Accident in Constrychnine

[Deathcricket]

Wow, excellent report and i see even the failed webbing was posted! Now all we need is a video and this could be the most detailed accident TR ever.

[Brian in SLC]

Great report Rick. Thanks.

(maybe a paragraph or two and some spacing would make it a tad more readable for some of us)

Wow. Scary stuff.

[Taylor]

Dissapointing to read about another avoidable mistake in a canyon. Seems like it should be obvious but how about checking EVERY ANCHOR, EVERY PIECE OF WEBBING, EVERY TIME. Best wishes and speedy recovery to Bruce.

[Iceaxe]

Dissapointing to read about another avoidable mistake in a canyon. Seems like it should be obvious but how about checking EVERY ANCHOR, EVERY PIECE OF WEBBING, EVERY TIME. Best wishes and speedy recovery to Bruce.

I can see where this one would catch a lot of folks out, including myself.... a dozen canyoneers in front of you just rappeled from the anchor. There is a cue building behind you to rappel from the anchor. Easy to just clip and go with only a simple visual curtesy check.

YMMV

[canyoncaver]

Let he who has never made an avoidable mistake in a canyon cast the first rope bag...

[mcweyen]

We did the canyon on March 30th. We moved the webbing back a bit from the edge and used a meat anchor backup. The rappel is at 1:11 into this video from a couple weeks ago.

[USofCS]

Today at school we tested the remaining piece of webbing to see how much it could hold. As you can see it held only 2000 lbs of force being pulled, I can imagine even less with rubbing against the side of the cliff.

[mcweyen]

Brand new webbing is speced at 4000lbs. The way I read it elsewhere is that the webbing rubbed along the edge multiple times with multiple groups going over. At some point it was lengthened to lower the load on the anchor, which ended up being the ultimate demise of the webbing.

[peakbaggers]

Let he who has never made an avoidable mistake in a canyon cast the first rope bag...

AMEN!!

[peakbaggers]

[QUOTE=Iceaxe;532443]I can see where this one would catch a lot of folks out, including myself.... a dozen canyoneers in front of you just rappeled from the anchor. There is a cue building behind you to rappel from the anchor. Easy to just clip and go with only a simple visual curtesy check.


That, I would think, is exactly what happened. People waiting - more coming, so clip & go. Only/best solution? Train each member of your party that each one is responsible for self and for inspecting anchor before going. Another thing I have tried to do with our groups is at each anchor/rappel station, have one person appointed whose specific task is to monitor the anchor while everyone else descends. Seems like the larger the group though, the more distractions from various conversations going on, etc. and the less attention that is paid to what most deserves attention.

[hesse15]

That, I would think, is exactly what happened. People waiting - more coming, so clip & go. Only/best solution? Train each member of your party that each one is responsible for self and for inspecting anchor before going. Another thing I have tried to do with our groups is at each anchor/rappel station, have one person appointed whose specific task is to monitor the anchor while everyone else descends. Seems like the larger the group though, the more distractions from various conversations going on, etc. and the less attention that is paid to what most deserves attention.

mistake was people forgot they were in a canyon and not in Zion/Disneyland!!!!

2 weeks before I told Bruce straight in his face that if he did not change how was doing canyons he will got killed!!!
Glad he just got some broken bones!!!!

( sandtraps and fiddlestick are WAY more safe than what I witnessed 2 weekends before it)

[sail2fast]

My sincere wishes to Bruce for a full and speedy recovery.

A note on backups: On my trips we back every anchor up with a "meat anchor"
until the last person goes. This technique is critical for certain anchoring
techniques (think sandtrap), but we do this as a habit, even for very solid
anchors. We would certainly do this for a found deadman. The last man (usually
a small person) has more risk, but they do have a well tested anchor.


I do not agree at all with the attempt to point fingers at the remover of the
piton / bolt. As much as I sympathize with Bruce and the entire group for the
difficult experience they had to go through, the group was responsible for
ensuring that each anchor was sufficient for each member of the group. That is
the nature of canyoneering. Prior knowledge of a canyon and existing anchors
help make canyons more accessible, but canyons are ever changing and anchors are
in a state of decay from the moment they are built. Each group needs to take
full responsibility for negotiating them safely.


be careful out there!

[Bo_Beck]

mistake was people forgot they were in a canyon and not in Zion/Disneyland!!!!

The way I interpret this: "No need to check anchors in Zion!"
Hope I don't have to "Meet" you in a canyon in Zion ;-)

[hesse15]

The way I interpret this: "No need to check anchors in Zion!"
Hope I don't have to "Meet" you in a canyon in Zion ;-)

no I hope to meet you again around campfire not in a canyon because you need to carry my sorry ass out !!!!!


my comment that you misinterpret was that : most of the people that do ONLY Zions canyons are used to sturdy bolts so they never bother about been careful rappeller or inspecting anchors!!!!!


Bruce did mostly Zions, and we had a lengthy discussion 2 weeks before that natural anchor are more delicate!!!!

he already had a previous call with an anchor with one of his people flying free down to the ground!!!!



at least in Zion with the permit system there is a limit for the number of people, but in the rest of the colorado plateau is becoming a total craziness!!!!

[2065toyota]

I think people put way too much faith in these bolts that are placed in sandstone. I can't tell you how many times we have had the bolts fail when installed into concrete footings. And these are placed in sandstone. Be prudent with anchor choices.

[Mountaineer]

I think people put way too much faith in these bolts that are placed in sandstone. I can't tell you how many times we have had the bolts fail when installed into concrete footings. And these are placed in sandstone.

Yikes.

[Aj84737]

I think people put way too much faith in these bolts that are placed in sandstone. I can't tell you how many times we have had the bolts fail when installed into concrete footings. And these are placed in sandstone. Be prudent with anchor choices.

When i first started canyoneering i was blown away that people used natual anchors and i felt so much more safe with bolts. But now after some experience on natural anchors, i would trust a tree and alot of other natural anchors over any bolt. Except that little bush at the end of das boot, that bush creeps me out lol.

[Spokey]

The rest of the webbing from the accident. This piece was turned over to the Sheriff's Department. They requested it after we showed it to them after we hiked out of the canyon that night.

[Iceaxe]

Except that little bush at the end of das boot, that bush creeps me out lol.

FWIW: There is a bowling ball chokestone in the watercourse that we use. Makes the route more fun as you have to swim out around a blind corner to complete the canyon. Taking my family through Das Boot last year I looked at that bush and thought "not a chance in hell I'm risking my family on that anchor".

YMMV

[Aj84737]

FWIW: There is a bowling ball chokestone in the watercourse that we use. Makes the route more fun as you have to swim out around a blind corner to complete the canyon. Taking my family through Das Boot last year I looked at that bush and thought "not a chance in hell I'm risking my family on that anchor".

YMMV

We saw that other way too but I think we were worried about how much rope was in contact with the rock on the pull or something. Or maybe we saw an anchor above that slot and didn't notice that chokestone. Hell idk that's been too many canyons ago. But we decided the bush would be alright. Light and quick rap that's for sure.