HEAPS/IMLAY during 1st week of June

[nkanarik]

I'm planning a 10 day trip during the last week of May / beginning of June and had a few questions:

1. Is it reasonable to do Heaps during this time of the year (assuming no forecast of rain)...if not, when?
2. Is it reasonable to do Imlay during this time of the year (assuming no forecast of rain)...if not, when?
3. Is it reasonable to do both in the same week? If so...which one should be 1st?
4. Current plan (draft "0")
   
   1. 5/28 - Hike up from Grotto and camp at the crossroads
   2. 5/29 - Complete Imlay in the (early?) afternoon
   3. 5/30 - Rest day
   4. 5/31 - Hike from Lava Point towards Phantom valley; camp somewhere safe in the canyon
   5. 6/1 - Complete Heaps

Any advice is welcome!!!

[Brian in SLC]

Folks routinely and easily do Imlay via the "short cut" from the Grotto to the crossroads in a day (long day, but, a day). I'd suggest just getting up earlier and doing that, versus hiking all of whatever your camping stuff might be.

Yeah, that time of year can be fine.

I'd do Imlay first and see how long it takes your party. Whether or not you do Heaps as an overnighter would depend on how Imlay went.

Cheers.

[Taylor]

Heaps in June:

1. Longest days of the year.
2. Pre-monsoon.
3. Warm summer temps.

Seems ideal to me.

[ratagonia]

I'm planning a 10 day trip during the last week of May / beginning of June and had a few questions:

1. Is it reasonable to do Heaps during this time of the year (assuming no forecast of rain)...if not, when?
2. Is it reasonable to do Imlay during this time of the year (assuming no forecast of rain)...if not, when?
3. Is it reasonable to do both in the same week? If so...which one should be 1st?
4. Current plan (draft "0")
   
   1. 5/28 - Hike up from Grotto and camp at the crossroads
   2. 5/29 - Complete Imlay in the (early?) afternoon
   3. 5/30 - Rest day
   4. 5/31 - Hike from Lava Point towards Phantom valley; camp somewhere safe in the canyon
   5. 6/1 - Complete Heaps

Any advice is welcome!!!

Folks routinely and easily do Imlay via the "short cut" from the Grotto to the crossroads in a day (long day, but, a day). I'd suggest just getting up earlier and doing that, versus hiking all of whatever your camping stuff might be.

Yeah, that time of year can be fine.

I'd do Imlay first and see how long it takes your party. Whether or not you do Heaps as an overnighter would depend on how Imlay went.

Cheers.

Having done both canyons several times, both as single-day pushes and as a ultralight one-nighter; gotta say, carrying the extra baggage is a real pain. I suggest doing both as single pushes.

A lot depends on the weather. Usually both Imlay and Heaps are full of water from snowmelt on June 1, assuming there is snow this year. But not always, and they can be quite dry. Or one wet and the other dry. Generally a good time of year to do them, especially Heaps, because they are likely to be full. But maybe not.

If the weather is hot, best to get an early early start, and do in one day. We hiked up to the West Rim to bivy once, in July, for Heaps, and it was still over 90 degrees at 7 pm when hiking up. It sucked - as in, it sucked 4 quarts of water out of my body. Getting a serious pre-dawn start and hiking in the cold is very helpful when it is hot out. (Unlikely to be superhot June 1 timeframe, but it has happened.)

It is a 10-day trip? I would suggest doing Imlay one of the first things; then Heaps one of the last things. Will give you greater separation in your mind between the two canyons, the two best in Zion. Will make for a richer experience. Will also allow you more time to digest what you learned in Imlay to apply to Heaps. (Imlay definitely first). Really, my advice is to not do both on the same trip, partly for these reasons above, but... I am reluctant to offer that advice as it can easily be objected to on the basis of 'eliteism'. Hard to know your skill level. Your questions indicate either a lack of experience or a lack of specific experience to Zion.

Yesterday I did a canyon that I should have shown more respect for. Checkerboard is a long canyon; the days are short right now. We got a late start - meet at 7:00 (plan, actual=7:30), start hiking at 8:30. Walked out to the Temple of Sinawava at 11:30 pm. It worked out, but... We should have started 2 hours earlier (but I did not want to start that early: I like sleeping, and it is cold cold cold at that hour). I did not push the pace as well as I could have. I did not give the "fear of God" pep talk, which might have cut an hour out. We got bogged down making a few anchors with very little material available. Etc. Etc. The last 45 minutes of the canyon took 2 hours, because it was dark. The walk out the Narrows took 4 hours, rather than the usual 3.

There is nothing wrong with respecting the canyons. Imlay is a great, beautiful, fun and at times challenging canyon. Enjoy it. Heaps is a great, beautiful, fun and at times very challenging canyon, with a 500 foot 3-rappel sequence at the end of the day. It helps to have a "rigger" to figure out and manage the final rappel sequence. (As usual, I could go on for hours in this vein, but I think you know this story. Don't be too fixated on achieving the goal. Gravity does not care that you are a great person.)

[nkanarik]

Thanks Tom for the detailed response!!!

• I see your point about "diluting" the experience if doing both in the same week.
  
  • The reason I had them both is due to some international traveling (getting more bang for your buck) --> I'm open for ANY other alternatives
  • The reason I had them b2b is because we were thinking of moving to Escalante area (Headless Hen) after Zion --> I'm open for ANY other alternatives
  
  
• As for experience
  
  • The guys already did some of the following canyons in the US (more overseas):
    
    • Zion: Echo, Spry, Pine, Mystery, Keyhole, Yankee, Birch
    • SRS/NW: Cable, Quandary, Zero Gravity, Morocco, Hogwarts
    • Moab: Granary, Rock of ages, Entrajo
    • Escalante: Neon, Spencer
    
    
  • Team has experience with natural anchors and pothole escapes

[Brian in SLC]

The reason I had them both is due to some international traveling (getting more bang for your buck) --> I'm open for ANY other alternatives

Pretty fair amount of experience.

I might toss out Englestead as an option if you wanted the 300 foot rappel experience but on the front end while you're fresh.

Kolob has a bunch of rappels and is a great canyon. Be a good option as well as long as the water flow is reasonable (ie, minimal). The hike out the narrows would punch that ticket as well. Best long canyon system in Zion? Maybe.

Imlay, then see how worked you are with Heaps as an option if Imlay went well. Plus, a flexible schedule might be best given what the current conditions might suggest when you're there.

Having traveled internationally for canyons, I'll say there's no need to bypass the best canyons unless you physically just can't do them safely. None of us do, that's for sure. You got a top ten list, go for it!

[ratagonia]

Thanks Tom for the detailed response!!!

• I see your point about "diluting" the experience if doing both in the same week.
  
  • The reason I had them both is due to some international traveling (getting more bang for your buck) --> I'm open for ANY other alternatives
  • The reason I had them b2b is because we were thinking of moving to Escalante area (Headless Hen) after Zion --> I'm open for ANY other alternatives
  
  
• As for experience
  
  • The guys already did some of the following canyons in the US (more overseas):
    
    • Zion: Echo, Spry, Pine, Mystery, Keyhole, Yankee, Birch
    • SRS/NW: Cable, Quandary, Zero Gravity, Morocco, Hogwarts
    • Moab: Granary, Rock of ages, Entrajo
    • Escalante: Neon, Spencer
    
    
  • Team has experience with natural anchors and pothole escapes

Thanks.

I do not see any canyons on your list that are more than half-day canyons. Looks like you have plenty of experience at the shortish canyon level. This could be a problem as both Imlay and Heaps are LONG, and are best dealt with by travelling efficiently.

You might try Telephunin as a warmup - Telephone, then Behunin. Assuming it is not too hot out. But it hits Behunin in the late afternoon so it tends to work out.

If you are going in and out of Las Vegas, you might hit Zion for a few days, then escape to Escalante, then back to Zion. Rest days are good times to drive. Headless Hen and similar canyons out in Zion are challenging to do when it is hot out, which it might be.

Some other good canyons to put on your agenda, which are harder than the resume above, but easier than Heaps and Imlay, are Not-Imlay and Jacob. Jacob faces south so not so good if it is hot out. Not Imlay has TWO big rappels, so you guyz can get tuned up on that.

Tom

[nkanarik]

Thank you Tom and Brian!!!
I will investigate the various options (including the "Zion -->Escalante-->Zion" hopping )

In case that we end up doing these 3 canyons, I'm planning on using the following Betas as primary betas for my planning...let me know if you have different preferences :)

• Imlay: climb-utah
• Heaps: canyoneeringusa
• HH: climb-utah

Canyons that were mentioned in this thread and we might end up doing

• Kolob: climb-utah
• Not Imlay: canyoneeringusa
• Englestead: climb-utah
• Jacob (most likely won't do): ???

[ratagonia]

Thank you Tom and Brian!!!
I will investigate the various options (including the "Zion -->Escalante-->Zion" hopping )

In case that we end up doing these 3 canyons, I'm planning on using the following Betas as primary betas for my planning...let me know if you have different preferences :)

• Imlay: climb-utah
• Heaps: canyoneeringusa
• HH: climb-utah

Canyons that were mentioned in this thread and we might end up doing

• Kolob: climb-utah
• Not Imlay: canyoneeringusa
• Englestead: climb-utah
• Jacob (most likely won't do): ???

Here's the beta on Jacob:

http://www.canyoneeringusa.com/rave/...ure-june-2013/

Tom

[nkanarik]

Ok...so I started looking into doing Imlay in one day, and was wondering what's the drawback if doing Full vs. Sneak route...I see no benefit for doing Sneak (other than easier logistics), but then again, the route exists and folks are doing it, so I was wondering what I'm missing...From CUSA Betas seems like both are ~same time, easier approach with Full route, more "canyoneering" time with Full route, etc...

[ratagonia]

Ok...so I started looking into doing Imlay in one day, and was wondering what's the drawback if doing Full vs. Sneak route...I see no benefit for doing Sneak (other than easier logistics), but then again, the route exists and folks are doing it, so I was wondering what I'm missing...From CUSA Betas seems like both are ~same time, easier approach with Full route, more "canyoneering" time with Full route, etc...

Hmmmm...

Certainly the logistics are easier.

I would say that the Full is about 2 hours longer than the sneak. I'd put it as 4 hours from Potato Hollow to the Crossroads, and 2 hrs to PH from the Trailhead. Whereas the Sneak approach to the Crossroads is almost always, for me, 4 hours.

Whether that gets reflected in the Beta is another matter.

Tom

[Iceaxe]

Ok...so I started looking into doing Imlay in one day, and was wondering what's the drawback if doing Full vs. Sneak route...I see no benefit for doing Sneak (other than easier logistics), but then again, the route exists and folks are doing it, so I was wondering what I'm missing...

The sneak is by far the more popular of the two options for the simple reason it's the biggest bang for the buck.

Perhaps the time/energy saved by doing the sneak could be put to a better use than doing a full Imlay?

There is a reason certain routes are more popular than others. My advice to those visiting Zion from far away is always the same. Do the popular stuff first before going after the obscure.

FWIW: Englestead and Misery are two popular/awesome canyons I don't see on your resume. I also like Checkerboard but it's a very long day, which is a big reason it's not more popular.