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Thread: Outdoor Retailer Show Boycott in Utah

  1. #161
    Compromise goes both ways, and this is an honest question, what did the convention agree to give up on, what were they willing to abandon so they could meet in the middle?
    For years the Outdoor Retailer Trade Show agreed to keep the show in Utah as long as Utah didn't always oppose designations of wilderness and monuments. For 20+ years Utah politicians kept telling the show that they will do more to support wildlands, but they seldom did (though admittedly a few token gestures were made). The Outdoor Retailer Trade Show stayed anyway in good faith, despite broken promises.

    Concering specific examples of compromise, when Utah politicians were against the Redrocks Bill, for example, the Show still agreed to stay. This was certainly compromise. As far as I know the show never said that they would leave unless 100% of their demands were met.

    When the retailers themselves started pulling out of the show or boycotting it, the Show really had little choice. They can't stay in business if a lot of the business that support the show were boycotting it or pulling out. It was an economic decision. Here is a pretty good article explaining why they left:

    https://www.outsideonline.com/215593...k-against-utah
    Utah is a very special and unique place. There is no where else like it on earth. Please take care of it and keep the remaining wild areas in pristine condition. The world will be a better place if you do.

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  3. #162
    Give me a reason not to ghost this place... Dirk deserves better than this.

  4. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by DirkHammergate View Post
    Give me a reason not to ghost this place... Dirk deserves better than this.

    Do you like Slot Machine's posts?
    It's only "science" if it supports the narrative.

  5. Likes uintafly, twotimer, jman liked this post
  6. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott P View Post
    For years the Outdoor Retailer Trade Show agreed to keep the show in Utah as long as Utah didn't always oppose designations of wilderness and monuments.
    So they "compromised" by tolerating the political environment of Utah, waiting for them to change their mind?

    Compromising means more than just "putting up with somebody else". It means to meet in the middle, not to wait and wait for the opposition to finally agree with you.

    I surely hope that's not how they define their compromise, to "continue to do business in Utah". Damn. Each opposing side gives something up, meets in the middle.

    "Waiting it out" is not compromising. I hope they have a better example than that when they tell how they compromised for 20+ years.

  7. Likes Udink liked this post
  8. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by Sombeech View Post
    Compromising means more than just "putting up with somebody else". It means to meet in the middle, not to wait and wait for the opposition to finally agree with you.
    Repeat.... Echo Chamber.

  9. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by DirkHammergate View Post
    Repeat.... Echo Chamber.
    And you can chat with me on AIM, Hotmail or Yahoo messenger,

    The end!

  10. #167
    Each opposing side gives something up, meets in the middle.
    They did try to meet in the middle by accepting much less wildlands protection than they thought was needed. That is giving something up, whether or not it is important to you. It was important to them and to me as well. Just because money wasn't exchanged doesn't mean that something wasn't given up.

    If the lawmakers Utah would have met in the middle in years past, it is likely that the show would have stayed. Now days too many people (yes on both sides) want an all or nothing approach.
    Utah is a very special and unique place. There is no where else like it on earth. Please take care of it and keep the remaining wild areas in pristine condition. The world will be a better place if you do.

  11. #168
    Well I might not be quiet out just yet. The teenagers want a Estes Large Stromblie with marinara, to Go!! BRB

  12. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by DirkHammergate View Post
    Give me a reason not to ghost this place... Dirk deserves better than this.
    What's the matter? Stealing Wi-Fi from the bar next door not working as smoothly as you had hoped?

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  14. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by Iceaxe View Post
    What's the matter? Stealing Wi-Fi from the bar next door not working as smoothly as you had hoped?
    I wouldn't mind living in those days again. Goofail is underwhelming in the Hood.

  15. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by Sombeech View Post
    Yep, if it comes from Colorado or Florida, I'm biking when it gets to me in 2 days from Amazon prime. If I'm a Utah bike parts seller/manufacturer, I'm not moving my shop to Colorado just because the crybabies picked up their event and moved it.

    Still kinda waiting to hear how I want to level a monument. Don't get distracted by the shiny object, now.
    Off the top of my head I don't know of any outdoor related company in Utah leaving to go to Colorado based on the stance of Outdoor Retailers Association.

    The damage has already be done whether the monuments stay, go or are modified. I wasn't in favor of BENM but the fight for and against has done nothing but bring unwanted attention to a beautiful part of the state. And with the attention comes overuse and overcrowding.

    Taking the E bike to St George? It should be a great weekend.

  16. #172
    Quote Originally Posted by middlefork View Post

    Taking the E bike to St George? It should be a great weekend.
    I don't own an ebike, but I'll ride one every chance I get just to watch people freak out at the "trail damage"

  17. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by middlefork View Post
    .... but the fight for and against has done nothing but bring unwanted attention to a beautiful part of the state. And with the attention comes overuse and overcrowding.
    ^^This^^. It's been interesting to be a part of conversations with my Utah friends when they start berating the move to downscale BENM. The question I always ask them is this- before the National Monument designation or before discussions about creating the monument even began, had you ever been there or even heard of the Bears Ear area? I have yet to have even one of them answer "yes". NOT A ONE. And, these are Utah residents. Now, they all want to go there.
    Are we there yet?

  18. #174
    Quote Originally Posted by tallsteve View Post
    ^^This^^. It's been interesting to be a part of conversations with my Utah friends when they start berating the move to downscale BENM. The question I always ask them is this- before the National Monument designation or before discussions about creating the monument even began, had you ever been there or even heard of the Bears Ear area? I have yet to have even one of them answer "yes". NOT A ONE. And, these are Utah residents. Now, they all want to go there.
    Maybe they haven't heard of it in context with the Bears Ears, but for sure a lot of people have heard of places in the Monument such as Grand Gulch, Black Hole, Fish Creek, Dark Canyon, etc. Those are household names for anyone familiar with hiking in Utah.
    Utah is a very special and unique place. There is no where else like it on earth. Please take care of it and keep the remaining wild areas in pristine condition. The world will be a better place if you do.

  19. #175
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott P View Post
    Maybe they haven't heard of it in context with the Bears Ears, but for sure a lot of people have heard of places in the Monument such as Grand Gulch, Black Hole, Fish Creek, Dark Canyon, etc. Those are household names for anyone familiar with hiking in Utah.
    Uh, no. They couldn't tell me anything about what's within the boundary. This has been consistent with 6 or 7 of my far left leaning friends. Granted, outside of only one of them, the others idea of enjoying the great outdoors is walking from their air conditioned condos to their Prius. I'm just saying that most people haven't been there and don't know anything about it. Then when this all came up, it's now life and death.
    Are we there yet?

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  21. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by tallsteve View Post
    Uh, no. They couldn't tell me anything about what's within the boundary. This has been consistent with 6 or 7 of my far left leaning friends. Granted, outside of only one of them, the others idea of enjoying the great outdoors is walking from their air conditioned condos to their Prius. I'm just saying that most people haven't been there and don't know anything about it. Then when this all came up, it's now life and death.
    Your friends need to get out more.
    Utah is a very special and unique place. There is no where else like it on earth. Please take care of it and keep the remaining wild areas in pristine condition. The world will be a better place if you do.

  22. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott P View Post
    Your friends need to get out more.
    Maybe I just need new friends.
    Are we there yet?

  23. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by tallsteve View Post
    Uh, no. They couldn't tell me anything about what's within the boundary. This has been consistent with 6 or 7 of my far left leaning friends. Granted, outside of only one of them, the others idea of enjoying the great outdoors is walking from their air conditioned condos to their Prius. I'm just saying that most people haven't been there and don't know anything about it. Then when this all came up, it's now life and death.
    I'll admit to being in that same boat. I had to google around a fair bit to figure out what was in, what wasn't. Its a huge area. And, I'm very familiar with most of it just not what the actual "Bear's Ears" monument actually included.

    Sure, its brought attention to it. Maybe take some pressure off of poor over loved Zion...ha ha.

  24. #179
    Quote Originally Posted by middlefork View Post
    Off the top of my head I don't know of any outdoor related company in Utah leaving to go to Colorado based on the stance of Outdoor Retailers Association.
    Well...they all are...in terms of attending the OR trade show. It isn't here anymore.

    But, yeah, haven't heard of any pulling up manufacturing stakes to move to 'Rado. BD still here. Liberty. Petzl USA. Etc. And, there are plenty of good reasons why.

  25. #180

    Outdoor Retailer Show Boycott in Utah

    Just got this email...

    “Registration for Summer Market is now open. Join the rest of the outdoor industry at the Colorado Convention Center in Denver, CO from July 23-26, 2018.”

    Uh. Nope.


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