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Thread: Stewart Falls

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Slot Machine View Post
    Thanks for the kind words!

    The chimpanzee anchor: Tied to the bolts was an American death triangle, extended toward the edge. The triangle was very small, generating maximum force on the bolts (bright blue webbing). It was backed up by a very small bush near the watercourse (black webbing).

    hmm, well the black webbing was probably ours. I remembered it being a small tree we went off but it was strong and we backed it up to be sure it was solid. I guess Cliff thought it looked sketchy, but I remember being pretty confident about it. I think those bolts must be new. Anyway, glad you guys had a fun time and got through safe. The first time I went I had a friend who went with us who forgot his wetsuit too and was really cold the whole way. That water is super cold!
    - Gavin

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  3. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Slot Machine View Post
    an American death triangle, extended toward the edge. The triangle was very small, generating maximum force on the bolts (bright blue webbing)
    Oh wow, yeah I didn't see that part. Good on ya for getting it all fixed!!!
    CanyoneeringUtah.blogspot.com
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    "As you journey through life, choose your destination well, but do not hurry there. You will arrive soon enough. Wander the back roads and forgotten path[s] ... Such things are riches for the soul. And if upon arrival, you find that your destination is not exactly as you had dreamed, ... know that the true worth of your travels lies not in where you come to be at journey

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  5. #23
    Mountain Man
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slot Machine View Post
    I clip a biner into my leg loop and reach for another, in case a Z-rig is needed. Then I discover I have no more biners... they've all been used for biner blocks and are now safely at the bottom of the rappel with my other teammates. Half Z-rig will be good enough, right?

    I scream to Blake, "Fireman!! Fireman!!", but he can't hear me over the roar of the falls, over the thunder, and the rain. I manage to stop myself and scream for assistance some more. Blake then realizes I'm in trouble and quickly bolts for the rope. He pulls with a few pounds of tension via fireman belay and assists me to the bottom.
    Scary, very scary. I so love my setup, a Sterling ATS, with its variable friction, coupled with a Petzl Shunt above the rap device as backup. The Shunt is good for wet or dry, clean or dirty rope, releases fast, catches fast, and takes care of itself in case of a fall. I've never seen another in a canyon.

  6. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by dsr70 View Post
    Scary, very scary. I so love my setup, a Sterling ATS, with its variable friction, coupled with a Petzl Shunt above the rap device as backup. The Shunt is good for wet or dry, clean or dirty rope, releases fast, catches fast, and takes care of itself in case of a fall. I've never seen another in a canyon.
    I'm not convinced a Shunt is any better than a VT Prussik. (They are just more mechanical, heavy, and pricy ;-) )And really the only person who needs to use an auto block is the first person (ift they feel they need it. After that, a fireman should be enough. Like in this case, the fireman belay (coupled with the rappelers advanced skills) worked out well enough. Everyone did safely descend these rappels :-)
    CanyoneeringUtah.blogspot.com
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    "As you journey through life, choose your destination well, but do not hurry there. You will arrive soon enough. Wander the back roads and forgotten path[s] ... Such things are riches for the soul. And if upon arrival, you find that your destination is not exactly as you had dreamed, ... know that the true worth of your travels lies not in where you come to be at journey

  7. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by dsr70 View Post
    Scary, very scary. I so love my setup, a Sterling ATS, with its variable friction, coupled with a Petzl Shunt above the rap device as backup. The Shunt is good for wet or dry, clean or dirty rope, releases fast, catches fast, and takes care of itself in case of a fall. I've never seen another in a canyon.
    I owned a Petzl Shunt for a day, then took it back. During my past several hundred rappels I've never even thought about buying another. Too heavy and bulky, and I normally have other tricks to overcome adversity while on rappel.

    Also, when using a Shunt for an autoblock while rapping single strand, Petzl recommends using a 10-11mm rope. We were using 8.3mm rope, so it probably wouldn't have done much good.

    I never actually lost control (on the brink), so I would not have used the Shunt anyway. But you are right... it was very scary indeed.
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  8. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by dsr70 View Post
    Scary, very scary. I so love my setup, a Sterling ATS, with its variable friction, coupled with a Petzl Shunt above the rap device as backup. The Shunt is good for wet or dry, clean or dirty rope, releases fast, catches fast, and takes care of itself in case of a fall. I've never seen another in a canyon.
    Using a Shunt, autoblock, VT Prussik or ANY type of self belay in a flowing water canyon is a very bad idea. If the self belay were to lock up in while rappelling thru a waterfall, drowning becomes a very real possibility.

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  10. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrAdam View Post
    ANY type of self belay in a flowing water canyon is a very bad idea.
    Indeed. Though the shunt is uniquely easy to release and unaffected by a rope's wetness or dirtiness. The same can't be said for prussiks and such and I would never use one in a fall. On a large wet drop, it would come down to whether I got a competent fireman's, how tired I was, and whether flow looked sufficient to prevent the shunt releasing bounce.

  11. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Slot Machine View Post
    Also, when using a Shunt for an autoblock while rapping single strand, Petzl recommends using a 10-11mm rope. We were using 8.3mm rope, so it probably wouldn't have done much good.
    Yes, the SHUNT instructions say,

    Ropes
    The SHUNT works on:
    - single 10 to 11 mm diameter ropes that have a core and sheath (EN 892
    dynamic, EN 1891 semi-static, static).
    - doubled 8 to 11 mm diameter ropes that have a core and sheath (EN 892
    dynamic, EN 1891 semi-static, static). Use two strands of the same diameter
    rope.
    Warning: certain ropes can slip and and reduce the the SHUNT’s braking
    effectiveness, for example new ropes, ropes with sheath treatments, wet,
    frozen, or muddy ropes, etc.

    Full document: http://www.petzl.com/files/all/techn.../B03-SHUNT.pdf

    If you plan to use it as a rappel backup on single strand ropes in the 8-9 mm range, you should do some realistic field testing to see if it works on your rope, under your conditions of use...without exposing anyone to risk, of course.

  12. #29
    Finally, I finished the video! Enjoy :)

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    "As you journey through life, choose your destination well, but do not hurry there. You will arrive soon enough. Wander the back roads and forgotten path[s] ... Such things are riches for the soul. And if upon arrival, you find that your destination is not exactly as you had dreamed, ... know that the true worth of your travels lies not in where you come to be at journey

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  14. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuya View Post
    Finally, I finished the video! Enjoy :)
    Wow, great job Blake! Filming that last rap ain't easy.

    It's crazy to see how different the mid-wall rooster tail is at 2:35, then again at 2:45 (after the rain started)! The sound of the water funneling down that shoot and off the rooster tail was odd and spooky. Very memorable.

    Thanks for posting the video! I've been dying to see it. To be honest, not as bad as I remember...
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  16. #31
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    Great vid. Very nice bg music, especially since it wasn't the typical thumping rock.

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  18. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by hank moon View Post
    The SHUNT works on:
    - single 10 to 11 mm diameter ropes that have a core and sheath
    Indeed do your own experimentation. I have found the single rope 10mm limit drastically conservative in many years of use on 9, 8.3, and 8. It locks on 6mm pull cord as well in my short wall tests.

  19. #33
    Awesome trip report.

    Glad you made it safely Bob. There are 2 mistakes you can make in canyoneering. 1st is the mistake you learn from. 2nd is the one that kills you.

    You could have also put the extra-friction carabiner on the opposite leg loop, of your brake hand. That would've given you a little more friction.

    Ren

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  21. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by dsr70 View Post
    Indeed do your own experimentation. I have found the single rope 10mm limit drastically conservative in many years of use on 9, 8.3, and 8. It locks on 6mm pull cord as well in my short wall tests.
    Do your tests include uncontrolled rappel simulation? What does it mean to you that the SHUNT "locks" on a small-diameter rope under a static bodyweight load?

  22. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by dsr70 View Post
    Great vid. Very nice bg music, especially since it wasn't the typical thumping rock.
    Thank you :) sometimes I feel beautiful music is appropriate to associate with beautiful places! :D
    CanyoneeringUtah.blogspot.com
    My YouTube Channel

    "As you journey through life, choose your destination well, but do not hurry there. You will arrive soon enough. Wander the back roads and forgotten path[s] ... Such things are riches for the soul. And if upon arrival, you find that your destination is not exactly as you had dreamed, ... know that the true worth of your travels lies not in where you come to be at journey

  23. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Renatomic808 View Post
    Awesome trip report.

    Glad you made it safely Bob. There are 2 mistakes you can make in canyoneering. 1st is the mistake you learn from. 2nd is the one that kills you.

    You could have also put the extra-friction carabiner on the opposite leg loop, of your brake hand. That would've given you a little more friction.

    Ren
    I certainly didn't want to learn THAT much in one day.

    I'll give your method a try next time out. That would have been a good tool to have in the toolbox. Thanks for the tip.
    THE MOST TALKED ABOUT CANYONEERING TRIP OF 2017 - WEST CANYON VIA HELICOPTER.
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