below their noses or down to their necks...like they're getting tired of having the thing on their face.

But, with that said, in a couple days I'll have no choice but to put something on my face...and it WON'T be a "mask"...I've got bandanas I'll use. I'm going bandito style.

[BasinCruiser]

IOW, people are telling the evil lord dictators:, screw you.


94669

https://reason.com/2020/05/04/lockdown-is-ending-whether-governments-approve-or-not/

[oldno7]

ever backed up a rappel?

Only when I deem it necessary

you make this way to easy..

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/200_jpg-1396854.JPG

[Iceaxe]

ever backed up a rappel?

Yup... but I never tie stopper knots in a swift water rappel....

Gotta use a little commonsense...

[stefan]

But the message in the article you replied to directly contradicts this -- see point #2. A kerchief against the face provides a warm, moist reservoir for bacteria and other virions to produce.

(i meant to add this in my previous post before commenting on the article.)

i'm not so sure about contradicting. it ultimately comes down to what contributes to more or less transmission in practice which isn't simple to just say. and yes people's handling might make a difference. it all depends on how it is more effectively transmitted (which may differ by conditions)

[Iceaxe]

Ya but....that would mean that Biden would have to beat Trump. And we all know that ain't gonna happen, so....now what? :ne_nau:
By creating chaos and crashing the economy the Democrats stand a chance. Two months ago the Democrats were toast and stood a great chance of losing both houses and the Presidency, now who knows, they might lose the presidency but win the Senate.

The real damage being done to the liberal agenda is Trump and the Senate installing conservative judges by the Truck load. Democrats winning the Senate is a real possibility at the moment when it was nothing but a unicorn fart in February.

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/SHSjJl3M.png

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/7WFs19iP.jpeg

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/Y66fET1g.jpeg

[oldno7]

https://i.postimg.cc/m27hNnzt/94557140-1448993245304211-4739494534235291648-n-png.png

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/209_jpg-1398366.JPG

[oldno7]

https://i.maga.host/aH9xDTK.png

[oldno7]

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/48896/219_jpg-1400167.JPG

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/umOLxmL6.jpeg

[oldno7]

https://media.thedonald.win/thedonald/post/I4D2SWdp.png

[jman]

Unbelievable... Almost villainizing Utahns, really.

I'm glad they at least pointed out that even though folks in SW Utah are living life as normal that there are only 35 cases of Covid. Shouldn't that be a telling stat?

I still haven't gotten a straight answer about exactly when would be a good time to lift quarantines country wide? I posed that question last week when Jman was trolling and nobody responded. So I'll ask again. For all you who are cheerleading the efforts to continue shelter-in-place orders further.....so what's the plan? When do you consider it safe to come out from quarantine again? July? November? Next year? Throw me a bone here...

Oh yeah. Sorry about that. Busy working from home (which has been great btw).

Many companies I think were quite reluctant to allow any work from home prior Covid19. But this forced their hand to adapt, amongst other things, and so far we have been told “weeks to months” before they let us back in. And my guess is that the company will realize, “hey, this isn’t so bad having employees work from home. They seem to be more productive, less cubicle space is needed, and employee morale has never been better”. Well, that’s my wishful thinking anyway.

So my company has told us “weeks to months regardless if your state has ‘reopened’ or not”. A month and half and counting so far. My guess is that my work will start allowing DoD customers back in by late May or middle June. Our Salt Lake division has 4000 employees.

My thought is I wonder what culpability would there be on a company that opens up “too early” and people get the virus. Asking for a friend, but if I worked for RockGremlin Inc. as a part-time employee (and didn’t get health insurance as such) and I caught COVID19 from an employee there and I missed a few weeks of work without pay....or whatever...would I able to sue the company for loss of wages, negligence, etc. ?? Good ole’ litigation to the rescue. (Litigation - keeping capitalism in check since the 1950s. [emoji106])


I digress...

To give you a bone, I think late July will the time I’m guessing things will be resuming to the “new normal”. We aren’t going back to how things were before, that’s for sure. Just like post-WW2, post 9-11, etc.

And I think that by next summer, we will be in that “new normal”. But as we haven’t experienced this in a LONG time - the hype, mania and both sides (which is unfortunate), the “this meme is the 100% truth” mob - no one has the answer(s). I sure don’t (and no one does either including the CDC, feds, you, me, and Supreme Leader Trump).

Edit: forgot to add “Supreme Leader Trump” via the new GOP 28th-Amendment to rename the office of president to “supreme leader”.


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[rockgremlin]

^^^LOL I love it when Jman gets going. :lol8:

I hadn't thought about the litigation angle before, and I think you bring up a great point. I think most companies are afraid of the potential consequences of employees seeking damages if they should come down with the Covid while on the clock. Of course, the onus is on the employee to PROVE that they got it at work and not at Maverick or Sand Hollow, but in an environment like this the court of public opinion would likely side with the poor sick employee.

I sincerely hope that we can pull out of this thing before late summer. Every day more and more companies declare Chapter 11 bankruptcy ~~ Gold's Gym being the latest notable casualty. But how many companies need to declare financial mercy before the economy eventually does an encore performance of the 1930's Great Depression? And it's not just the companies that are languishing -- those companies have employees, and those employees have families. The trickle down hurts us all.

[blueeyes]

^^^LOL I love it when Jman gets going. [emoji38]8:

I hadn't thought about the litigation angle before, and I think you bring up a great point. I think most companies are afraid of the potential consequences of employees seeking damages if they should come down with the Covid while on the clock. Of course, the onus is on the employee to PROVE that they got it at work and not at Maverick or Sand Hollow, but in an environment like this the court of public opinion would likely side with the poor sick employee.

I sincerely hope that we can pull out of this thing before late summer. Every day more and more companies declare Chapter 11 bankruptcy ~~ Gold's Gym being the latest notable casualty. But how many companies need to declare financial mercy before the economy eventually does an encore performance of the 1930's Great Depression? And it's not just the companies that are languishing -- those companies have employees, and those employees have families. The trickle down hurts us all.Litigation

Why at the school we won't be going back anytime soon. I don't understand if you get sick from the flu that has been around forever...suing probably is not going to do you any good. But this has business worried about getting sued.

We were asked today to start brainstorming ways we can deliver the hands on portions of our degree through online and limited numbers on campus in a lab.

We will be looking at buying masks to have us and the students use. Maybe even disposable lab coats instead of the cloth ones they currently use and leave on campus until they graduate. We all ready use most PPE but it is sounding like we will be wearing it the entire time we are there not just in the labs.

Say what you want about vaccines but I sincerely hope they come up with one fast and that it is safe. And that immunity lasts longer than 6 seconds. (Sarcasm) Wrapping my head around the "new reality " is not easy.

Anyway still stuck at home working until end of May... I don't like it. If a home office is what I wanted I wouldn't have taken a job working with college students.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[jman]

^^^LOL I love it when Jman gets going. :lol8:

I hadn't thought about the litigation angle before, and I think you bring up a great point. I think most companies are afraid of the potential consequences of employees seeking damages if they should come down with the Covid while on the clock. Of course, the onus is on the employee to PROVE that they got it at work and not at Maverick or Sand Hollow, but in an environment like this the court of public opinion would likely side with the poor sick employee.

I sincerely hope that we can pull out of this thing before late summer. Every day more and more companies declare Chapter 11 bankruptcy ~~ Gold's Gym being the latest notable casualty. But how many companies need to declare financial mercy before the economy eventually does an encore performance of the 1930's Great Depression? And it's not just the companies that are languishing -- those companies have employees, and those employees have families. The trickle down hurts us all.

Completely agree, the economy needs to “open” up. It sucks that some companies (a lot of companies) are taking huge financial hits. But this is capitalism’s strong point - you can be creative find workarounds, etc. IE - Zupas at Farmington Station has no drive-through. However, they have made their parking lot a “drive-through” which has a tent and an employee outside who takes your order and brings it right to you.

Other restaurants aren’t doing that...and maybe for different reasons...but if my business was open and business was crawling I’d do everything in my power to survive, be creative, let customers know of their options, etc.

And if the government forces you down outside of your control...I dunno what I’d do to be honest. However, I do think that every business is different and so an answer to each will be unique.

I mean look at Morris the smoking company and the government and all of its taxes on the end user. Sure, 100% it’s bad and their numbers took a huge hit. So Morris has been investing in diverse markets. Good for them, that’s a smart move. Some companies can’t be a one-trick pony forever.

Back to COVID19 - It has been interesting to get emails from companies that I never get emails from before in the past. They are letting me know their response to Covid, their part in keeping me (customer) safe, and my options if I want to buy their products/services. That’s a very smart business move. There’s a lot of uncertainty out there and having a “uhh..we don’t know what’s going to happen but this is what WE are doing...please come see us when you can” is reassuring to customers.

Anyway, as Governor Herbert Sherbet said, we will crawl, walk, then run when it comes to reopening.

And look at his side, he’s protecting the State’s resources because I guarantee businesses and people will sue over this in loss wages due to the state doing this or that. And what do you when safety of our citizens is the highest priority following by a strong business economy. But this is a first for everyone; so ultimately we don’t know the outcome. And unfortunately, one meme won’t change the world or economy. But...maybe...two memes will!

All I know is that my garden looks fantastic, this been a strong reminder (hopefully for everyone) to put more a little more into savings, and has made me think of a few more long-term goals. IE Pursue a Masters now that my company has changed education policy and FINALLY more colleges are embracing eLearning, propose my girlfriend of almost two years in the coming months (!!), build a small greenhouse in the backyard, run a marathon (I’ve done 9 half’s so far and didn’t have a desire to do a full marathon until a few weeks ago, and looking at buying (so I can rent out) a house either in Washington City, Hurricane or Ivins...oh...and seriously considering getting a dog (like a golden retriever, black lab or an Alaskan malamut.

Edit: sorry for the poor grammar, run-on sentences etc. Mobile typing works but it’s not great. and fighting auto-correct is a chore. And auto-capitalization sucks when you don’t want it. Etc etc etc.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[twotimer]

All I know is that my garden looks fantastic, this been a strong reminder (hopefully for everyone) to put more a little more into savings, and has made me think of a few more long-term goals. IE Pursue a Masters now that my company has changed education policy and FINALLY more colleges are embracing eLearning, propose my girlfriend of almost two years in the coming months (!!), build a small greenhouse in the backyard, run a marathon (I’ve done 9 half’s so far and didn’t have a desire to do a full marathon until a few weeks ago, and looking at buying (so I can rent out) a house either in Washington City, Hurricane or Ivins...oh...and seriously considering getting a dog (like a golden retriever, black lab or an Alaskan malamut.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkOh God!...take it easy there, sport. That's biting off a mighty big chunk! Jesus!

I certainly agree that a LOT of people are going to have big changes occur as a result of this. I see folks out running, biking and generally getting into shape that appear to have not made a habit of it before. Also, I think many more are going to have extra cash stashed. Many of those that were caught flat footed with this will be better prepared if it happens again. Restaurants, especially. I think those businesses that hit the skids were barely hanging on as it was...and if there's any value to them, they'll be sold and restart. I can't help but think this may be a good thing, kinda like a cleaning.

I think commercial property is going to take a hit. Many companies are going to realize they don't need brick and mortar to operate. My neighbor Kim has been working from home and says she's doubts they'll ever go back to the building because the work is being done just as efficiently.

[jman]

Oh God!...take it easy there, sport. That's biting off a mighty big chunk! Jesus!

I certainly agree that a LOT of people are going to have big changes occur as a result of this. I see folks out running, biking and generally getting into shape that appear to have not made a habit of it before. Also, I think many more are going to have extra cash stashed. Many of those that were caught flat footed with this will be better prepared if it happens again. Restaurants, especially. I think those businesses that hit the skids were barely hanging on as it was...and if there's any value to them, they'll be sold and restart. I can't help but think this may be a good thing, kinda like a cleaning.

I think commercial property is going to take a hit. Many companies are going to realize they don't need brick and mortar to operate. My neighbor Kim has been working from home and says she's doubts they'll ever go back to the building because the work is being done just as efficiently.

Hey man, I’m ambitious! And I’m young so...lots of energy and motivation to make it happen. [emoji106]

I agree with your neighbor, why take up real estate when you don’t have to? In a way, it’s a win-win!

Yea, it will be interesting to see how the entertainment sector will adapt.

Movies? Direct to the home user instead of theaters? Maybe but maybe not? theaters would take a huge loss but that’s capitalism for ya.

Eateries? More people are doing the door delivery service. Why get up when you don’t have to?

Exercise? Hopefully more people take it up and eat more healthy, pick up new exercise hobby like jogging, biking, swimming, or even walking around the neighborhood.

Doctors? A lot more going to be virtual. They can get a lot more in (which means more profit) in the same amount of time. In fact, I could see some clinics and hospitals reducing beds and offices to make a transition to more virtual. But I’m sure this has been going on before COVID.

Amusement parks? Not sure. Will we be butts to faces with everyone, like we use to? Not sure. They will reopen but maybe it will be like how Disneyland does it - you just show up at your designated time. And probably many more cleanings, especially baby rides.

In fact I went mini-golfing this last Saturday in Kaysville and when we were done with the putters, we put them in a cleaning solution. THAT will definitely be the new normal for mini-golf.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[twotimer]

ar-BB13zpeX (https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/liability-shield-is-next-coronavirus-aid-battle/ar-BB13zpeX?li=BBnb7Kz)

This pretty much spells out the litigation thing. Hopefully common sense will prevail.

[blueeyes]

Especially when a mask is warn with a person's nose peaking out the top. Which is what I see half the people doing.

And I also love when I see the adults wearing a face mask but not there 5 kids in tow.

I might be a little judgemental..... sure go to the trouble of "protecting" yourself in public only to have your kids pick it up in public bring it home and give it to you at home.

I think Angela Dunn said yesterday that 60% of the cases are from exposure to family infected and 4% from community spread. I would have to double check those numbers. So don't quote me on that.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200505/76ffd51cbd2cfa5407ff7ef24fc7bb0c.jpg

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[BasinCruiser]

Especially when a mask is warn with a person's nose peaking out the top. Which is what I see half the people doing.

And I also love when I see the adults wearing a face mask but not there 5 kids in tow.

I might be a little judgemental..... sure go to the trouble of "protecting" yourself in public only to have your kids pick it up in public bring it home and give it to you at home.

I think Angela Dunn said yesterday that 60% of the cases are from exposure to family infected and 4% from community spread. I would have to double check those numbers. So don't quote me on that.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200505/76ffd51cbd2cfa5407ff7ef24fc7bb0c.jpg

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


One of the reports that I find very interesting is the suspected lack of transmission from yound children to adults. Do you know of any further information or details, theories, debunking on that front?

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/coronavirus-children-adults-pass-symptoms-kids-transmit-schools-a9494286.html (https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/coronavirus-children-adults-pass-symptoms-kids-transmit-schools-a9494286.html)

[oldno7]

perspective:


For a small amount of perspective at this moment, imagine you were born in 1900. When you are 14, World War I starts, and ends on your 18th birthday with 22 million people killed. Later in the year, a Spanish Flu epidemic hits the planet and runs until you are 20. Fifty million people die from it in those two years. Yes, 50 MILLION. When you're 29, the Great Depression begins. Unemployment hits 25%, global GDP drops 27%. That runs until you are 33. The country nearly collapses along with the world economy. When you turn 39, World War II starts. You aren’t even over the hill yet. When you're 41, the United States is fully pulled into WWII. Between your 39th and 45th birthday, 75 million people perish in the war and the Holocaust kills eleven million people, six million were Jews. At 50, the Korean War starts and five million perish. At 55 the Vietnam War begins, and it doesn’t end for 20 years. Four million people die in that conflict. Approaching your 62nd birthday you have the Cuban Missile Crisis, a tipping point in the Cold War. Life on our planet, as we know it, could well have ended. Great leaders prevented that from happening. As you turn 75, the Vietnam War finally ends. Think of everyone on the planet born in 1900. How do you survive all of that? A kid in 1985 didn’t think their 85 year old grandparent understood how hard school was. Yet those grandparents (and now great grandparents) survived through everything listed above.


Perspective is an amazing art. Let’s try and keep things in perspective. Let’s be smart, help each other out, and with a little time we will get through all of this as well.-- (author unknown)

[oldno7]

https://i.imgur.com/Snca7Lh.jpg

[oldno7]

kinda just like the global warming debacle..

https://i.imgur.com/bQLHnWR.jpg

[blueeyes]

One of the reports that I find very interesting is the suspected lack of transmission from yound children to adults. Do you know of any further information or details, theories, debunking on that front?

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/coronavirus-children-adults-pass-symptoms-kids-transmit-schools-a9494286.html (https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/coronavirus-children-adults-pass-symptoms-kids-transmit-schools-a9494286.html)No I don't. What I do know is this.

Virus is new and info about this virus changes constantly.

A transmissible virus is just that no matter who you are, young, old, in between. If you are in close contact with someone who has it you "can" get it.
I think kids tend to spread it less and are generally not as severely affected by this virus except the exceptions. And that is just it there are some interesting exceptions by that I mean this virus doesn't play by the rule book.

I just find it funny that adults will protect themselves in public, but not the kids they live with that go around touching everything. I am still a firm believer that this is spread more through fomites than breathing in a random stranger's air droplets. I am not saying that can't happen just significantly less likely. Unless you share close space for long periods of time like living with someone.

I find the parents lack of consistency funny. Either take your mask off. Or don't bring the kids shopping..or teach them to wear the mask and keep their hands to themselves if you are worried enough to wear a mask yourself.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[blueeyes]

kinda just like the global warming debacle..

https://i.imgur.com/bQLHnWR.jpgI think those two docs have biases. I listen to another doc that i feel has a pretty good head on his shoulders he gave some good points on why those two are full of crap.

He did 2 videos on this subject give him a listen see what you think?

https://youtu.be/Ge5DUDkELIQ

https://youtu.be/qlBcg0MSy7g

I like ZDoggMD I have subscribed to his channel for a while.

My favorite is his lab parody video.


https://youtu.be/KqaVacVpbQk

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[BasinCruiser]

I just find it funny that adults will protect themselves in public, but not the kids they live with that go around touching everything. I am still a firm believer that this is spread more through fomites than breathing in a random stranger's air droplets. I am not saying that can't happen just significantly less likely. Unless you share close space for long periods of time like living with someone.

I find the parents lack of consistency funny. Either take your mask off. Or don't bring the kids shopping..or teach them to wear the mask and keep their hands to themselves if you are worried enough to wear a mask yourself.


Yep. Reminds me of the picture of the woman at the store with her face mask on, standing next to a cart with her child sitting in it, biting on the push handle.

[jman]

I think those two docs have biases. I listen to another doc that i feel has a pretty good head on his shoulders he gave some good points on why those two are full of crap.

He did 2 videos on this subject give him a listen see what you think?

https://youtu.be/Ge5DUDkELIQ (https://youtu.be/Ge5DUDkELIQ)

https://youtu.be/qlBcg0MSy7g (https://youtu.be/qlBcg0MSy7g)

I like ZDoggMD I have subscribed to his channel for a while.

My favorite is his lab parody video.


https://youtu.be/KqaVacVpbQk (https://youtu.be/KqaVacVpbQk)

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Yeah, good ol' Z Dogg!

You might like this vid too Chere:

https://youtu.be/jrMAltUvXog

There's another YouTube Doctor - "Doctor Mike" - calling these two (Dan Erickson and Artin Massihi) out...

Takeway: YouTube took it down because it had a lot of misinformation; AAEM and ACEP condemn their opinions and say that they are "inconsistent with current science and epidemiology" citing they they are owners of local urgent care facilities who are looking out for their financial interests and not the public health.

[blueeyes]

Yeah, good ol' Z Dogg!

You might like this vid too Chere:

https://youtu.be/jrMAltUvXog

There's another YouTube Doctor - "Doctor Mike" - calling these two (Dan Erickson and Artin Massihi) out...

Takeway: YouTube took it down because it had a lot of misinformation; AAEM and ACEP condemn their opinions and say that they are "inconsistent with current science and epidemiology" citing they they are owners of local urgent care facilities who are looking out for their financial interests and not the public health.Yeah I like Doctor Mike too. I stumbled on to his channel a couple weeks back.

Love what he says at the end... these two docs are not the only ones to spread bad information so are the politicians and the media.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[BasinCruiser]

The GOP is trying address this issue and concern that employers have. Doubt it will get through the Dems, though.

94679

https://thehill.com/regulation/496168-house-gop-bill-would-block-lawsuits-by-workers-sickened-with-virus?fbclid=IwAR0-EtlwigYGJ22Mm2kps7dcssnv0Cdfa-oP4GgXBGYlZlNBpj5M_3aYfzo

[Sombeech]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EXQGe02XQAAZf1a?format=jpg

[savanna3313]

Well......I was feeling relatively safe and secure (without quarantining!) down here in St. George. Nothing much had really changed other than most restaurants offered take out/curb side. My friends and family were still going to work daily even though some of their jobs are not considered "essential". Lots less traffic on the road most definitely. But, as of last Thursday, it's like the flood gates have opened with an influx of "outsiders" flocking here. We have been warned that a whole new wave of infections will be striking our area. Since this is a retirement area for the large part, there will be a lot of illness and death if this is true. I'm really getting sick and tired of the doom and gloom reports! Now, the neighbors have decided to block off the entrance to our community and shoot any outsiders who try and breach the barricades! :haha:

Happy Cinco De Mayo y'all! Going to make up a batch of margaritas and watch the action! :bandit:

[rockgremlin]

I'm really getting sick and tired of the doom and gloom reports!


I AM TOO!!!!


I don't understand it --- why do people just WANT a devastating economic crash? Another Great Depression? Why are folks reveling in something that will irreparably destroy people's lives and livelihoods? Why are there so many cheerleaders for the utter ruin of our society and life as we know it? For what?

[oldno7]

Well......I was feeling relatively safe and secure (without quarantining!) down here in St. George. Nothing much had really changed other than most restaurants offered take out/curb side. My friends and family were still going to work daily even though some of their jobs are not considered "essential". Lots less traffic on the road most definitely. But, as of last Thursday, it's like the flood gates have opened with an influx of "outsiders" flocking here. We have been warned that a whole new wave of infections will be striking our area. Since this is a retirement area for the large part, there will be a lot of illness and death if this is true. I'm really getting sick and tired of the doom and gloom reports! Now, the neighbors have decided to block off the entrance to our community and shoot any outsiders who try and breach the barricades! :haha:

Happy Cinco De Mayo y'all! Going to make up a batch of margaritas and watch the action! :bandit:


https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sondrakistan.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F03%2Fget-off-my-lawn.jpg&f=1&nofb=1

[oldno7]

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sondrakistan.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F03%2Fget-off-my-lawn.jpg&f=1&nofb=1

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP. H0dSxFGtpoJTztR7QtF12gHaDE%26pid%3DApi&f=1

[oldno7]

Stay out of the grey hairs hood

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse2.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP. rEJAaSt9p41uE7Q2wTsrvAAAAA%26pid%3DApi&f=1

[savanna3313]

Stay out of the grey hairs hood

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse2.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP. rEJAaSt9p41uE7Q2wTsrvAAAAA%26pid%3DApi&f=1

:popcorn:

[Scott Card]

I think Utah is either color blind or deaf. The Governor said we went from "Red" to "Orange" on this whole quarantine thing. I think we all heard "green" or saw "green" because I just went on an errand from Provo to American Fork and passed at least 5 major stores and 3 greenhouses. ALL of the parking lots are completely packed. Traffic in Utah County at 5 p.m. was almost back to the usual 5 o'clock nasty rush level.

[blueeyes]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200506/d2df7a01bc0e40806a12a85db98ad4c8.jpg

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[twotimer]

.../\/\/\...Now that's friggin' funny!

[twotimer]

I think Utah is either color blind or deaf. The Governor said we went from "Red" to "Orange" on this whole quarantine thing. I think we all heard "green" or saw "green" because I just went on an errand from Provo to American Fork and passed at least 5 major stores and 3 greenhouses. ALL of the parking lots are completely packed. Traffic in Utah County at 5 p.m. was almost back to the usual 5 o'clock nasty rush level.Same thing here in Denver. The traffic has been growing in the last week and although I've been working, I haven't been on a freeway in a while. Listening to the traffic on the radio this morning it appears to be getting pretty thick.

People are still sleeping in, though. But no doubt, folks are done with hangin' around the house. Strange...all the restaurants and most stores are still closed so I can't figure where the heck everyone is going? Tomorrow everyone in Denver is required to wear a mask until the end of May. I think they're a day late and a dollar short on this.

I just finished a long bike ride along the Cherry Creek trail. Lots of people out and most of those I saw weren't wearing a mask...just a week ago damn near everyone was. Also, I went to the grocery store yesterday and Target as well and there were more people than ever not wearing them. And a bunch that had them on were half assed...with the nose showing or pulled down to their necks altogether.

Looks to me like folks are getting over this whole thing now. I'm actually happy to see it...people living without fear.

[Sombeech]

Why do some people WANT HIGHER COVID NUMBERS? Think about it.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-tanzania/tanzania-suspends-laboratory-head-after-president-questions-coronavirus-tests-idUSKBN22G295

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200506/bc288dc00b41648744d2d19359ea6abb.jpg

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[BasinCruiser]

94683

[blueeyes]

Why do some people WANT HIGHER COVID NUMBERS? Think about it.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-tanzania/tanzania-suspends-laboratory-head-after-president-questions-coronavirus-tests-idUSKBN22G295

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200506/bc288dc00b41648744d2d19359ea6abb.jpg

Sent from my SM-G975U using TapatalkCurious...why do you think because of this article someone WANTS higher COVID numbers?

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[BasinCruiser]

94684

[BasinCruiser]

94685

[Iceaxe]

I think Utah is either color blind or deaf. The Governor said we went from "Red" to "Orange" on this whole quarantine thing. I think we all heard "green" or saw "green" because I just went on an errand from Provo to American Fork and passed at least 5 major stores and 3 greenhouses. ALL of the parking lots are completely packed. Traffic in Utah County at 5 p.m. was almost back to the usual 5 o'clock nasty rush level.


I think most people are just fed up with quarantine and understand we flattened the curve, which is all most of us signed up for. We didn't sign up to save every possible life and destroy our entire way of life in the process.

I really applaud seeing so many people thinking for themselves, understanding the risk versus reward, and exercising common sense.

YMMV

[oldno7]

Could there be some misunderstanding of the term "flatten the curve"?

It was always about not overwhelming our hospitals and associated staff, as far as I know.

I don't think it was originally intended to reduce death, just make it manageable from a medical perspective. :ne_nau:

But if I'm wrong, I'll go sit in the corner with beech.

[blueeyes]

Could there be some misunderstanding of the term "flatten the curve"?

It was always about not overwhelming our hospitals and associated staff, as far as I know.

I don't think it was originally intended to reduce death, just make it manageable from a medical perspective. :ne_nau:

But if I'm wrong, I'll go sit in the corner with beech.This was my understanding. So I will reluctantly join you in Beeches Khanspearacy corner if that is wrong.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[BasinCruiser]

94687



https://www.wdrb.com/pov/point-of-view-pick-a-side-mask-or-not/article_88fd72e6-895f-11ea-885b-07581b88d484.html

[oldno7]

https://confederacyofdrones.files.wordpress.com/2020/05/goodwyn-who-vlr-050120.jpg

[oldno7]

https://image.cagle.com/238526/750/238526.png

[oldno7]

https://c.o0bc.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/https___media.gettyimages.com_photos_man-wears-a-protective-face-mask-as-protesters-rally-to-demand-an-end-picture-id1211759175_b1k6m1211759175s170x170hgNCO_1e1X0Nui NJsBKKgjcqjEGUv3QiwAG1GVRYBDBc$large.jpg

[BasinCruiser]

94690

[oldno7]

Health workers that volunteered to come to NY during pandemic have to pay state income tax: Cuomo
NEW YORK — Health care workers that came to New York to help fight the coronavirus pandemic at its epicenter will have to pay state taxes, according to the governor.
He addressed the issues Tuesday at a news conference.
"We're not in a position to provide any subsidies right now because we have a $13 billion deficit," Gov. Andrew Cuomo said. "So there's a lot of good things I'd like to do, and if we get federal funding, we can do, but it would be irresponsible for me to sit here looking at a $13 billion deficit and say I'm gonna spend more money, when I can't even pay the essential services."

https://www.pix11.com/news/coronavirus/health-workers-that-volunteered-to-come-to-ny-during-pandemic-have-to-pay-state-income-tax-cuomo

[oldno7]

WOW--cbs fakes a story and gets caught


https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=6&v=oQWRCECbN-Y&feature=emb_logo

[Sombeech]

WOW--cbs fakes a story and gets caught


https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=6&v=oQWRCECbN-Y&feature=emb_logo

You beat me to it.

They want more COVID cases, they want more people tested, they want continued shutdown. Keep the appearance up. Go as far as you need to go. Put dummies, mannequins on the stretchers if you need to.

Why, you ask.... see if you can think of the reason. Who benefits more from a shutdown economy? Who loses more?

[BasinCruiser]

94692

[Sombeech]

Shown in an episode from 2003, yeah this new drug Trump talks about he must be making shit up.

They friggin knew in 2003 that Chloroquine cures CoronaVirus. Are you awake yet?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUEa9jzVzu4

[Sombeech]

Listen to this woman, decades of experience, gag order just expired, she's not lying. Want to know how far back this kind of bullshit goes? It's not just CoronaVirus. This isn't a theory.

When YouTube removes it, you can watch it here.
https://www.bitchute.com/video/25tow1hbXwy1/


http://youtu.be/nFPeN17PVU8

[blueeyes]

Listen to this woman, decades of experience, gag order just expired, she's not lying. Want to know how far back this kind of bullshit goes? It's not just CoronaVirus. This isn't a theory.

When YouTube removes it, you can watch it here.
https://www.bitchute.com/video/25tow1hbXwy1/


http://youtu.be/nFPeN17PVU8Took you awhile to find her. I was wondering when you would. Only because everyone and there dog is posting it on FB now. Came across one of her other BS videos 2 weeks ago.







Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[Sombeech]

Came across one of her other BS videos 2 weeks ago.



I'm open to hearing about any specific one of her points that doesn't match up with reality.

Are doctors pressured into adding COVID as the cause of death? Yes/ No? If so, why would that be?

[Sombeech]

Listen to this woman, decades of experience, gag order just expired, she's not lying. Want to know how far back this kind of bullshit goes? It's not just CoronaVirus. This isn't a theory.

When YouTube removes it, you can watch it here.
https://www.bitchute.com/video/25tow1hbXwy1/


http://youtu.be/nFPeN17PVU8

Oops, taken down, AGAIN
https://www.bitchute.com/video/25tow1hbXwy1/

Isn't it weird that soft porn, videos calling for violence and actual harmful videos can stay up on YouTube, but not this?

Is there any one specific thing about this video that is harmful? Maybe it could be flat out wrong, but is it dangerous? I don't know the lady, maybe she's an actor. I'd trust her more than Mr dreamy blue eyes conducting the interview.

But what is it about this video that is so dangerous? Is it just that people think it's wrong? Is there a call for violence that I missed? Maybe if she called herself Antifa, a call for violence would be ok.

What specific phrase was uttered that gets this video removed? I mean among the Tannerite blowing shit up, and Bunny Blasting, this is the video that is taken down on a daily basis?

[rockgremlin]

Oops, taken down, AGAIN
https://www.bitchute.com/video/25tow1hbXwy1/

Isn't it weird that soft porn, videos calling for violence and actual harmful videos can stay up on YouTube, but not this?

Is there any one specific thing about this video that is harmful? Maybe it could be flat out wrong, but is it dangerous? I don't know the lady, maybe she's an actor. I'd trust her more than Mr dreamy blue eyes conducting the interview.

But what is it about this video that is so dangerous? Is it just that people think it's wrong? Is there a call for violence that I missed? Maybe if she called herself Antifa, a call for violence would be ok.

What specific phrase was uttered that gets this video removed? I mean among the Tannerite blowing shit up, and Bunny Blasting, this is the video that is taken down on a daily basis?


The fact that this video is so strongly censored and can't stay posted on any file host tells you that there is some very compelling information within this video that some very powerful people want squashed.

I watched it. Didn't seem overtly harmful in any way. In fact, I've watched Joe Rogan podcasts that were more inciteful than this video.

Maybe I'm also missing something? I know blueeyes didn't care much for the lady in this video -- perhaps she can shed some light?

[Iceaxe]

WOW! Trump just really upped the game.

Trump just declared Covid-19 a Chinese attack on the US bigger then Pearl Harbor or 9-11.

Trust me... Those words will not fall by the wayside... there will be a lot more to this. Trump is gunning for the US to become China Independent.

[emoji631]

[accadacca]

Here it is again...

My wife showed this video to me (well told me about it) today...still haven’t watched it, but she was drinking the Kool-Aid.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wHzrYtV5lw&feature=youtu.be

[Sombeech]

Here it is again...

My wife showed this video to me (well told me about it) today...still haven’t watched it, but she was drinking the Kool-Aid.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wHzrYtV5lw&feature=youtu.be


There's something to this video, it's been uploaded and deleted like a dozen times, and each of the different versions are getting like 3 million views in a single day.

[accadacca]

Here it is again...

My wife showed this video to me (well told me about it) today...still haven’t watched it, but she was drinking the Kool-Aid.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wHzrYtV5lw&feature=youtu.be

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/scientist-vaccine-jailed/

[Iceaxe]

Using Snoops as a source isn't real encouraging as they are an advocate of the left.


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200507/14fe2a1e836d8f9bdf06121d95a9a193.jpg

[BasinCruiser]

Had there ever been a more inconsistent moving target than the’ science’ used to direct public policy than this crisis?


94700


“Most new Covid-19 hospitalizations in New York state are from people who were staying home and not venturing much outside, a "shocking" finding, Gov. Andrew Cuomo said Wednesday.The preliminary data was from 100 New York hospitals involving about 1,000 patients, Cuomo said at his daily briefing.It shows that 66% of new admissions were from people who had largely been sheltering at home. The next highest source of admissions was from nursing homes, 18%. “

https://www.louderwithcrowder.com/backfire-vast-majority-of-new-covid-hospitalizations-are-from-people-who-stayed-at-home


So, staying at home or being in a nursing home is the largest group of people that end up hospitalized. But, let’s make it illegal to go to the beach or to work.

Still think this ‘lockdown’ is really about saving lives?

[oldno7]

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/scientist-vaccine-jailed/

snoops?:roflol:

cnn has more credibility and they have none...

[blueeyes]

There's something to this video, it's been uploaded and deleted like a dozen times, and each of the different versions are getting like 3 million views in a single day.First I don't agree in removing video's like this.

Second you should have posted this video in the "Bitches Be Crazy" thread. Because this one is crazy.

The following information is from reddit. He has links backing up what he says about her.


Here is the link to the discussion

https://www.reddit.com/r/CovIdiots/comments/gezery/plandemic_documentary_debunked/?utm_source=amp&utm_medium=&utm_content=post_body

For whatever reason that link above is not working. Try this one.


https://www.reddit.com/r/CovIdiots/comments/gezery/plandemic_documentary_debunked/?utm_source=amp&utm_medium=&utm_content=post_body



Plandemic Documentary: The Hidden Agenda Behind Covid-19 #DEBUNKED!!
The “documentary” begins…
“Dr. Judy Mikovits has been called one of the most accomplished scientists of her generation.
… [claims that Dr. Mikovits revolutionized AIDS testing and treatment]

At the height of her career, Dr. Mikovits published a blockbuster article in the journal,*Science. The controversial article sent shockwaves through the scientific community as it revealed that the common use of animal and human fetal tissues were unleashing devastating plagues of chronic diseases. For exposing their deadly secrets, the minions of Big Pharma waged war on Dr. Mikovits Destroying her good name, career and personal life.”

At minute 1:55 in the film “one of the most accomplished scientists of her time” claims that she was arrested, but charged with NOTHING. At minute 1:58 she claims to have been held in jail with no charges, which if true would absolutely violate the 6th Amendment to the Constitution of the United States. 2:05 she claims there was “no warrant” for her arrest and at 2:13 she claims that her house was searched without a warrant which if true, would violate the 4th Amendment to the Constitution of the United States and at 2:26 she claims that the stolen intellectual property was PLANTED in her house in California. At 2:57 she claims that the FBI are involved (they were not) and that her case in under seal so that no attorney can represent her or defend her, or they would be found in contempt of court, which if true would of course violate too many Constitutional norms to enumerate but yes, basically ALL of them are being denied her… according to her.

The actual Criminal charges vs. the wild claims by Dr. Mikovits

In 2006 Dr. Judy Mikovits was hired as Research Director for a private foundation associated with UNR called Whittemore Peterson Institute for Neuro-Immune Disease (WPI) in Reno, NV which was created by a very wealthy couple comprised of an attorney and a businessman whose daughter suffers from “Chronic Fatigue Syndrome” in an effort to find a cure for their daughter. When Dr. Mikovits went to work at WPI, her contract included clauses not unlike what is included when I do litigation support research for attorneys: her contract states that any and all of her work product belongs to WPI, she may retain NO COPIES of any of it. She most certainly was not authorized to remove any work product from WPI. To do so, is theft of intellectual property.
Dr. Mikovits was fired from WPI for refusing to turn over a cell sample shipment received at her lab to another researcher at the institute on September 29, 2011, the details of which are outlined in witness Max Proft’s affidavit. (link below)

After Dr. Mikovits' departure, WPI discovered that 12 to 20 laboratory notebooks and flash drives containing years of research data were missing. In an initial statement through her attorney, Dr. Mikovits stated that she had received notice of her firing from WPI on her cell phone and immediately left Nevada for her home near Ventura, California. Dr. Mikovits denied having the notebooks and, in fact, Dr. Mikovits’ attorney was requesting that the lab notebooks be returned to her so that she could continue to work on the grants she won while employed at the WPI and fulfill her responsibilities on these government grants and corporate contacts.
After WPI reported a theft to the University of Nevada police, and an investigation was launched and a subordinate research assistant and TENANT of Dr. Mikovits’ in Reno named Max Pfost, provided a sworn affidavit detailing his own complicity in stealing the notebooks and delivering them to Dr. Mikovits. His sworn affidavit was the basis of the warrant for Dr. Mikovits’ arrest and the search of her home in California. I recommend reading his affidavit in full because it provides a lot of relevant details in both the civil and criminal cases:
http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/268451-exh-1-reply-iso

Following Dr. Mikovits’ arrest, a second researcher at WPI named Amanda McKenzie also provided a sworn affidavit in which she attests that Dr. Mikovits asked her to remove laboratory samples and other materials from WPI and deliver them to another researcher who is a co-author of Dr. Mikovits’ now-discredited research paper and one of two of the four authors of that study who refuses to retract the study, the other one being Dr. Mikovits. According to her affidavit, Amanda McKenzie declined to do cooperate with Dr. Mikovits’ plans.

Contrary to Dr. Mikovits’ claim in “Plandemic Documentary” that she was arrested without warrant, held in jail without charges and additionally, her home searched without warrant, in fact, warrants for her arrest and the search and recovery of stolen property at her home WERE issued by the University of Nevada at Reno Police Department November 17, 2011. Dr. Mikovits was arrested at her California home on November 18, 2011 and charged with two felonies: 1. possession of stolen property and 2. unlawful taking of computer data, equipment, supplies, or other computer-related property. She was held without bail for 5 days while awaiting arraignment and hearing on extradition to Nevada - which she waived - after 18 laboratory notebooks belonging to WPI, as well a computer and other items were recovered from her home following the warranted search. The criminal charges were later dismissed without prejudice pending the outcome of the civil trial against Dr. Mikovits for losses related to the stolen but mostly recovered notebooks. The “gag order” Dr. Mikovits refers to relates to the civil lawsuit WPI filed against her which Dr. Mikovits LOST and as a result, was ordered to pay attorney fees and damages to WPI. She chose to declare bankruptcy rather than pay. Frankly, she should never have stolen the notebooks, because she KNEW that her contract with WPI stipulated that all laboratory work product belonged to them, including the all-important notebooks.

Unfortunately, I think she felt like she had to steal them because at the time she was still trying to claim her study was valid and adjust testing parameters for the XMRV virus that would create more positive test results from her patients, as noted in the edited abstract of her published study. The notebooks are essential documentation of all the laboratory’s methods.
In two sworn affidavits, Max Pfost details how Dr. Mikovits told him that “WPI was going down” and that she was going to see to it that at least half of a $1.5M R01 grant from the US National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Disease would follow her to a new employer. According to his affidavit:

“She stated she was going to try to move the R01 grant and the Department of Defense grants and stop the Lipkin study.”

The Lipkin study was a multi-centre trial, headed by Ian Lipkin, a virologist at Columbia University in New York, trying to prove or disprove once and for all Mikovits’s largely discredited hypothesis that Chronic Fatigue Syndrome is caused by a mysterious family of retroviruses, among them XMRV.*

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3448165/

The Lipkin study was commissioned by DR. ANTHONY FAUCI and this, is where Dr. Mikovits’ true resentment and subsequent slanderous accusations against Dr. Fauci originate. Dr. Fauci may have cost Dr. Mikovits at least $750k in federal grant money by insisting on additional peer-reviewed research of her failed attempt to link the XMRV virus to Chronic Fatigue Syndrome.

https://www.virology.ws/2011/05/06/ian-lipkin-on-xmrv/comment-page-4/

Who is Judy Mikovits and what is she even talking about?

In 1992 she earned a Ph.D. in biochemistry and molecular biology from George Washington University. Her Ph.D. thesis was entitled “Negative Regulation of HIV Expression in Monocytes” and her empirical thesis research relates to repressor proteins that could inhibit HIV DNA from replicating. Her only published paper on HIV is not suppressed. In fact, this very documentary claims it its’ very first moments that Dr. Mikovits DID revolutionize the testing/treatment of HIV/AIDS so… did she or didn’t she? Her thesis is available here:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2187891/

Dr. Mikovits did do some post-graduate DNA research in molecular virology at the Laboratory of Genomic Diversity, National Cancer Institute, although she published zero research during her years there. Ze-ro. If Dr. Fauci stole her homework then… where is this 1999 paper she claims she had “in publication”? She doesn’t have a copy? Her research associates don’t???

It was while working for WPI in 2009 that Dr. Mikovits published the only significant research paper of her career in the journal*Science, entitled “Detection of an infectious retrovirus, XMRV, in blood cells of patients with chronic fatigue syndrome”, in which she and four other colleagues claimed to have found genetic markers indicating the presence of retroviruses including one called XMRV in the blood products of patients suffering from Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. When no other laboratory could replicate the results Dr. Mikovits published, she went back and altered the protocols for detection to make nearly all the results “positive” for XMRV and other retrovirus, which they concede was done in the edited abstract of their own research paper:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3073172/

By 2011 two of the original researchers including Dr. Lombardi had come to understand that the results they had published were only factually explainable by laboratory contamination and partially retracted their research, later petitioning to have their names removed from the study entirely:

“Four laboratories tested the samples for the presence of antibodies that react with XMRV proteins. Only WPI and NCI/Ruscetti detected reactive antibodies, both in CFS specimens and negative controls. There was no statistically significant difference in the rates of positivity between the positive and negative controls, nor in the identity of the positive samples between the two laboratories.

These results demonstrate that XMRV or antibodies to the virus are not present in clinical specimens. Detection of XMRV nucleic acid by WPI is likely a consequence of contamination. The positive serology reported by WPI and NCI/Ruscetti laboratories remained unexplained, but are most likely the result of the presence of cross-reactive epitopes. The authors of the study conclude that ‘routine blood screening for XMRV/P-MLV is not warranted at this time’.”

https://www.virology.ws/2011/09/27/trust-science-not-scientists/

This did not stop WPI from bringing to market a laboratory test for XMRV at a cost of $500 to each patient for the financial benefit of WPI, that even Dr. Mikovits did not believe was providing accurate results according to her ”testimony” in “Plandemic Documentary” on YouTube…

https://phoenixrising.me/research-2/the-pathogens-in-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-mecfs/xmrv/xmrv-testing

In November 2011*Science*published a NINE LABORATORY STUDY that also failed to confirm XMRV or other viruses in the blood of and therefore as a cause of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome in patients.

https://science.sciencemag.org/content/334/6057/814

By the end of 2011*Science*had issued a full retraction of Dr. Mikovits’ published findings in their journal:

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2011/12/updated-rare-move-science-without-authors-consent-retracts-paper-tied-mouse-virus

Let’s review the rest of the video for fun…
At minute 7:40 Dr. Mikovits begins to falsely claim that the Bayh-Dole Act has “ruined” science by allowing grant recipients to retain ownership claims to their inventions and get rich, but in reality, when it comes to Dr. Fauci (and university researchers similarly under contract with those institutions), by his contractual agreement with NIAID the ownership of those patents, in fact, resides with that agency and thus, with the taxpayers and THAT, is who will receive royalties from the grants Dr. Fauci employed in order to make his discoveries that lead to those patents. Those royalties go 1/2 to the NIAID, a taxpayer-funded agency in order to fund more research grants (like the one Dr. Mikovits has now been denied in light of her unethical practices) and the other 1/2 to the drug manufacturer. I don’t see the problem.

Dr. Fauci and others at HHS applied for their first patent on a method for activating the immune system in mammals in 1995 and it did involve the Il-2 treatments Dr. Mikovits references in the video at minute 7:40, but nothing in the patent is unique to the treatment of HIV/AIDS; it looks like it most applies to use in treating leukemia and in fact, in the Background of the Invention [0010] included with the patent registration it states: “No method of treatment of HIV with IL-2 has been disclosed which results in a sustained response or which yields long-term beneficial results.” So how is it that this Dr. Mikovits sees fit to BLAME Dr. Fauci for AIDS deaths? It’s slanderous.

https://patents.justia.com/patent/20030180254

At 9:17 we are hit with the biggest irony in the world when Dr. Mikovits criticizes Bill Gates’ foundation for helping to fund research (making the FOUNDATION, not Bill Gates himself, possibly eligible for some claim if patents are filed and Stanford v. Roche is the standard that would apply, as it does to all of Dr. Fauci’s patents), when the place that Dr. Mikovits was fired from (WPI) for misappropriating cell samples - the place THROUGH which she was seeking a $1.5M research grant FROM NIAID - is a PRIVATE FOUNDATION that was founded by an attorney and her husband, seeking a cure for their daughter’s Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. WPI contractually had the same rights under Stanford v. Roche to any invention or discovery of hers and after she was fired for misappropriating samples and proven to be a thief of intellectual property, Dr. Mikovits was in danger of losing her own $1.5M grant from NIAID. That’s her real beef here.

So, what is the truth? Did Dr. Mikovits “discover” a dangerous virus causing “plagues of disease” as this “documentary” claims and then finds herself silenced and bankrupted by the Deep State and Big Pharma? No, she absolutely did not. A man named Dr. Robert Silverman “discovered” the XMRV virus in prostate cancer samples and published his own findings attempting to link that virus to disease in 2006.

https://journals.plos.org/plospathogens/article?id=10.1371/journal.ppat.0020025

Dr. Mikovits met Dr. Silverman at a conference in 2007 and at that time Dr. Mikovits decided to start testing her Chronic Fatigue Syndrome patients for the virus, using methods Dr. Silverman actually developed. Dr. Silverman has since stood by HIS discovery of XMRV, but has completely retracted his study linking the virus to the disease of prostate cancer.

“In their new study in*PLOS ONE, Silverman and colleagues meticulously retraced their experimental steps to determine the source of XMRV contamination in their cell cultures, which has garnered praise from other researchers.

“These scientists put their egos aside and aggressively and relentlessly pursued several lines of investigation to get to the truth," National Cancer Institute researcher Vinay Pathak told*ScienceNOW.*Pathak was among the researchers who published data that refuted a connection between XMRV and disease.
…
After publications by Pathak and others, Silverman said he felt convinced that there was an error in his findings. “I felt I couldn't rest until I figured out how it happened,” Silverman told*ScienceNOW. “I wanted to get some closure.””

https://www.the-scientist.com/the-nutshell/surprise-xmrv-retraction-40456

Too bad Dr. Mikovits has no such ethics.
This absurd “documentary” then goes on to show video clips of doctors claiming they are being “pressured” to record deaths as Covid-19 but included again is Dr. Erickson, the now-debunked California doctor who DOES NOT ATTEND DYING PATIENTS IN ANY HOSPITAL and therefore, is absolutely NOT “being pressured” to fill out any “death reports”.

At 14:52 Dr. Mikovits validates the claim that the filmmaker makes that doctors and hospitals are being “incentivized” to report cases as Covid-19 and Dr. Mikovits cites the figure of a $13,000 “bonus”?? from Medicare?? That is so laughable. The overwhelming majority of hospitals in the United States are privately owned, so if ANY hospital is pressuring ANY doctor to falsely code Covid-19 claims with an expectation financial gain, that would be Medicare fraud. IS this documentary seriously meaning to allege that widespread Medicare fraud is being perpetrated by U.S. hospitals that doctors are complicit with?

That is one hell of an accusation.

Dr. Mikovits works in laboratories and apparently understands very little about medical billing for patients, but I have had to deal with mountains of medical bills in personal injury and medical malpractice, so allow me to explain a few things supplemented with some of the newest information as regards Covid-19 coding and billing:

Patients’ conditions are recorded including using diagnostic codes, for the purposes of billing and also empirical study. Diagnosis coding accurately portrays the medical condition that a patient is experiencing; ICD diagnostic coding accurately reflects a healthcare provider's findings.

A healthcare provider’s progress note is composed of four component parts:

1. the patient’s chief complaint, the reason that initiates the healthcare encounter

2. the provider documents his or observations including a review of the patient’s history, a review of pertinent medical systems, and a physical examination.

3. the healthcare provider renders an assessment in the form of a diagnosis

4. a plan of care is ordered.

Diagnostic codes are used to justify why medical procedures are performed. If you don’t code a patient for presumptive Covid-19, you cannot order and bill for a Covid-19 test, nor apparently justify hospital quarantine for a Medicare patient without charging the patient an additional co-pay UNLESS you code their diagnosis as Covid-19.

According to*official guidance*from the CDC, providers should only use code U07.1 to document a confirmed diagnosis of COVID-19 as documented by the provider, per documentation of a positive COVID-19 test result, or a presumptive positive COVID-19 test result. This also applies to asymptomatic patients who test positive for coronavirus. “Suspected, possible, probable, or inconclusive cases of COVID-19 should not be assigned U07.1” CDC emphasizes in the guidance. Instead, providers should assign codes explaining the reason for the encounter, such as a fever or Z20.828, “Contact with and (suspected) exposure to other viral communicable diseases”.”

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/icd/COVID-19-guidelines-final.pdf

Medicare and Medicaid do not have “set amounts” that are paid based on diagnostic codes. Dr. Mikovits is clearly as misinformed as half the internet right now but here is where they are getting the numbers they are twisting into fiction for their own purposes:

“To project how much hospitals would get paid by the federal government for treating uninsured patients, we look at payments for admissions for similar conditions. For less severe hospitalizations, we use the average Medicare payment for respiratory infections and inflammations with major comorbidities or complications in 2017, which was $13,297. For more severe hospitalizations, we use the average Medicare payment for a respiratory system diagnosis with ventilator support for greater than 96 hours, which was $40,218. Each of these average payments was then increased by 20% to account for the add-on to Medicare inpatient reimbursement for patients with COVID-19 that was included in the CARES Act.

Before accounting for the 20% add on, Medicare payments are about*half of what private insurers pay*on average for the same diagnoses. In the absence of this new proposed policy, many of the uninsured would typically be billed based on hospital charges, which are the undiscounted “list prices” for care and are typically much higher than even private insurance reimbursement.”

https://www.kff.org/uninsured/issue-brief/estimated-cost-of-treating-the-uninsured-hospitalized-with-covid-19/

https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/brief/potential-costs-of-coronavirus-treatment-for-people-with-employer-coverage/

In case you were wondering, the reasons behind the 20% add on for patients diagnosed with Covid-19, are because according to the Kaiser Family Foundation Medicare already typically pays HALF what private insurers do, Medicare does not pay for additional PPE, Covid-19 patients often have the medical necessity of a private hospital room for quarantine purposes which Medicare does not normally cover and finally, the new Covid-19 coding allows hospital providers to bill for services they provide at alternate sites such as parking lot testing sites, convention centers or hotels, something we haven’t dealt with before but for which they obviously deserve to be reimbursed. The $13k/$39k figures are simply what it cost on average in 2017 to care for someone with respiratory illness in a hospital, it is NOT some “bonus” that anyone is receiving. That is a lie.

17:13 Dr. Mikovits claims that hydroxychloroquine or chloroquine has been safely used for 70 years to treat a wide range of illnesses for which the FDA has approved its’ use including lupus and rheumatoid arthritis but unfortunately, that is not the same thing as treating Covid-19, and Dr. Mikovits’ peers have come to very, very different conclusions about its’ application as a treatment for Covid-19:

“Data to support the use of HCQ and CQ for COVID-19 are limited and inconclusive. The drugs have some in vitro activity against several viruses, including coronaviruses and influenza, but previous randomized trials in patients with influenza have been negative (4,*5). In COVID-19, one small nonrandomized study from France (3) (discussed elsewhere in*Annals of Internal Medicine*[6]) demonstrated benefit but had serious methodological flaws, and a follow-up study still lacked a control group. Yet, another very small, randomized study from China in patients with mild to moderate COVID-19 found no difference in recovery rates (7).”

https://annals.org/aim/fullarticle/2764199/use-hydroxychloroquine-chloroquine-during-covid-19-pandemic-what-every-clinician

“In this phase IIb randomized clinical trial of 81 patients with COVID-19, an unplanned interim analysis recommended by an independent data safety and monitoring board found that a higher dosage of chloroquine diphosphate for 10 days was associated with more toxic effects and lethality, particularly affecting QTc interval prolongation. The limited sample size did not allow the study to show any benefit overall regarding treatment efficacy.”

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2765499

In conclusion, this woman has a serious axe to grind with her peers and even her former collaborating colleagues. Her published research has been completely discredited by a dozen independent studies. This is why we have peer review of scientific claims - in order to discern real fact. Dr. Mikovits was to a receive $1.5M grant from NIAID herself, which she has now lost due to lack of scientific fact and lack of ethics. Sometimes I see a meme on Facebook that says something about how some people believe that scientists are conspiring to lie to them… like, why would scientists lie? They “lie” or more accurately, falsify data because believe it or not, science is even more competitive than the music industry and scientists can’t sell tickets to their show. In order to receive any money for doing science, one needs an expensive education and to be able to publish credible findings.

Dr. Mikovits cannot even be honest or discerning in relaying the truth about her legal issues, so I do not know why anyone would take any testimony by this person about anything with anything other than a large grain of salt and that is the nicest way I can say it.






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[blueeyes]

Here is another blog worth looking at that talks about Dr. Judy Craycray

https://bigthink.com/coronavirus/the-plandemic

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[blueeyes]

More

https://www.the-scientist.com/the-nutshell/chronic-fatigue-researcher-to-publish-book-37816

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[blueeyes]

Another one

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2012/06/criminal-charges-dropped-against-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-researcher-judy-mikovits

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[blueeyes]

Here is my favorite! The swat video in her bogus video comes from this raid

https://onscene.tv/santa-ana-swat-team-raids-house-possibly-related-to-murder/

Come on guys...please use your heads. Misinformation is so rampant right now. I get wanting to find a reason to this madness but please stop promoting bullshit Khanspearacy theories.

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[BasinCruiser]

94701

[rockgremlin]

First I don't agree in removing video's like this.

Second you should have posted this video in the "Bitches Be Crazy" thread. Because this one is crazy.


.......





Thanks for the clarifying points. Very enlightening.

Did you type that entire response on your cell phone?

[blueeyes]

The fact that this video is so strongly censored and can't stay posted on any file host tells you that there is some very compelling information within this video that some very powerful people want squashed.

I watched it. Didn't seem overtly harmful in any way. In fact, I've watched Joe Rogan podcasts that were more inciteful than this video.

Maybe I'm also missing something? I know blueeyes didn't care much for the lady in this video -- perhaps she can shed some light?No it doesn't tell you that there is compelling information. It might just tell you they are desperately trying to prevent people who will believe anything without checking facts from being mislead. Because if there is one thing I have learned from this pandemic is that the general population are sheep and listen to anyone who claims to have authority instead of searching out the truth for themselves.

I have more to add about this video but it will have to wait until next week. My sister in law was killed in an ATV accident in Southern Utah. I am picking up my son at the airport and won't have time until I put him back on the plane Sunday. PS. If there are any of you on the Kane County search and rescue....thank you.

I can tell you at this point I am truly over 2020. 2 family deaths. My moms friend passed from coronavirus so she is depressed. Brother was in hospital for 4 weeks just as this mess started and now is permanently in a nursing home where I couldn't even see him for his birthday Monday. I am just thankful I still have a job.

And really wish I could snap my fingers and make all this shit go away. Khanspearacy and all.

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[blueeyes]

Thanks for the clarifying points. Very enlightening.

Did you type that entire response on your cell phone?God no... copy and paste from a reddit post. Not my words.

But everything I would very much like to say.

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[Iceaxe]

Damn Blueeye's, I'm not reading all that... Anyone care to summarize in a paragraph or two?

[blueeyes]

Damn Blueeye's, I'm not reading all that... Anyone care to summarize in a paragraph or two?Really easy she is a crazy bitch....

Enough said. If you don’t care to educate yourself.

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[Iceaxe]

Because if there is one thing I have learned from this pandemic is that the general population are sheep and listen to anyone who claims to have authority instead of searching out the truth for themselves.

You're an independent and smart person, so the only thing that really surprises me is it took the pandemic for you to notice we have a major sheepeeple problem.

This is exactly what those who have been diligently defending our Constitution and Bill of Right have been desperately preaching for years.

[blueeyes]

You're an independent and smart person, so the only thing that really surprises me is it took the pandemic for you to notice we have a major sheepeeple problem.

This is exactly what those who have been diligently defending our Constitution and Bill of Right have been desperately preaching for years.I tend to try and believe in humanity Ice... but this pandemic has put that to the test. And my belief is failing.

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[Sombeech]

Here is the link to the discussion

That's, like a TON of reading. That's why I asked for one specific point that you disagree with, and we could call it good there. Nobody, and I mean nobody, can give me a disagreement with any single one of her statements about the virus or her other points.

I've seen the snopes link about 7 times, most people look for the word "False" and breathe a sigh of relief. The snopes link disagrees with the reason she was jailed, not with the content of her discussion or her credentials.

I'll make it easy on anybody who disagrees with her interview, just name one thing. Not a library of text, that kind of stuff just goes nowhere.

I'll state again I don't know the lady, she could be a fraud, but the arguments against her are circular logic, so I have to fault to listening to her.

Is there any one thing, and only one thing, that you disagree with about her argument?

PS sorry to hear about your sister in law. That's terrible.

[blueeyes]

That's, like a TON of reading. That's why I asked for one specific point that you disagree with, and we could call it good there. Nobody, and I mean nobody, can give me a disagreement with any single one of her statements about the virus or her other points.

I've seen the snopes link about 7 times, most people look for the word "False" and breathe a sigh of relief. The snopes link disagrees with the reason she was jailed, not with the content of her discussion or her credentials.

I'll make it easy on anybody who disagrees with her interview, just name one thing. Not a library of text, that kind of stuff just goes nowhere.

I'll state again I don't know the lady, she could be a fraud, but the arguments against her are circular logic, so I have to fault to listening to her.

Is there any one thing, and only one thing, that you disagree with about her argument?

PS sorry to hear about your sister in law. That's terrible.Thank you.

Justin i disagree with all of it.

Have you ever heard of medicare fraud. You don't lie about why a person dies. And if you read what the guy wrote you would see where he talks about the claim people have made about Covid-19 diagnosis and 13,000 to whatever that other number that was thrown around.

I find it funny that you will sit and watch a bullshit Khanspearacy video and when more than one fact to dispute the video is given to you with links to back up the claims you suddenly can't bother yourself with reading.

This kind of fits that sheeple [emoji207] label Ice and I were just talking about.

Your wife is a nurse right. I don't know where she works but every year I have to take Medicare training that talks about reporting fraud and what not. If people really are falsifying information they will be in a shit ton of trouble not worth losing your job over.

But putting the code down to pay for extra supplies it takes to take care of a covid patient. That makes sense to me.

But again I will respond more to this video sometime next week.

I sat and watched that stupid ****ing video twice to write down points i disagree with so do me the favor and read what the guy and reddit wrote. And the other article and whatever else i post about it or don't post Khanspearacy theories to be disputed.

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[blueeyes]

Dr. Damania response is how I feel. Except I wish he would have spent more time providing facts but I think like all of us who approach shit like the video posted with analytical skepticism we are so fed up with junk posts and social media spreads all the junk faster than wild fire. Being more connected is not in the least bit helpful.


https://youtu.be/KHeg9DDrjMs


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[Sombeech]

Have you ever heard of medicare fraud. You don't lie about why a person dies. And if you read what the guy wrote you would see where he talks about the claim people have made about Covid-19 diagnosis and 13,000 to whatever that other number that was thrown around.

OK thanks, let's work with this then. Yes, Medicare fraud is a no-no. So the question is, have doctors and medical staff been pressured to add COVID 19 as the cause of death? It would seem so. The question is, why? Why is there the suggestion to classify it as the virus?

With videos, they are easier for me to digest because I can listen to them while working.

And with my wife, yes she is an RN, working on her NP, she's got to wear the mask all day. The Doctors/surgeons are asked to wear the masks too, but they don't. They do whatever the hell they want.

So if we can confirm the virus death numbers are being nudged upwards, we have to ask why. We have noticed only in the last week the CDC had to be a little more honest with us. So instead of 60k deaths from COVID, they admitted those numbers came from COVID "or" Flu "or" pneumonia.

Somebody wants the count to be higher. Somebody wants the economy shut down longer. Somebody NEVER wanted Trump to mention HydroxyChloroquine with Zinc as a great remedy (and look at the results, plus look at the criticisms lash out about it). Somebody is contaminating the COVID tests with COVID. These things are happening.

[rockgremlin]

Beech -- take 10 or 15 minutes and read Chere's megapost carefully. It details why Dr. Judy Mikovits is a fraud and a liar.

[oldno7]

I haven't watched the video but taking it down is not the answer in the USA.

I would like to watch it in my free time, I can decide of it's validity on my own, I don't need to be protected from potential information that doesn't fit a personal criteria.

[blueeyes]

I haven't watched the video but taking it down is not the answer in the USA.

I would like to watch it in my free time, I can decide of it's validity on my own, I don't need to be protected from potential information that doesn't fit a personal criteria.


Sombeech post just that one link that is still up so Kurt can watch. It still works. I watched it again 3rd time this morning to confirm the swat video was the same swat video from a suspected murder case. And it is.

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[Sombeech]

Beech -- take 10 or 15 minutes and read Chere's megapost carefully. It details why Dr. Judy Mikovits is a fraud and a liar.

OK so let's break it down, it begins with stating the reasons she was jailed, held and such without a warrant, would go against code of conduct, law, constitution.... Do you realize what is happening with General Flynn right now? Do you know why he was charged, and why he will be exonerated?

To say she's a fraud because the law wouldn't agree with her claims of being jailed.... I'm going to need a bit more than that to say she's a fraud. And that's exactly what the Snopes link is saying why her claim is false, because the reason she was jailed.

Is there something in her argument that is false? Aside from digging up dirt on her, hell maybe she was a prostitute in Bangkok, I don't know. Maybe she's a Meth junkie, she could be. Maybe those aren't prescription eyeglasses.

What about her claim is false? Nobody is watching this video to learn how she was jailed. They want to know about this pandemic.

[rockgremlin]

OK so let's break it down, it begins with stating the reasons she was jailed, held and such without a warrant, would go against code of conduct, law, constitution.... Do you realize what is happening with General Flynn right now? Do you know why he was charged, and why he will be exonerated?

To say she's a fraud because the law wouldn't agree with her claims of being jailed.... I'm going to need a bit more than that to say she's a fraud. And that's exactly what the Snopes link is saying why her claim is false, because the reason she was jailed.

Is there something in her argument that is false? Aside from digging up dirt on her, hell maybe she was a prostitute in Bangkok, I don't know. Maybe she's a Meth junkie, she could be. Maybe those aren't prescription eyeglasses.

What about her claim is false? Nobody is watching this video to learn how she was jailed. They want to know about this pandemic.


Did you read it? It doesn't sound like you read it.

She was blatantly violating patent laws and doing some very shady, unethical things. She got busted for that, and then she turns around and claims she's an innocent victim. :roll:

[Sombeech]

So I revert back to my questions



So if we can confirm the virus death numbers are being nudged upwards, we have to ask why. We have noticed only in the last week the CDC had to be a little more honest with us. So instead of 60k deaths from COVID, they admitted those numbers came from COVID "or" Flu "or" pneumonia.

Somebody wants the count to be higher. Somebody wants the economy shut down longer. Somebody NEVER wanted Trump to mention HydroxyChloroquine with Zinc as a great remedy (and look at the results, plus look at the criticisms lash out about it). Somebody is contaminating the COVID tests with COVID. These things are happening.