Markin your rope ?

[dakotabelliston]

!!! Newby question alert !!!

I've heard a lot of discrepancy on how to properly mark the center of your rope:
Sharpy (Said to possibly cause core damage)
Laundry Marker (Seams to be most popular)
Tape (Hate this idea as it wears off quickly during pull & rappels)
Sewing thread into the rope

Just curious what everyone is doing & why. I would like to start marking a couple of my ropes so it's easier to find midline.

Thank you !!!

[ratagonia]

!!! Newby question alert !!!

I've heard a lot of discrepancy on how to properly mark the center of your rope:
Sharpy (Said to possibly cause core damage)
Laundry Marker (Seams to be most popular)
Tape (Hate this idea as it wears off quickly during pull & rappels)
Sewing thread into the rope

Just curious what everyone is doing & why. I would like to start marking a couple of my ropes so it's easier to find midline.

Thank you !!!

Beal Rope Marker

it is like an inkwell, and puts out a lot of ink. So the mark will be big and dark and last a while.

Sharpie/Laundry Marker seems to work for one or two trips, but fades quickly. Unlikely to effect the core of the rope, and unlikely to effect the sheath. The plastics (etc.) used to make ropes are robust and not easily damaged, except by strong acids, strong bases and chlorine bleach.

Tape has never worked so well for me, can get caught in your rappel device, and also tends to move.

BEST is to use techniques that do not require you to know where the center of your rope is. There are a few times when it is helpful... but not many.

Tom

http://www.store.canyoneeringusa.com...tegory=2490810

[dakotabelliston]

Thanks for the response Tom !!! I have not had many issues with not having my rope marked, but always good to have when you know the rappel is ~90-100 feet & you can't see the bottom Couple raps in Spry).

[Rob L]

Delete

[Sandstone Addiction]

BEST is to use techniques that do not require you to know where the center of your rope is.

Besides actually seeing the rope at the bottom...what other techniques are there?

[ratagonia]

Besides actually seeing the rope at the bottom...what other techniques are there?

Basic can't see the bottom technique, non-flowing-water canyon

(length of rappel not known, but, known to be less than the length of the rope. The hope is that the rappel is less than twice the length of the rope, so the single rope can be both the pull side and the rappel side.)

1. Secure the top of the rope to the anchor.

2. First person rappels to the bottom.

2A. some discussion ensues: "How much rope is down there in the bag?" "What??" "How much rope?" "A lot" "How much is a lot?" "Oh, 20 feet at least"... Very helpful if both the top person and the bottom person know what is going to happen.

3. Set the length of the rappel:

A. Top person pulls the rope up until the bottom person says stop. If the rappel is clean, after pulling up 20 feet, the top person can throw the free end toward the bottom.

B. Bottom person says stop when either: the free end reaches the ground OR the bag end (already down) runs out of rope. To put it another way, the duty of the bottom person is to not let the end that is already down (that reaches the ground) get away. (Sometimes communication is difficult. Sometimes the bottom end needs to be held onto so the top person does not pull too much of it up).

C. Top person throws down the free end. Does it reach?

D. Top person re-blocks the anchor (or sets up for double-strand rappel).

EZ simple.

Variations:

I: If the rappel line is clean, before rope is pulled up, the bottom person can tie a knot in the rope. Top person pulls up rope (through the ring) until the knot hits the ring. Voila - both ends are long enough.

II: If the rappel is longer than half the length, then it can still be pulled up and the length set. Then a cord is tied to the pull side, and someone can rap down with this, letting the pull side flake out of the bag on the way down. Or thrown.

III: it is nice to leave a few feet extra on the bottom so that a bottom belay can be made, with enough slack for the bottom belayer to be out of the target zone.

Tom

[Brian in SLC]

Besides actually seeing the rope at the bottom...what other techniques are there?

Thread one end of the rope, match the ends, and pull it through. Should set on the middle. If you rappel both sides, you can lock off the short end with one hand and feed with the other to equal the ends (advanced technique, not for everyone). Double strand rappel.

Of course that's be if you were pretty sure of both your rope length and the rap length, but, still couldn't see the bottom.

Standard rappel off the Grand Teton has an undercut bottom so you can't see if your ropes reach. Common to match ends and feed over the lip, then rap down to the breakover point and get a visual. Be sure to be able to ascend back up to the anchor if need be (ie, the rope ends are an unsafe distance in the air).

[Slot Machine]

Just curious what everyone is doing & why. I would like to start marking a couple of my ropes so it's easier to find midline.

I use a Sharpie because it is cheap and convenient. I make obnoxiously long marks about 1-2 feet long in the middle of my ropes, so that my eyes won't miss them. I redo the marks whenever they fade, maybe once every year or two.

[ratagonia]

Thread one end of the rope, match the ends, and pull it through. Should set on the middle. If you rappel both sides, you can lock off the short end with one hand and feed with the other to equal the ends (advanced technique, not for everyone). Double strand rappel.

Of course that's be if you were pretty sure of both your rope length and the rap length, but, still couldn't see the bottom.

Standard rappel off the Grand Teton has an undercut bottom so you can't see if your ropes reach. Common to match ends and feed over the lip, then rap down to the breakover point and get a visual. Be sure to be able to ascend back up to the anchor if need be (ie, the rope ends are an unsafe distance in the air).

Yes, that method works most of the time.

Only a few deaths a year because it does not work all the time.

Tom

[Brian in SLC]

Yes, that method works most of the time.

Only a few deaths a year because it does not work all the time.

Tom

Yeah...especially when someone moves a rappel anchor.

[moab mark]

I: If the rappel line is clean, before rope is pulled up, the bottom person can tie a knot in the rope. Top person pulls up rope (through the ring) until the knot hits the ring. Voila - both ends are long enough.


I like this one Tom. Good idea, no need for communication.

Even better have guy on ground put a biner block in the rope and then the guy at top is ready to roll when the biner hits the anchor.

[Brian in SLC]

I: If the rappel line is clean, before rope is pulled up, the bottom person can tie a knot in the rope. Top person pulls up rope (through the ring) until the knot hits the ring. Voila - both ends are long enough.


I like this one Tom. Good idea, no need for communication.

Even better have guy on ground put a biner block in the rope and then the guy at top is ready to roll when the biner hits the anchor.

Knot and/or block get stuck in crack on the pull back up. Now what? (Recent guide death in the Tetons after a rope stuck on the pull back up)

Geez...match the rope ends and toss. Then rappel. If you don't know the length, and, have two lengths of rope, tie 'em together and rappel.

Its...just...not...that...complicated...

[Brian in SLC]

For waterfall descents:

https://www.petzl.com/GB/en/Sport/Se...g#.V7vTLWnnbIU

[moab mark]

Where in that scenerio is 2 strands being used? Sometimes......its......a......bit......more...... complicated......

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[Iceaxe]

I use a Sharpie because it is cheap and convenient. I make obnoxiously long marks about 1-2 feet long in the middle of my ropes, so that my eyes won't miss them. I redo the marks whenever they fade, maybe once every year or two.

X2

I mark my centers with a Sharpie and the mark is about 12" long. I also mark my ropes at 1/4 and 3/4. But that is mostly to help me measure heights for writing beta. The Sharpie lasts several years if you do a good job.

[dakotabelliston]

People suggesting to grab both ends, measure, and throw works great if you don't have a rope bag. With increasing use of rope bags you don't know how much rope you have pulled. I find it interesting how many people are using the sharpy method. I guess this debunks the myth that sharpys will potentially damage your rope core.

Thank you for all the input !! I'm kinda thinking maybe running with Toms idea of the Rope marker (even though it cost 15 bones) it should apply easily & hopefully last well. Now if my rope bags will arrive before my Ouray canyon trip coming up in 2 weeks............

[moab mark]

If your bags don't show up and you want to drive to Kaysville i've got some you can borrow. Got 2 or 3 brand new ones I just picked up.

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[Brian in SLC]

People suggesting to grab both ends, measure, and throw works great if you don't have a rope bag. With increasing use of rope bags you don't know how much rope you have pulled.

A method I use...is...my standard length of rope between my arm lengths, at a comforatable distance, is 5 feet (my "wingspan is around 6', ape index not counted...ha ha).

So, I'd count the number of arm lengths of rope out of a bag. If I needed a 100 feet, 20 arms lengths should do the trick. It's kind of a fun game to play...

Easy to try. Find the middle of your rope. Put a bit in it, now, stuff it in your rope bag. Pull out a number of arms lengths, measure the distance. Voila.

Not saying I'd trust this blindly, but, its a pretty easy way to calculate the amount of rope you have out. 5, 10, 15, 20...100. Toss. See if you're at the middle.

Also works if you trust your beta for a drop. Say, a 40 foot rappel. Chunk out 10 arms lengths of rope (40 + 10 feet for margin). Drop that 50' of rope. Drop the rope bag. Voila. Fast and easy.

Anyhoo...works for me. With or without a rope bag.

KISS.

[dakotabelliston]

Thank you so much for the offer !!! Just talked with the company and rope bags won't be here until middle of September (grrrrr). I got it covered though. Another member of my group has a couple that he's going to bring. I will offer up my rope & he will offer up his rope bag. Even trade right ? Thanks for the offer Mark !!!

On another note. Did anyone notice that I even type in my Spanish Fork accent ???? Just noticed I typed "MARKIN" lol instead of marking.

If your bags don't show up and you want to drive to Kaysville i've got some you can borrow. Got 2 or 3 brand new ones I just picked up.

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[Canyonero]

Beal Rope Marker

it is like an inkwell, and puts out a lot of ink. So the mark will be big and dark and last a while.

Sharpie/Laundry Marker seems to work for one or two trips, but fades quickly. Unlikely to effect the core of the rope, and unlikely to effect the sheath. The plastics (etc.) used to make ropes are robust and not easily damaged, except by strong acids, strong bases and chlorine bleach.

Tape has never worked so well for me, can get caught in your rappel device, and also tends to move.

BEST is to use techniques that do not require you to know where the center of your rope is. There are a few times when it is helpful... but not many.

Agree on all points. I've used sharpie for years on both canyon and climbing ropes. It doesn't damage the rope. In fact, it might not even be there after the trip. I get half a season out of it on a climbing rope, but probably only one wet canyon. The Beal Rope Marker lasts longer and goes on faster, but it's kind of messy sometimes.

I like marking my ropes because it helps me measure stuff. I not only mark the half, but also the quarters (different mark) but it's far more useful when climbing than canyoneering. "Half rope!" "3/4 rope" "20 more feet" etc.