Cue the Anti-AR15 Crowd in 3, 2, 1.....

[uintafly]

I think the points brought out in the aforementioned article does a pretty good job at outlining some of the major contributing factors:

https://www.latimes.com/opinion/stor...3kMyudK-g-EuN8

Lots of contributing factors but only one of them is uniquely American..... Easy access to firearms.

[rockgremlin]

^^^Well, sure. But access to firearms isn't the most compelling reason. If folks want to get guns, they're gonna find a way to get guns. Even if guns were 100% outlawed in the US folks would still find a way to access them.

How do you think gang members in the US have so many guns? Is it because they're going through all the proper channels and passing background checks? Not a chance. They're getting them illegally -- a practice that will continue even if guns are banned.

[Goat]

If we took away easy access to guns (which is an American characteristic) these terrorists would just switch to something else, probably bombs.

[Iceaxe]

Lots of contributing factors but only one of them is uniquely American..... Easy access to firearms.

You appear to not understand a very important American concept... The Second Amendment is not about and has never been about saving lives, it's about maintaining the historic amount of freedom we enjoy.

The question you should be asking is are you willing to trade your freedom for security? And if so what will the end result look like? Who will provide the security and how will they provide it? What will the loss of freedom actually cost?

Americans already traded a large amount of their freedom and privacy away in the hope for security after 9-11, are you willing to trade more?



Climb-Utah.com

[rockgremlin]

Here's an interesting interview between Joe Rogan and Bernie.

[uintafly]

You appear to not understand a very important American concept... The Second Amendment is not about and has never been about saving lives, it's about maintaining the historic amount of freedom we enjoy.

The question you should be asking is are you willing to trade your freedom for security? And if so what will the end result look like? Who will provide the security and how will they provide it? What will the loss of freedom actually cost?

Americans already traded a large amount of their freedom and privacy away in the hope for security after 9-11, are you willing to trade more?



Climb-Utah.com

I understand the concept quite well actually, and never called for banning of guns. I just wish we'd be honest and admit that it's a tradeoff we are willing to make. More guns = more freedom = more deaths.

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants, and theater goers, shoppers, concert goers, kindergartners and coworkers.

[Sombeech]

The basis is, do you believe the possession of a gun gives somebody the urge to kill? Or does somebody have the urge to kill and so they obtain what is available, guns, vs explosives, vs vehicles, vs mass poison, vs a box cutter on an airplane.....

[tallsteve]

The basis is, do you believe the possession of a gun gives somebody the urge to kill? Or does somebody have the urge to kill and so they obtain what is available, guns, vs explosives, vs vehicles, vs mass poison, vs a box cutter on an airplane.....

Yep. Plus, if you look through the annual murder data from the CDC, pretty much every state in the union has more murders committed by the use of hands, feet, knives, blunt instruments (hammers, baseball bats, etc) than the entire rifle category combined (which includes AR's). People bent on committing murder will figure out a way to do it with whatever instrument they have on hand.

[oldno7]

Very smart woman, very good, logical read.

Why Red Flag Laws Are Not A Good Solution To Mass Shootings


https://thefederalist.com/2019/08/06...ass-shootings/

[oldno7]

Kinda curious

When was the last call to ban automobiles?

Some drive them drunk and kill people.

[Sombeech]

forget automobiles, why isn't Alcohol banned since it's involved with almost every one of these incidents?

[uintafly]

The basis is, do you believe the possession of a gun gives somebody the urge to kill? Or does somebody have the urge to kill and so they obtain what is available, guns, vs explosives, vs vehicles, vs mass poison, vs a box cutter on an airplane.....

No but it does give them an easy means to do it. Especially when considering moment of passion domestic type killings and suicides. It takes a lot more planning, work ,expertise and time to figure out a way to poison a classroom of school kids than it does to grab your moms gun and head to the local elementary school. I'm not saying any type of gun control would eliminate gun deaths or murder, but it's at least slow it down.

Just like with cars, you will never eliminate vehicle deaths but at least we make some effort in controlling it (licenses, insurance, speed limits, etc.)

[tallsteve]

"Stop the Bleed" class report: It was informative, I learned a lot and glad I went. The class lasted for an hour and a half. I learned how to use and apply a combat application tourniquet (CAT). This type of tourniquet is what the hospital and EMT's use on a daily basis. They covered the different and recommended types of wound bandages. I learned how to properly pack a wound, which is not the same as just applying pressure. I learned how to apply a chest seal. I think they covered everything pretty good without actually taking us to the ER or out into the field to "practice" on actual injuries. I learned I need to add a few more or different items to my trauma kit, like a good pair of medical shears and a CAT. I keep my trauma kit items in the small pouch I've linked below, which stays in my Jeep and I carry on me when I hike, do trailwork, go shooting, etc. I think I'm going to put together another smaller kit that I can attach to my mtn. bike. It'll include a CAT, QuikClot gauze, a couple rolls of sterile gauze and some gauze bandages and tape.

https://www.amazon.com/CONDOR-EMT-Po...-goods&sr=1-20

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

https://www.amazon.com/QuikClot-Adva...3d728b7c977ad2
https://www.tacmedsolutions.com/SOF-Tourniquet-Gen-4

https://www.amazon.com/North-America...language=en_US

I noticed IHC had a bunch of Stop the Bleed courses coming up in the Salt Lake valley here soon. Just google it. They are free.
For you boaters out there, our instructors said they have seen more boating accidents this year than ever before which are requiring tourniquets. So, keep one or two in your boats and know how to use them.

[rockgremlin]

forget automobiles, why isn't Alcohol banned since it's involved with almost every one of these incidents?

They tried that already.

Didn't work. Criminals were more than willing to fill the demand.

[devo_stevo]

Here's an interesting interview between Joe Rogan and Bernie.

This is great. Thanks for posting it. Here's the thing. I think that when you get Bernie away from all of the other crazies and talk to the guy, I don't think that he wants anything different than what I want for the country. I would assume that most people are this way. All they want is for people to be able to go out and do what they want to do and feel safe while doing it.

I diverge from his views when he starts to talk about how to fix it, though (there are a few things that I agree with, but not all).

This is why I hate the news media and political debates and all that crap. It's not real. It's all designed to highlight the bad parts of someone else's views and shine a light on how awesome you are because they are terrible. All that while at the core of it, we are all trying to get the same things. We just have to listen to each other and agree to have an adult conversation without acting like big babies if we don't get our way.

[oldno7]

Many here and in this country have little knowledge as to what a right is--as guaranteed by the Constitution

The Constitution did not give citizens any rights, it merely protected the ones we are born with, (inalienable).

[devo_stevo]

Many here and in this country have little knowledge as to what a right is--as guaranteed by the Constitution

The Constitution did not give citizens any rights, it merely protected the ones we are born with, (inalienable).

I'm with you on this. I am not in favor of gun bans. This is one of the things I disagree with Bernie about. He mentioned the assault weapon ban of '94 to '04. He seems to think that was so awesome. There is no evidence that it helped at all. The number of shootings didn't go down in any measurable way that can be attributed to the ban.

Like I said. It would be nice to be able to sit down and have a grown up conversation without everybody getting all butthurt because someone doesn't think just like you.

[oldno7]

The "right" to keep and bear arms



A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

The conversation from this side, is and will always remain----shall not be infringed.

Theres solid history to back the thought process behind the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution.

To compare the United States to any other nation is non sequitur.

The 2nd amendment guarantees who we are and that we remain that way--Free.

All the talk and acceptance of socialism only draws more emphasis to the need for our 2nd amendment, to the Constitution.


Theres so many easy solutions to the violence problem and most are already law, which due to political correctness, we CHOOSE not to enforce.

[devo_stevo]

Theres so many easy solutions to the violence problem and most are already law, which due to political correctness, we CHOOSE not to enforce.

A-freaking-men to this. I haven't heard a single argument for a new law that would have prevented any of the shootings that we've had so far. Just enforce the laws that are already out there. We don't need more than we have already.

[tallsteve]

If you don't already follow John Correia, from Active Self Protection, on facebook and youtube, you should. Mostly he analyzes real-life defensive shooting videos. Here, he's discussing violent video game and psych meds in relation to violence. What he says here is the same conclusion I've come to after reading many of the studies he references.