Confederate Statues removed in New Orleans

[Scott P]

OK I have a serious question.

Not so long ago, a lot of people I know were complaining about people flying Mexican flags in the US. These same people are not supporting flying the Confederate Flag. This seems hypocritical to me. What is the difTerence between flying a Mexican Flag and flying a Conferderate Flag?

[Iceaxe]

I don't recall anyone having an issue with anyone flying a Mexican flag, I do remember some having an issue with illegal immigrants.... apple's and oranges...

I'm a Constitutionalist, which means I believe in your right to free speech and expression (among other things). I might not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend your right to say it.

[rockgremlin]

^^^ One symbolizes the complete cessation from the United States of America. While the other is a whole 'nuther country.

Sounds to me like the anti-flag folks are United States or nuthin'.

Did you mean to say the anti-Mexican flag folks are in support of flying the Confederate flag? Cuz that's not how you worded it...

[Scott P]

^^^ One symbolizes the complete cessation from the United States of America. While the other is a whole 'nuther country.

Most of the Western US (including Utah) was part of Mexico just before the Civil War, so the Mexican Flag is just as much part of US History than the Confederate Flag.

We should start erecting statues honoring Santa Anna.

Did you mean to say the anti-Mexican flag folks are in support of flying the Confederate flag? Cuz that's not how you worded it...

Yes, a lot of them are. The same people that shared this kind of stuff on FB and forums are the same ones supporting the Confederate Flag.

Do you want names? I could screen shot their statuses.

I'm a Constitutionalist, which means I believe in your right to free speech and expression (among other things). I might not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend your right to say it.

I respect you for that.

[hank moon]

Says who?

This was a standard and ubiquitous Confederate Soldiers Monument statue common in the south.

Where'd you get information it was a monument to conscripted children???

Edit to add...wasn't the statue called, "Old Joe"? Hardly a child warrior.

http://thefederalistpapers.org/us/on...ges-everything


Via Liz Shield at PJ Media, we learn that this particular statue was meant to commemorate children that the Confederate army conscripted into its service against their will.

So rather than sanitize the Old South, whitewash its cause, or rationalize slavery, this statue actually highlighted a negative aspect of the Confederates’ history, and that aspect was put on display for all to see. Not only did it actually teach something, it spread the message about the Confederacy that these statues’ leftist protesters claim to want!

[twotimer]

Yes, you are a racist.

You also provide a perfect example of the often mocked white privilege. There's probably no one here who thinks you would hire a black man no matter their qualifications. Also, pretty sure you would never rent a place to African Americans either.

I have a saying..."Don't throw a wet blanket over the whole damn thing". In other words, although some stereotypes seem quite fitting, it's foolish to roll the whole crowd into the same spot. You're quite big on the assumptions here, Mr. Fly...and wrong on both counts. Tossin' that blanket around, eh?

In regards to hiring a black person to work for me, I work alone because it's nearly impossible to find someone who will show up on time, work hard all day without unloading their personal issues and drama, is reliable and honest, etc...come in without the baggage and I couldn't care less about skin color.

Also, I own and rent 4 condo's here in my complex. Over the years I've had maybe 15-20 different people come thru. Two of them were black...Vernon and Greg. Vernon lived in one from '06-'14, Greg from '08 to just last month. I would bet my life savings that if you were to declare to them that I was racist, they'd laugh in your face.

I just spent the last two weeks remodeling the one Greg was in, so I soon have to endure the freak show of applicants. I've rejected plenty of people, black and white. A solid job, no convictions, income to support the rent and references that check out are really all that are required for contention, regardless of skin color.

I'm an equal opportunity racist...I wouldn't pick up a gnarly black dude from the side of the road as well as some lily white, wild eyed, scab faced meth head. Risk avoidance...would you pick these people up? Would you take the chance?

If I happened to be near the city park and saw a group of people with helmets, shields and clubs, and they weren't the cops...I'd beat it out of the area quick. I'm curious, Mr. Fly, how far does your loyalty to social justice go? Would you risk injury or death over a statue or confronting some moron wearing a white sheet? I sure as hell wouldn't.

You're certainly right about the white privilege thing. White and trustworthy puts them at ease just as well as a gal with a great rack gets their attention. Mock it all you want...I'll light another fat cigar.

[Scott P]

But I have a definite distrust for black males

Also, I own and rent 4 condo's here in my complex. Over the years I've had maybe 15-20 different people come thru. Two of them were black...Vernon and Greg. Vernon lived in one from '06-'14, Greg from '08 to just last month. I would bet my life savings that if you were to declare to them that I was racist, they'd laugh in your face.

If you didn't trust them, why did you rent to them?

[Iceaxe]

And so it begins.... Chicago Bishop wants George Washington's name removed from park. I told y'all this was coming....

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/08/17...ghborhood.html

[twotimer]

If you didn't trust them, why did you rent to them?

Scott, with all due respect...slow down a little bit and read what I actually wrote, or at least don't chop it up.

I said "gang-banger" types. You know, the ones with the pants hanging down to the knees and the colors. I reckon you don't have many of those up there in Craig, eh? I lived near Los Angeles from '77 to '93. The gang culture clothing emulates prison attire...they are given shoes without laces and no belts, hence the pants hanging down. Both Greg and Vernon were professionals...no drugs, guns or ho's. Just normal dudes.

Believe me, I've had some really rough types trying to rent from me. Trying to shove a handful of cash into my hand for the first month's rent and an application full of lies.

[Scott P]

I said "gang-banger" types.

You said black males, but especially gang banger types. Here is the full quote:

But I have a definite distrust for black males, especially the gnarly gang banger looking type.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Both Greg and Vernon were professionals...no drugs, guns or ho's. Just normal dudes.

So, say that rather than "definite distrust for black males".

I reckon you don't have many of those up there in Craig, eh?

No, but I haven't always lived here. I grew up in bad neighborhoods. My body has a lot of scars on it.

In addition, I was at Fort Wood when some of the St Louis gangs tried to break in to steal machine guns and hand grenades (imagine if gang members really were successful in stealing hand grenades!).

[twotimer]

Alright Scott, there ya go...I should have written that differently, my bad. I'll assume you get the gist of what I'm saying, especially since you've lived in rough places like I have. There are certain people you just are smart to avoid.

I was in Las Vegas in January '16 for 10 days hiking and biking...reading the local paper. A half blind, elderly Mexican man was beaten and shot by 4 gang members, all black and under the age of 20. They killed him for his cell phone. So yeah, I'll cross the street when I see dudes like that coming my way.

Savanna started this thread back in April because some folks were getting butt hurt about these monuments, now people are being beaten and killed over it. The liberal pundits have declared that anyone who supports these things is a racist...I just thought I'd come in an give my personal "racism" a clear definition. I'm not really concerned about the statues...my views are quite personal, and of course I'm criticized for it although I think it's quite logical and reasonable. IMO, of course...but opinions certainly vary.

All of this reminds me of that scene in "Indian Jones and the Holy Grail" where the Nazis are burning piles of books. The lines here are quite blurred...I've decided who the Nazis really are.

[Brian in SLC]

http://thefederalistpapers.org/us/on...ges-everything


Via Liz Shield at PJ Media, we learn that this particular statue was meant to commemorate children that the Confederate army conscripted into its service against their will.

So rather than sanitize the Old South, whitewash its cause, or rationalize slavery, this statue actually highlighted a negative aspect of the Confederates’ history, and that aspect was put on display for all to see. Not only did it actually teach something, it spread the message about the Confederacy that these statues’ leftist protesters claim to want!

Is that what's called, "alt news"...? Or just fake news.

Made up propaganda. Is that's what's called "white washing" history? Ha ha.

There's no mention of children in any of the dedication articles in local newspapers or in the minutes of the "Daughters" notices.

Of course...the fake news person could have misinterpreted what the "children of the confederacy" actually was/is...

[oldno7]

another confederate statue taken down

[oldno7]

,,,,

[oldno7]

...

[Iceaxe]

The real issue is the statues and monuments mean different things to different people.... and some people just can't stand the though that you don't believe as they do.

[Scott P]

The real issue is the statues and monuments mean different things to different people.... and some people just can't stand the though that you don't believe as they do.

This is true and applies equally for both the people who want the statues to stay and the ones who want them to leave.

[Brian in SLC]

This is true and applies equally for both the people who want the statues to stay and the ones who want them to leave.

And...if you spend some time reading the Confederate Veteran and UDOC documents, and get what their mission is, you'll gain a further understanding of what the "lost cause" is about.

So, there's that, then there's the current smoke screen of fake news. Its hard to sort out what is really what.

Until you see video of folks marching, or, talk to someone who's into "the cause". Then, you get it. And you get why these statues mean something to those who want them to stay. And, understand why folks want them pulled down.

I wish the folks that support them, for all the wrong reasons, would rally in an empty field instead of these historical monuments. That'd make this situation easier...!

[savanna3313]

And so it begins.... Chicago Bishop wants George Washington's name removed from park. I told y'all this was coming....

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/08/17...ghborhood.html

From the first post on this thread (by me)

My 2 cents:

With the crime rate and city deterioration escalating daily, this is what the mayor focuses on. (removal of statues) Guess it takes the heat off of him (temporarily) for the sky high murder rate and crime rate. New Orleans (very sadly) is not the city where I was raised any longer. The whole city is history - right or wrong - and what will come next? The French Quarter buildings? D.C. monuments? Where does it stop?

[savanna3313]