Advice for a visiting Aussie - What region should I visit? (In UT/AZ)

[patto]

Hey!

So it looks like I'll be in the US for most of September. I'll be doing a bunch of rock climbing but I'm thinking of fitting some canyoneering into the trip too. A couple of days of canyons would suit me. So where is best to visit?

Most of my canyoneering experience is in the Blue Mountains, Australia. I've done wet/dry canyons and I'm a very experienced rappeller. Though I have no experience with the more technical types of things like potholes and no trace anchors. I want to do some fun cayonings with some decent sized rappels but I have no intention of doing highly technical canyons.

So does anybody have any recommendations on regions to look at or even specific canyons? I'll probably be flying into Vegas before I hit the canyons so I'll be driving out from there to Utah or Arizona.

Thanks! :-)


For those who are curious here are google images of Blue Mountains Canyoneering

[Scott P]

In my opinion, the Escalante river region and Zion are the most beautiful areas in the canyon country, but Zion has a fair amount of red tape and camping is much more restricted in that area than in most of the rest of canyon country. For that reason, Escalante is my favorite (even though I still like Zion a lot). Some canyons in the Escalante are really hard, but there are plenty of moderate ones too.

The area around Navajo Mountain is also very scenic as well, but you have to have a Navajo permit.

The Robbers Roost area is pretty good too.

[patto]

Red tape isn't something I'm excited about dealing with. I have been to Zion, but I haven't been cayoneering there. Ok, I'll start doing my research on Escalante. Though I'll still welcome other people's opinions.

Thanks!

[Bo_Beck]

Red tape isn't something I'm excited about dealing with. I have been to Zion, but I haven't been cayoneering there. Ok, I'll start doing my research on Escalante. Though I'll still welcome other people's opinions.

Thanks!

Shouldn't have too many problems with "Red Tape" in Zion in September? Who knows....maybe...maybe not? It might be worth a try to apply for something...Pine Creek, Heaps (pothole potential in this one), Behunin, Englestead (potential shuttle issue with this one), Imlay (pothole potential in this one).Most all of these can be done with minimal logistics...i.e. shuttle issues. Oh yeah! And Kolob Creek!

[Slot Machine]

I wouldn't worry too much about red tape, unless you want to do The Subway. Go ahead and take that canyon off the list right now.

The weather is something to consider. The first week of September can be scorching hot. The last week in September tends to be much more mild. October/April tend to be the best months to do canyons outside of Zion.

Since you are flying into Vegas, I'd stick with wet canyons in Zion to minimize your drive time. Bo's recommendations above are very good, I'd stick with those.

[Iceaxe]

I wouldn't worry too much about red tape,

^^^THIS^^^

Just be versatile when visiting Zion NP, have several options, put in for the advanced lottery, put in for the last chance lottery. There are enough canyons near Zion that don't require permits it's easy to mix and match with the canyons you do draw out for.


And if I had never been to the east side of Utah to visit the Moab/Arches/Canyonlands region that area would be extremely high on my to-do list, particularly if you want to do a bunch of rock climbing.

[patto]

Thanks everyone for all the advice. I'll be looking at the Zion canyons too.

And if I had never been to the east side of Utah to visit the Moab/Arches/Canyonlands region that area would be extremely high on my to-do list, particularly if you want to do a bunch of rock climbing.

I haven't, but don't tempt me or I'll never come home! Last time I was in the region I did 4 months of climbing! This trip will be a bit shorter for time and cost reasons. I will be spending close to 2 weeks in Yosemite prior with a dozen other people. Looking forward to enjoying the big easy peaks of Tuolumne Meadows in early September.

I'm hoping to hit these Canyons with a Vegas friend. Though if he can't join, then I may try to meet up with others to hit some canyons. Is this a good place for a shout out for willing partners? Or is there a more useful message board for Zion Canyoneers?

(Looking at some of the awesome big Zion canyons makes me think that it could just be simpler to get a guide. My friend is less experienced and getting a guide just makes things easier. Though it is something I'd prefer to avoid, in the canyons here I am normally the one leading my group down these things.)

[Scott P]

Is this a good place for a shout out for willing partners?

Yes.

[TommyBoy]

Also you will want to be aware of this http://www.zioncanyonrendezvous.com/
It makes getting partners a lot easier, but also means that there will be more competition for canyons. I haven't been since Dark Horse took over since I don't feel like paying 150$ when I tend to do my own thing and cook for myself and I like to camp down in the park, but I've heard they do a really good job.

[ratagonia]

Thanks everyone for all the advice. I'll be looking at the Zion canyons too.

I haven't, but don't tempt me or I'll never come home! Last time I was in the region I did 4 months of climbing! This trip will be a bit shorter for time and cost reasons. I will be spending close to 2 weeks in Yosemite prior with a dozen other people. Looking forward to enjoying the big easy peaks of Tuolumne Meadows in early September.

I'm hoping to hit these Canyons with a Vegas friend. Though if he can't join, then I may try to meet up with others to hit some canyons. Is this a good place for a shout out for willing partners? Or is there a more useful message board for Zion Canyoneers?

(Looking at some of the awesome big Zion canyons makes me think that it could just be simpler to get a guide. My friend is less experienced and getting a guide just makes things easier. Though it is something I'd prefer to avoid, in the canyons here I am normally the one leading my group down these things.)

Welcome -

we can probably set you up with partners when you get your schedule figured out. There is another message board that is similar in size and draws a separate group of canyoneers - http://www.canyoncollective.com - worth working both.

Guiding is not allowed inside the Zion park. There are a few canyons outside that are guideable, but they are not too exciting. If you are going to do that, it would be better to go to Escalante, hire Rick Green, and get into some of the good stuff out there.

I can lend you canyoneering ropes.

Tom

[patto]

we can probably set you up with partners when you get your schedule figured out. There is another message board that is similar in size and draws a separate group of canyoneers - http://www.canyoncollective.com - worth working both.

Thank you very much! I probably should start working out partners sooner rather than later. I have my schedule sorted any time between 20th and 27th of September is suitable. With those dates in mind I might start seeing who is interested. (When it comes to climbing, I've normally just shown up at the campsite and found partners. I would expect canyoning isn't as easy)

Guiding is not allowed inside the Zion park. There are a few canyons outside that are guideable, but they are not too exciting. If you are going to do that, it would be better to go to Escalante, hire Rick Green, and get into some of the good stuff out there.

Wow! I wouldn't have gotten that impression from reading the websites. Thank you very much!

I have now looked at Rick Green's website, it looks good. Though being not the most wealthy traveler going around if I can find partners then I am very happy to not pay a guide. I'll keep looking and figure something out.

I can lend you canyoneering ropes.

That offer is amazing. Your generosity makes me uncomfortable, but I might actually accept that. I can definitely offer exciting adventure stories or all the free gear/advice/accomodation that people need if they ever visit Australia. (I have plenty of my own equipment in Australia. But I'll only be travelling with my climbing gear and a single dynamic rope.)

Anyway. My dates and schedule is rapidly solidifying, though I will be maintaining flexibility for whatever canyoning dates are suitable. I'll be visiting here and canyoncollective at a later date to find partners. That said if anybody is interested in a canyon anytime between 20th and 27th of September then let me know. (Though that is still a while away now!)

[ratagonia]

Thank you very much! I probably should start working out partners sooner rather than later. I have my schedule sorted any time between 20th and 27th of September is suitable.

Here is PART of my rope closet...




(I have lots of ropes)

Local people tend to not make plans too far in advance. If around, I'd be glad to get out with you, but... seems like a long way away.

Tom

[patto]

Local people tend to not make plans too far in advance. If around, I'd be glad to get out with you, but... seems like a long way away.

No different here! :-) In fact I'm the worst for it. My plans rarely extend beyond a week! But obviously circumstances are a little different for me in this situation. (Though last time I was in the USA I never had any plans, I had a car some cash and 5 months!) This trip is shorter so some planning is needed.

That said in a very bizarre fashion I already have offered a lift for hitch hiker leaving Yosemite! I've never known hitch hikers to plan months ahead!
http://www.mountainproject.com/v/nee...12#a_110743955


Mid-September I'll be posting like mad here and everywhere else for partners. I don't want leave without experiencing Utah Canyoning.

[ratagonia]

No different here! :-) In fact I'm the worst for it. My plans rarely extend beyond a week! But obviously circumstances are a little different for me in this situation. (Though last time I was in the USA I never had any plans, I had a car some cash and 5 months!) This trip is shorter so some planning is needed.

That said in a very bizarre fashion I already have offered a lift for hitch hiker leaving Yosemite! I've never known hitch hikers to plan months ahead!
http://www.mountainproject.com/v/nee...12#a_110743955


Mid-September I'll be posting like mad here and everywhere else for partners. I don't want leave without experiencing Utah Canyoning.

My September is complicated, so please be sure to figure out your rope request and get it to me by Sept 5th.

Tom

[patto]

My September is complicated, so please be sure to figure out your rope request and get it to me by Sept 5th.

Tom

Email sent. Thanks!

[patto]

So this "visiting Aussie" (AKA me) will be canyoneering and in the Zion region from the 21st to least the 28th. If anybody wishes to join me and one (or two) others down canyons feel free to contact me. (I'm experienced in Australian canyons, the other members are quite experienced hikers, climbers, rappellers but not canyoneers.)


Also one question. Full wetsuits in September? From watching plenty of videos I see a variety of lighter weight clothing being worn even in canyons which recommend wet/drysuits. I own a springsuit (half length wetsuit) but I'm debating on buying a full one. At this stage I think I'm getting a decent full wetsuit to be on the safe side... But I figure I'd ask the question anyway.

(Naturally it all depends on conditions and weather but I figure I'd ask the locals. Canyons that I've done need full wetsuits in winter but can often be done with half suits + long underwear outside of winter.)

EDIT: I am reading the wetsuit advice thread in this forum too. So that helps. I suppose what I want to know is what people normally wear in Zion in September for a fast moving group. :-)

[Iceaxe]

I've always considered September to be the best month of the year in Utah. The days in Zion will still be warm/hot but it will cool down a lot at night.

I hate shortie wetsuits and never wear them. If I were doing Zion Canyons in September I'd wear a 3/2 full for most canyons, except for Heaps, Imlay and Kolob which always require more protection. I run on the warm side and don't get cold easy. My groups normally move smooth and efficiently. I hope that helps.

YMMV

[patto]

I've always considered September to be the best month of the year in Utah. The days in Zion will still be warm/hot but it will cool down a lot at night.

I hate shortie wetsuits and never wear them. If I were doing Zion Canyons in September I'd wear a 3/2 full for most canyons, except for Heaps, Imlay and Kolob which always require more protection. I run on the warm side and don't get cold easy. My groups normally move smooth and efficiently. I hope that helps.

YMMV

It does help. Thanks!

My desire to not have to own even more equipment and spend more money was saying not to get a 3/2. But the sensible side of me was saying that my shortie probably won't cut it. Ok, I'll buy a 3/2 and leave my shortie behind. Being warm is good. No matter how beautiful a place is, if you are cold it is never fun.

(And as much as I'd LOVE to do Heaps or Imlay I suspect I wont have gained enough local knowledge in my short stay to feel comfortable doing that unless I'm with somebody more experienced.)