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Thread: New Moab Canyoneering Book

  1. #41
    Moderator jman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by townsend View Post
    For rappel diagrams, I prefer what Mike Dallin did in Ouray Canyoning -- a "stair" drawing w/ canyon topo legend. One "picture" (read drawing) is worth many words -- it is often needed to keep from getting lost when reading a detailed description.
    Thanks for the reminder. That's another book I still need to get!

    Yeah, I hear ya on that. The descriptions can get confusing, but a topo map always solves that problem. Well...if you know how to read one that is.
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  3. #42
    Haven't received the book yet but I was hoping for some new routes not just long hikes with a single rappel to get out. 90 % of it was already on climb utah. Oh well.

  4. #43
    Moderator jman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by moab mark View Post
    Haven't received the book yet but I was hoping for some new routes not just long hikes with a single rappel to get out. 90 % of it was already on climb utah. Oh well.
    Well, you have to remember - this is Moab we are speaking about. ;)

    It's all going to be short, one or two rappel type of canyons/routes.

    I'm sure there are other routes to be found in the La Sal mountains besides Pleiades... From a quick survey, there could be a short one or two off of Pack Creek. I dunno.
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    "He who walks on the edge...will eventually fall."
    "There are two ways to die in the desert - dehydration and drowning." -overhearing a Park Ranger at Capitol Reef N.P.
    "...the first law of gear-dynamics: gear is like a gas - it will expand to fit the available space." -Wortman, Outside magazine.
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  5. #44
    Hiking up the Moab Rim jeep trail to turn around and rappel back down isn't lighting my fuse. But yes it is Moab doesn't seem to be a lot of slots around.

  6. #45
    But yes it is Moab doesn't seem to be a lot of slots around.
    As you know, there are slots around there, but they are all short. The only places around Moab I can think of that might have even a modest potential of more slots to be betaed are the La Sal Mountains and the fingers of Onion Creek. The canyons draining into the Delores on the Utah side might have some potential, but it seems fairly slim (I have explored some of the canyons out there and they do have some scenic narrows).

    I don't think any new guidebook to the Moab area is going to come up with a bunch of new Zionish or Escalante type canyons. Speaking of which, I'm actually surprised that no one has come up with an Escalante or Robbers Roost Slot Canyon guide yet (yes, I know that some of the guidebooks to either areas mention some slots). Or maybe the internet has taken the place of that niche.
    Utah is a very special and unique place. There is no where else like it on earth. Please take care of it and keep the remaining wild areas in pristine condition. The world will be a better place if you do.

  7. #46
    My book showed today, nice pictures. Makes me want to do a few of the routes haven't done in years.

  8. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott P View Post
    Speaking of which, I'm actually surprised that no one has come up with an Escalante or Robbers Roost Slot Canyon guide yet (yes, I know that some of the guidebooks to either areas mention some slots). Or maybe the internet has taken the place of that niche.

    After writing a Canyoneering Guide book to Zion about 10 years ago I have to say they are pretty much a complete waste compared to the internet. Your guidebook becomes dated in a relatively short time. Any new routes you put in a guidebook will be up on the web within a couple of month's. You are so limited in what you can put in a book compared to the web. My Zion guidebook sold really well the first year, but not so much after that. Personally I never understood why people would even buy the book when a membership to Climb-Utah.com was about the same price at the time and easily had 5 times the canyons because a membership bought you access to all areas. I guess some folks just like having something tangible in their hand they can touch.

    My Canyoneering Zion book is still available and amazingly still sales a few copies every year.

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  9. #48
    170 ft for Pool Arch isn't right, else I'd be short a significant other at the moment. I had a 190 ft rope and a 120 ft tag line with plenty of extra length to pull (just double checked a photo of it), so 170 wasn't possible. I guessed around 140 in the field but knock off extra length for the tails and knots. 130 seems accurate. Perhaps the 170 also includes rapping out of the bowl into the lower pool? A friend did it a couple weeks ago and said "128 ft." I'm not sure where that rather precise figure came from.

    That Moab Rim hike up/rap down deal (Moonflower) was a nice and short evening affair. It was also much scarier than some traditionally-rated R and X slots I've done. A 200 ft free hanging rap off of a dead man can get the blood flowing and I bet the deadman washed out that evening. Still, it is sort of similar to the Arches intro canyons, minus bolts. SGR was also quite fun. I know a couple canyons were omitted due to Arches throwing a fit. A few more potential canyons have quite tricky approaches. A few canyons are mums-the-word-I'll-take-it-to-the-grave, which I'm guessing is the case with many of the worthy "unknown" canyons out near Moab. Still, them virgin canyons are bound to exist.

    Moab, with a few exceptions, mostly caters to the beginner to intermediate crowd (great in terms of audience and producing a first guidebook), so I would have been surprised if the guidebook impressed the canyon big shots with experience elsewhere. I do agree that the internet is the way of the future (non pay site version as pay sites are frequently subject to the mercurial whims, financial circumstances, and arrogance of the owners and lack a true feedback or error-correction system). 14ers.com vs. 14erworld.com in CO was an example of that. However, guidebooks still have great value, particularly when it comes to punting plans in the field and generating ideas.

    The author has significant cartography experience and I was rather impressed with the maps produced since I kind of thought he was just a grunting caving and peak-addicted neanderthal. I have Dalin's book somewhere; will have to check out the profile differences. The beta seemed about intermediate in terms of too much or too little detail. Not overly wordy or cramped like a few sites and guides out there, but with good first-hand beta and clarity to descend safely. I also enjoy that the book underwent an editing process of sorts because the grammar, read-ability, and mistakes on some resources can be a bit overwhelming. There is a summary table of rap length and difficulty for those liking a bit more adventure. Sharp End generally does a good job on the picture count; it'll be interesting to see the final product once I finally get to check it out.

  10. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Marsters View Post
    I do agree that the internet is the way of the future (non pay site version as pay sites are frequently subject to the mercurial whims, financial circumstances, and arrogance of the owners and lack a true feedback or error-correction system). 14ers.com vs. 14erworld.com in CO was an example of that.
    I fail to see where a pay per view website differs from a pay per view guidebook in any of the above statement.

    My experience is there are good and bad websites and guidebooks. It really matters who wrote it and the resources they invested in presenting the information.

    As someone who has run a free beta website, a pay per view website and also written a guidebook I find the pay per view website is by far the most accurate as mistakes are easily corrected, routes are easily updated and the financial resources allow for improvements and additions that would be impossible for most people to finance out of pocket.

    Canyoneering guidebooks are notorious for being out of date after next years monsoon season. A Moab book will be somewhat immune to that issue as the Moab guidebook is more routes and not what I consider "real" slot canyons.

    Your mileage may vary.

  11. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Iceaxe View Post
    Personally I never understood why people would even buy the book
    For contingencies when you are out of cell service. Of course this really isn't an issue in Zion and probably not in Moab either.

    The other reason is because most the books come with valuable front matter. I can never remember what equipment to bring, I would forget that rattlesnakes are poisonous, that flashfloods can occur especially during the monsoon, and those darn canyon ratings are so confusing.

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  13. #51
    The book is small, contains mostly known routes and several that I would consider "filler", that aren't really canyons but hikes with a rappel. That being said, I still like having it in the collection and it speaks to my laziness that I can just grab this book instead of combing through my massive pile of unorganized beta if I want to find something to do in Moab. This is also the first canyoneering guide book I have seen that doubles as an advertisement for many local companies. Magazine-style full page ads in the middle of the book.
    "I approach nature with a certain surly ill-will, daring Her to make trouble"

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  14. #52
    Content Provider Emeritus ratagonia's Avatar
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    Now available for quick shipment from Canyoneering USA

    http://www.store.canyoneeringusa.com...tegory=2490778

    Tom

  15. #53
    Content Provider Emeritus ratagonia's Avatar
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    Table of Contents:

    Anyone done SGR Slot and would like to comment on it?
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  16. #54
    Yes, and it's narrow with lovely raps. Well worth the approach & exit hikes.

  17. #55
    SGR is the best I've done near Moab. High-stemming, good raps, some dark places. Short but quality. Make sure to hit the overlook view pt prior to dropping in. As a caveat, I have not done Pleiades. I hear it is short but worthwhile.

  18. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by ratagonia View Post
    Table of Contents:

    Anyone done SGR Slot and would like to comment on it?
    SGR was a wonderful slot. I have a write up about our trip on my blog if you wanna check it out.

    http://canyoneeringutah.blogspot.com...anyon.html?m=1
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