Wilderness Survival Merit Badge

[DiscGo]

I have been ask to organize a Wilderness Survival overnight campout for a group of 20 scouts. I would love any suggestions that any of you might have. Here is my current plan"

I am planning on

• Releasing 6 chickens a head of time for the boys to catch.
• Teaching the boys to make rope from branches
• Having the boys use their ropes to hold the chickens heads down, while I kill the chickens

(I would normally have the boys kill the chickens but I'm worried about safety with this number of boys)

• Teaching the boys to clean and prepare the chickens
• Having the boys create fire without matches and find their own way to cook the chickens.
• Creating an orienteering / geocaching map for them to find a fun size snickers for each boy.

Does anyone else have any suggestions for what to do to make this experience better?

[BruteForce]

So I did this (desert & winter) for the Army. For my Army survival (was longer than a night), I was given one egg and my combat knife. My task was to 1) evade & escape (something your scouts don't need to worry about), 2) make shelter using only available "stuff", 3) find food & water (I ate snakes, mice, etc and whatever greenery was edible) and had to make fire.

The catching chickens could backfire on you, as you may not catch them, but its a step in the right direction. I think having them slaughter the chicken would be more ideal than you doing it. It takes a bit of courage to willingly kill an animal and that differentiates those that COULD survive from those that WONT.

I like the orienteering/geocaching idea provided you're only using map/compass.

[Scott P]

DiscGo, I used to teach the Wilderness Survival Merit Badge at a scout camp.

I'm confused as to what any of the above has to do with the merit badge? Except for the fire starting.

Some comments:

When making rope from branches, they usually have to be alive. Cutting live branches on public land for anything but trail maintenance work is against scout policy (but not illegal in most places), but they do allow it in people's yards/land, if this is where you are camping. It's a good skill to learn, but in a scout setting you need to do it in someone's yard or land.

I'd also check into the legality of releasing chickens into the wild, assuming that it is possible that some might escape. To prevent spread of disease, etc., it is illegal to release many domestic animals into the wild. I'm not sure about chickens specifically, but would be surprised if it weren't illegal.

I'd recommend sticking with the merit badge and scout recommendations themselves. Here is the scout requirements and what they suggest for recommended reading:

http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/...s/mb-WILD.aspx

One of the requirements is explaining things like bear/wild animal safety, etc. I don't know where you are camping, but doing things hiding candy bars in the wild would be the exact opposite of what the merit badge is supposed to teach. It would be bad practice. The orientation part isn't a bad idea, but use something other than food to stash in the wilds. It's better to teach proper food storage, especially to scouts.

I agree with using a map and compass. A GPS last only as long as a battery (but explain that it can be used as a secondary tool).

Sorry if it sounds harsh, but many of the ideas above are not only bad, but are against official Scout policy and may even be illegal.

PS, above are some don'ts, but a do is to teach the scouts how to use a signal mirror (or an improvised signal mirror). This is a very important skill.

[DiscGo]

Doesn't sound harsh at all Scott. Part of why I would post something like this on Bogley, is to get honest feedback and suggestions for improvement.

I have done the chickens thing multiple times, and the chickens are all caught within minutes. I'm not at all worried about losing chickens. In the past I have always had the boys kill the chickens but because I don't know all of these boys I am a lot more apprensive about giving them hatchets or sharp enough blades that could take a chickens head off.

I don't know if you have read the Wilderness Survival Meritbadge requirements, but this is not simply about gaining a meritbadge. I am a big believer that focusing on merit badge requirements, has no merit if we are neglecting to provide the spirit of the achievement for the boys. So I am not just trying to cross off a checklist here, I am trying to give the boys an experience to strengthen and test these boys.

As far as the hiding food goes, we would place them in an ammo can and only be away from the food for the hour or so it took the boys to find it. I have also done this on multiple occasions as part of the geocaching merit badge, and to instruct boys how to use a GPS and it has been a good experience.


Personally I care more about helping these boys become great men, then I care about any merit badge. So I'm just trying to give these boys opportunities to grow and experiences to open their minds.

[BruteForce]

I'm confused as to what any of the above has to do with the merit badge? Except for the fire starting.

I assume your comment is in reply to my suggestions. If so, I've never been a scout, because as an Army brat, there was no opportunity overseas, and being an Army brat that later was IN the Army, there was no need for scouting. I interpreted his request for Wilderness survival ideas as just that.. suitable for boys.

[Scott Card]

One of my favorite memories as a scout was my "survival camp". We were allowed a sleeping bag and a pocket knife. That was it. We had to catch and kill our chicken how ever we could. We had to figure out how to kill, clean and cook the chicken. I would not provide rope or a hatchet. Let them figure it out. They will never forget it. We were given a small piece of charred cloth (we called it 'punk') and we had to start a fire to cook the chicken with flint that we found and steel (our knife). It was about a three hour process to get dinner. We had to figure out how to insulate our bags from the ground with dry grass, leaves, etc. to stay dry at night. Gratefully it didn't rain. Good time! Congrats on having the guts to do this type of activity.

[Scott P]

I assume your comment is in reply to my suggestions

Nope. You posted while I was still writing, so mine was only to DiscGo and referring only to scouts (I didn't even see your post until after it was posted).

[BruteForce]

Nope. You posted while I was still writing, so mine was only to DiscGo and referring only to scouts (I didn't even see your post until after it was posted).

Thank you for the clarification!

[reverse_dyno]

Releasing chickens seems a little strange. I have never seen a barn yard chicken in the Uintas. Having them fish for dinner sounds more realistic. And it they catch something, good, if not, they go hungry. One important thing to instill in people is that it is ok to be cold, hungry, tired, and generally miserable. Most city folk are so used to being comfortable, that they really have no idea how robust and far they can push their bodies. That is one reason why the Army pushes their solders so far in training, its so that the solder has an idea of how far they can push their body before it breaks. A survival test should not be "fun", it should be painful.

[DiscGo]

@reverse_dyno-
The idea behind releasing the chickens is not that they are going to find chickens in the wilderness. It is to give them the experience of going through the process of taking an animal and going through the work to turn them into food.

I totally agree with you Wilderness Survival not just being about fun, but instead about letting the boys know what they can handle. Here are my thoughts on why I am doing it this way:

1. A lot of these boys have not spent much time in the woods. I want them to enjoy the experience and hopefully get a taste for enjoying the outdoors more.

2. I don't want these boys to have such a bad time that they don't want to go back into the woods.

3. When someone joins the army, they expect things to be tough. These are not 18 year old soldiers, these are 12 year old boys.

4. In an actual survival situation water is the most important thing to have. You can go days and days without food, but not water. Having a shelter / protection from the environment is more important than fire. But having a fire provides a lot of comfort. And giving the boys chickens to clean and cook can keep them focused for hours. There is something to be said for just being actively engaged to pass the time. Sitting around and focusing on boredom, hunger, fear, etc. is not helpful.


I didn't just watch an episode of Man VS Wild for the first time yesterday, and decide I would try my luck in the woods with 20 kids and see what happens. I have spent years practicing wilderness survival, studying techniques, serving with the scouts. I have done similar activities multiple times and they are often the favorite activities the boys have. This activity is going to be great, and I simply came here seeking input on how to make it greater.

[Eric Holden]

I would let them kill them. If you can't trust a 12 year old boy with a knife/hatchet something is wrong. I killed my first chicken when I was 13.

[DiscGo]

I'm with you Eric. I actually went back to the organizers of this event after seeing Scott Cards & BruteForce's posts and pushed to have the boys kill the chickens themselves and was denied. That is how we have done it in the past but usually we have done it in smaller groups where we know the boys and their parents really well. Due to this being a larger group of boys, the organizers did not want to take the chance of offending anyone. At least they are letting us have the boys prepare the chickens.

[Scott Card]

the organizers did not want to take the chance of offending anyone.

After all, chicken comes from the grocery store. Dang, DiscGo - I keep hearing leaders telling us that our youth need to accomplish "hard things". You try to do that and other adult(s) (who I think don't quite have the vision) seem to be coming to the rescue and taking away that "hard thing" from the boys. Seems somewhere I heard a story of young Stripling Warriors with swords -- and we won't let our boys kill a chicken with a club or some such thing.

[DiscGo]

I'm with you Scott.

[Iceaxe]

At least they are letting us have the boys prepare the chickens.

Isn't that what KFC is for?

So bottomline they took your survival class and turned it into home economics.... and these are the same parents that will never figure out why their kid is 35 years old and still living at home in the basement.

Nothing like a generation of candyass human beings... no dodgeball at school, we don't keep score at little league games, everyone makes the team, everyone gets equal playing time, and now you can't kill and gut a chicken... I find it all pathetic.....


Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[DiscGo]

...we don't keep score at little league games

Is this true? My son just did soccer and just started teeball and they don't keep score. But I thought this was because they are 5 year olds. Do they really not keep track of the score in regular little league? That is so not cool if that is true!

[Scott Card]

The kids keep score even though the adults (some of them anyway) don't. My son knew who won even though no one recognized it.

[Iceaxe]

Recreational Leagues don't keep score. In most sports you can join what they call a Competitive League and they keep score and make team roster cuts. But many Competitive Leagues don't start until the kids reach Jr High age.

Luckily football has yet to adopt these candyass rules. It's one of the few bastions of old school left. That's why I coach football, it's one of the few places left where I can still teach my little kids to beat the crap out of other little kids and parents encourage it.

My two cents is life is all about winners and losers... so I teach my kids how to be winners from the start. Seriously.... winning at anything (sports, business, life) is not easy, but anyone can learn to be a winner, but it does take a lot of practice and hard work.

Too bad I watch so many teach their kids to just participate.... those kids will grow up to be nothing but cannon fodder when they come up against someone that was taught how to win.

[DiscGo]

I am going to make a huge score board and bring it with me to the games.

[accadacca]

I am going to make a huge score board and bring it with me to the games.

Do it!