Single Strand vs. Double Strand Rappel

[blamkin86]

Eric do you tie a Stone knot or anything at the top?

[Deathcricket]

Eric do you tie a Stone knot or anything at the top?

Stone knot for single strand rapping, not double.

[Kuya]

I feel it is important to know how to rig a contingency. Contingency riggings are pretty much only used with single rope rappels. I rappell both ways (double rope and single rope) but after learning some neat things from some very experienced canyoneers and SAR personnel, it is apparent how useful a single strand rope rigged with a contingency can be. I say LEARN all the ways to rappel safely. and if you are leading canyons, that person better understand how to perform a rescue, haul, or lower if needed.

[blamkin86]

Stone knot for single strand rapping, not double.

Yes I've learned that one and love it.

Let me try asking my question a different way: When you rap double, do you just throw the rope through the rapide at the top and start rapping, or is there any sort of kajiggering going on to keep one side of the two rope halves from slipping?

[Aj84737]

Yes I've learned that one and love it.

Let me try asking my question a different way: When you rap double, do you just throw the rope through the rapide at the top and start rapping, or is there any sort of kajiggering going on to keep one side of the two rope halves from slipping?

Just pull it through the rapid make sure both ends touch down and your golden. The pressure is consistant enough on both sides of the rope to not worry much about one side slipping much. That's why it's faster then setting up a biner block or stone knot.

One trick to not twist the ropes going double strand is to clip a biner to one rope above your rappel device and tie that into whatever setup you use to clip into your anchor with. For me I like the sterling PAS but it wouldn't matter what you used. The biner on one rope would take out the twists in it. It's a little annoying but only last man down needs to do it. I still however prefer to biner block or stone knot and single stand whenever possible.

[Eric Holden]

Eric do you tie a Stone knot or anything at the top?

Nope. Don't tie anything when double strand rappelling. I may tie a big ol fishermans knot on the end of any ends I think may be too short.

[rurri]

If doing something like Mystery with a couple of single rope rappels at the end I like to do the whole day single rope. Those last two rappels can already scare people, the last thing I want is to then change up the amount of friction and the method used to tie in.

If you do single rope the entire day on the little rappels earlier then the last two are more familiar.

A few reasons I am going more and more single rope:
-there are a lot more options to fix things if something goes wrong. (lowering)
-On the little shortie rappels you don't have to feed through and manage a ton of rope
-My rope stays out of the sand (especially nice if it got wet)
-Less things change (amount of friction) on the big wall rappels if you don't exclusively use single rope only on them.

Also, don't forget on double rope rappels things can also be rigged wrong. I know I once double checked myself and saw two ropes going into the belay device, and only one of the two ropes making it through the biner. Sure gave me a lot to think about.

[Renatomic808]

Anything with moving water, and/or pools at the bottom of your rappel; I say single strand. I feel it is easier to manage. However, it's also what I've practiced most. I'm totally comfortable with it, and I also weigh 230lbs.

Since our canyons are much more different than Utah canyons, we also have slightly different rope management techniques.

[ratagonia]

Stone knot for single strand rapping, not double.

If you Stone the rope, each rappeller can choose to go single or double.

[taatmk]

If you Stone the rope, each rappeller can choose to go single or double.

While I have no "typical" way of always doing the same thing, we commonly set up as Tom mentions. With a stone knot on a double strand, everyone has the option of doing it either single or double stranded. This way allows for an adult to simul rap with a youinger rappeller or a guy to simul with a gf or spouse....

Just be sure and have the last one down remember to undo the stone knot.

[Iceaxe]

Anything with moving water, and/or pools at the bottom of your rappel; I say single strand. I feel it is easier to manage.

With moving water single strand is the ONLY way to go.

Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[joeb]

Okay - since everyone is showing off their kids

[joeb]

With the kids - we go single strand into pools of water for easy disconnect and almost always double strand 8mm for everything vertical or near vertical. I send down the oldest to fireman the others. They have never gotten stuck on rope (but we practice quite a bit off the backyard treehouse so they are comfortable with various descenders, rope sizes etc

[Iceaxe]

When you are "guiding", single strand is the way to go.

But I seldom guide. I teach my noobs WTF so they are capable of dealing with situations like getting a tit caught in the rappel device. That seriously happen to a chick on one of our trips... hahaha... and she quickly dealt with the problem. It was pretty damn funny and everyone had a good chuckle after she was down.

Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[Spartacus]

When you are "guiding", single strand is the way to go.

But I seldom guide. I teach my noobs WTF so they are capable of dealing with situations like getting a tit caught in the rappel device. That seriously happen to a chick on one of our trips... hahaha... and she quickly dealt with the problem. It was pretty damn funny and everyone had a good chuckle after she was down.

Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

Talk about your titty-twister from hell!

[blamkin86]

Just be sure and have the last one down remember to undo the stone knot.

We have one member in our group who is convinced we'll forget, so we generally don't Stone, even though I love it.

Personally, I'm convinced I'm going to rig into the pull side and just superman right off the edge. I generally check 5-10 times every rap to make sure I picked the right strand.

[blamkin86]

I teach my noobs WTF so they are capable of dealing with situations like getting a tit caught in the rappel device.

I tried to google for WTF rappelling and canyoneering, and as you can imagine I didn't get much helpful info.

Is there a link to something I could read about this? I'm all about learning right now.

[Iceaxe]

Hahaha....

WTF = what the f**k

As in "I teach my noobs WTF they are doing...."

Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[Slot Machine]

There are benefits to both methods I feel that everyone should feel comfortable with either method because it is often situational.

^^Nice post!^^ X2

Every rappel persents a unique problem to solve. Sometimes obvious, sometimes not.

We used to be determined to rap double every chance we could but frequently ran into problems with this mindset. Rappelling down two ropes twisted around each other isn't fun. Trying to pull down ropes twisted around each other is even less fun. Ain't nobody got time for that, so we improved our methods.

We now back up our biner blocks for the first rappeller(s). Our last man deploys the pullcord, which is normally held clear of the rappel line by a teammate standing below, then the last man unclips the backup. This leaves no chance of clipping into the wrong side, no chance of tangles, and no chance of twisting the ropes and getting them stuck (or semi-stuck).

SRT is easy and safe once you develop a fine-tuned process for double-checking and testing your setup. Perhaps developing a solid process is where the real danger lies...

[blamkin86]

Hahaha....

WTF = what the f**k

As in "I teach my noobs WTF they are doing...."

Well, now it makes sense at least

I think we should come up with some W T and F letters that teach people what to do when something goes bad on the way down. Rope has an unexpected knot, I got my hair caught, I'm at the end of the rope 100' up, or whatever.