Introduction and Retreat

[AlohaChris]

Hi Everyone,

My my name is Chris and I am new to Canyoneering. I live in Utah County with my wife and kids. I got bit by the bug a year ago when a friend took me on a trip to Blarney Canyon in the North Wash.

I was really excited to get started, so I read a lot online, and I gleaned all the I could. Having little to no "outdoorsman" experience and I found the info a bit overwhelming.

A friend recommended Darkhorse Leadership's Intro to Canyoneering course, which I completed in April. I thoroughly enjoyed the course. Steve & Clark were great instructors, and I felt well prepared to get out and do some "beginner" canyons.

I bought some gear, set set my sights on the North Wash again, and prepared for Shillelagh Canyon this last weekend. I was disappointed when I got all the way there under mostly sunny/partly cloudy skies, only to see dark rain clouds looming in the Western sky. My group and I decided to abort due to flood risk, so we went on to Moab.

The next day, we set out for Cameltoe Canyon. My novice land navigation skills led to the approach taking 3 hours with a couple episodes of backtracking. We had a compass and topo map, but no GPS. The Beta from Climb Utah was accurate, but left out several key details.

We made it to the first rappel (50'). Because of rain the previous day, the dryfall was a small water fall. Not too much water, but the trouble was that the Beta said nothing about the nature of the rappel, other than there were bolts.

The rappel turned out to be a very sharp overhang. Not cut-your-rope sharp, but sharp enough to crush your hand or break a bone. I was the only person who had rappelled using the slide-over-the-edge technique (thanks to Steve & Clark's excellent preparation). My group was trying to be brave, but I could see significant apprehension on their faces.

I rigged the rope, but I/we ultimately decided to retreat because the group was too weak/inexperienced to handle this obstacle safely. We all made it back to Moab in one piece. Sunday's weather turned ugly, we packed up and headed home.

So, my first "Canyoneering" trip ended as an extended hike through slick rock country with no canyons completed.

I would like to hear feedback and suggestions for "straightforward" canyons in the future.

[Kuya]

Wow, yeah Cameltoe is probably the least of the canyons id have chosen. But good job for trying! What a first trip. Kudos to you for being willing to pull out when things didn't look so good.

[AlohaChris]

Hi Kuya. I guess ratings can be deceiving . At 3AII, I thought Cameltoe would be a safe bet.BTW, I live in Spanish Fork as well. If your looking for a canyon buddy, I'm game.

[skelley]

Good job on making sure your group did not get in over their heads. That is a tough call when everyone really wants to make the objective.

I would go with some experienced folks for a bit instead of striking out on your own.

[TommyBoy]

At 3AII, I thought Cameltoe would be a safe bet.

The 3 rating actually covers quite a range of difficulty. As a beginner its a great starting point in your search for suitable canyons, but then move on to reading the full beta to see exactly what you're in for. Read from multiple sources too if you can find them for the canyon you're looking at. Once you get more experience its fun to go out with less and less info, but thats for later.

[deagol]

+1 on good judgment not trying to force anyone to do something they are not comfortable with. Camletoe is actually a very easy "canyon" IMO, but I guess I can see why that rap may make some folks uncomfortable. It's also possible that canyoneering is not for everyone...

hiking through the slickrock country isn't a bad substitute, though.. sometimes it can be better.
YMMV

[Scott P]

I would like to hear feedback and suggestions for "straightforward" canyons in the future.

I mean no offence by this, but few technical canyons are easier than Cameltoe. I can't think of many technical canyons that are easier than that, in either technical difficulty or navigation. If you had problems with the technical difficulty or navigational difficulty of Cameltoe, then you need more skills before trying to lead canyons.

Rather than taking this as discouraging though, perhaps take some more classes or go with more experienced partners to build up your skills.

Also, maybe try something like Ding or Dang, which is non technical, but has some good downclimbs to practice on.

[AlohaChris]

Thanks for the replies. I did seek multiple sources for Beta. I had Climb Utah's guide and the book "Moab Canyoneering Guide" along with me.

I chose Cameltoe because the description, rating and terrain/length looked straightforward. It was by no means a "difficult canyon", it was a slickrock hike with a couple of rappels in the middle. The "slot section" if it can be called that, was maybe 200 yards long and wide open. The very akward and sharp rappel ledge wasn't mentioned in either guide.

I guess what I'm looking for is a short canyon with a couple of straightforward rappels. I'm game for getting out with more experienced people, but it's proving difficult to find a group that's open. I've tried Meetup, but it seems like I miss the open slots every time.

Any suggestions for clubs or groups?

[AlohaChris]

Thanks. We had a good time hiking through some beautiful country with the flowers all in bloom and didn't see another soul all day. I just wish I didn't have to hump all the gear for nothing.

[Scott P]

I guess what I'm looking for is a short canyon with a couple of straightforward rappels.

Cameltoe is a pretty straight forward rappel. If you didn't find it that way, then you need more practice before leading canyons.

I'm game for getting out with more experienced people, but it's proving difficult to find a group that's open. I've tried Meetup, but it seems like I miss the open slots every time.

Meetup groups seem to be plagued with accidents and the people that lead those trips don't always know what they are doing. I would not suggest putting too much trust into meetup groups unless you are experienced and can make a judgment call as to weather or not the leader should be leading the canyon.

Maybe try freeze fest or some of the Bogley gatherings. Also, there are plenty of guiding companies and companies that teach canyoneering skills. I started out how you started out, and regrettably we didn't always canyoneer safely. Now days though, there are plenty of methods and opportunities that can be used to build up skills. If you don't have experienced friends, then perhaps try one of these:

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourcei...%20instruction

PS, your turning around did indicate solid decision making.

[deagol]

I echo what Scott says. The rap in Camletoe is very tame compared to several I have seen, especially the start.

[Rob L]

AlohaChris:

Chris: Welcome to Bogley. I admire your openness; I'm glad that you have sense to ask for advice/help.

I am myself still a novice at canyoneering so I have empathy with your quest.

Through this Bogley site, I've been introduced to canyoneering in Utah with the likes of Scott P and Kuya (on this thread), and others yet to post, like Iceaxe and Hikster11 and Moab Mark and very many others.


Perhaps my point is that if you can arrange to meet up with one of them (like I did) then you will get as good an introduction as you possibly can.

Rob

[Iceaxe]

I mean no offence by this, but few technical canyons are easier than Cameltoe. I can't think of many technical canyons that are easier than that, in either technical difficulty or navigation. If you had problems with the technical difficulty or navigational difficulty of Cameltoe, then you need more skills before trying to lead canyons.

Rather than taking this as discouraging though, perhaps take some more classes or go with more experienced partners to build up your skills.

^^^THIS^^^

Technical canyons just don't get any easier than Camel Toe, which is also one of the most forgiving routes you will ever find.

[Kuya]

Hi Kuya. I guess ratings can be deceiving . At 3AII, I thought Cameltoe would be a safe bet.BTW, I live in Spanish Fork as well. If your looking for a canyon buddy, I'm game.

Awesome! I'd love to have ya along on my trips! Well... Only if you are fun to hang out with and are willing to carry my ropes lol

[AlohaChris]

Awesome! I'd love to have ya along on my trips! Well... Only if you are fun to hang out with and are willing to carry my ropes lol

In addition to good looks and rugged natural charm, I'm also fun and really good at carrying heavy things.

[AlohaChris]

I echo what Scott says. The rap in Camletoe is very tame compared to several I have seen, especially the start.

Thank you both. I agree it wasn't a serious challenge, but my group wasn't strong enough. The first rap wasn't walking slowly over a rounded edge and having perfect contact with the cliff. It required sliding off an overhang and swinging under without cracking your head or crushing your hand wasn't something everyone had practiced.

I have found 'getting into' Canyoneering quite daunting. It's not like scuba, where you take a course from an instruction team that is certified by a national (or international) body with standards for instruction, training materials, equipment and skill progression. If I have questions about my scuba instructor, I can call PADI and check that they're certified to teach and review their dive logs to verify their experience.

I took a Canyoneering course, that was 2 days and learned a lot. However there is so much more required to do it safely, like orienteering, basic to intermediate rock climbing, stemming techniques, etc.

I'm taking the crawl, walk, run approach. I do not think of myself as "the leader" or have any thought that I'm qualified to do so. My friends and I are interested and working towards gaining & improving our skills.

[deagol]

Chris,

It's been a while since I did that canyon, but I don't think my wife "loved" that rap either..

There are worse ones out there, but I see what you mean. I think part of the allure of canyoneering (to me at least) is that there is no gentle easy path into it like Scuba, as you mentioned. The more I have done it, the more I see how we could get ourselves into some really deep %^&%$ if we screw up. I don't think it is for everyone (not saying it isn't for you) but why should every pursuit "be" for everyone?

It's great you took a course like that. I have heard nothing but good things about that company. My intro to the sport was more gradual and organic than taking a class (like many, started out as a hiker and rock-climber) and there were some "trial by fire" moments, to be sure. Someone will probably hate me for this, but I hope that the guiding/instruction industry does not succeed at making this a mainstream sport. There is not the capacity to deal with an ever-increasing population of participants out there. Solitude used to be easy to find out there, but it is so much less so now with the advent both the internet and the increasing population of the west -and maybe the increasing reach of tourism, both nationally and internationally. Something is going to give someday (soon perhaps?).

The hiking on slickrock thing is also appealing to me and I don't go strictly for the adrenaline rush of doing scary raps. I don't look at that as a let-down. I do understand how carrying a bunch of tech gear you don't need can be annoying, but don't look at using the gear as the ultimate goal of the outing. It's a means to an end.. YMMV

[ScottM]

Chris, I'm sure Clark and Steve already mentioned it to you, another great opportunity to get some experience is via the http://www.zioncanyonrendezvous.com/

[harness man]

Chris,
My two bits as a 'noob' canyoneer.
It is true that canyoneering is NOT an 'easy' sport, to practice or to get into.
That (for me at least) is part of it's charm .
Rappelling as applied to canyoneering is also quite different when compared to the kinds of rappels most climbers experience when cragging.
Hence the canyoneering specific rappelling devices and techniques.
'Awkward starts' are often the norm.
I have experienced more crazy /awkward starts in a single canyon (Imlay) than in many dozens rock and alpine climbs combined.
(come to think of it, full Imlay has more individual RAPPELS than dozens of rock climbs combined!)
Dealing with awkward rappels (and down climbs, and weird anchors, and back country navigation, etc.) is part of adapting to the bizarre (and beautiful!) architecture of canyons.
Best,
Todd

[harness man]

Brandon is 'hip'