Arch Canyon 3/9/13

[2065toyota]

http://canyoncollective.com/threads/...ch-2013.18127/

[jman]

You do see the conflict of interest here by just posting the link?

[2065toyota]

You do see the conflict of interest here by just posting the link?

Not really.

We did the canyon and the trip report was posted there. I could retype the whole thing but it seems a lot easier to link it. I am members of both and Bogley is here to provide drama, pictures, entertainment, trip reports, etc. When I post a report it will be on both forums, but I think a link is more than sufficient. We are all here for the same reasons and/or goals.

[2065toyota]

I am also vigilant at posting reports on canditions also for all to see. Add it it there and I will update it

[Iceaxe]

Not really.

We did the canyon and the trip report was posted there. I could retype the whole thing but it seems a lot easier to link it.

What you did is at best considered very poor forum manners and at worst considered spamming.

You don't have to retype the entire report. You can cut and paste with two keystrokes. If it will be allowed kinda depends what CC does. If they don't allow similar posts pointing to Bogley this will not be allowed. And reading the CC user agreement it appears it will not be allowed.

FWIW - Bogley only allows this type of pointing post to those allowing the same thing and even then it is up to the moderaters if it is appropriate or spamming.


Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[2065toyota]

What you did is at best considered very poor forum manners and at worst considered spamming.

You don't have to retype the entire report. You can cut and paste with two keystrokes. If it will be allowed kinda depends what CC does. If they don't allow similar posts pointing to Bogley this will not be allowed. And reading the CC user agreement it appears it will not be allowed.

FWIW - Bogley only allows this type of pointing post to those allowing the same thing and even then it is up to the moderaters if it is appropriate or spamming.


Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

Little more that 2 keystrokes to add print and pictures but I see your point. The point wasn't to provide "spamming" but to provide info for a trip report and beta for a canyon. Whether it offends anybody as to where to it's posted that's not my problem. If the point is for Bogley to be the master of canyons, then my post assists that agenda. Google searches consistently bring Bogley to the top of canyon searches and my link further assists that. No harm intended but so be it. If I wasn't concerned with Bogley's well being then I wouldn't have even posted the trip report link. This seems more like a personal issue more than a forum or canyoneering issue

[Iceaxe]

Little more that 2 keystrokes to add print and pictures but I see your point.

Bogley and CC use the same software, which makes cutting and pasting between the two very simple. It is no more effort then cutting and pasting a link. When you cut and paste a TR it should transfer pictures and all (unless it is specifically block by one of the forums, bogley has no such blocks).

Bottomline... if you can post a link it is exactly zero additional effort to post the entire TR, which is considered proper forum manners.



Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[2065toyota]

Lots of links are posted throughout Bogley. Doesn't really seem like bad manners. Quite a few of them even to Climb-Utah. Still smells like a personal agenda.

[2065toyota]

The next time this situation arises I will duplicate your proper manners and post similar to your last trip report on Sevenmile.


"For those that want to know the route follow the link below

Sevenmile Canyon Route Description"



For those that want to know the route follow the link below

http://canyoncollective .com/betabas...rch-canyon.72/

[Sombeech]

Not really.

We did the canyon and the trip report was posted there. I could retype the whole thing but it seems a lot easier to link it. I am members of both and Bogley is here to provide drama, pictures, entertainment, trip reports, etc. When I post a report it will be on both forums, but I think a link is more than sufficient. We are all here for the same reasons and/or goals.

All we ask is that both sites play fair with one another.

If you can start a Trip Report thread over there and post only a link to the report on bogley, and nothing else, and it does not get moderated, then let's go for it.

The bogley administrators are not looking to be Masters of Canyons. We only want equal treatment. If somebody could post a "thoughts on bogley" thread over there and let it roll with high popularity without moderation, then we're looking at equal treatment. And if you come across a Trip Report that only contains a link to a Bogley Trip Report thread in the first post, without being taken down or edited, then we are looking at equality and we may begin to actually get somewhere.

Would you agree with this approach?

You'll notice I have not moderated your link or post.

Thanks.

[Scott P]

What happens when it's the other way around?

On the canyons group for example, I have linked many trip reports to both Bogley and Summitpost because you can't really put photos in the canyons group messages. No one ever moderated them.

I agree that cracking down on this can be seen as a personal agenda between big players/moderators on each website. Unless it is done to degrade the other website, cracking down on "normal" members doing this when they had no malicious intent is only going to drive away people from either website.

As far as cut and pasting goes, many members aren't aware that you can simply cut and paste photos to Bogley. Until someone pointed it out, I wasn't aware I could either and it only works when using certain web browsers and doesn't work with others. The section of a post above made by the "offender" seems to indicate that he also wasn't aware that you could cut and paste photos.

[Iceaxe]

Lots of links are posted throughout Bogley. Doesn't really seem like bad manners. Quite a few of them even to Climb-Utah. Still smells like a personal agenda.

Couple of BIG differences... first is Boglay and Climb-Utah have a partnership agreement to cross promote. If you look at the front page of Bogley you will see a list of their current partners. You will also note that CC has a similar agreement with Backcountryposts and Imlay gear.... when you see a partnership agreement between two forums or websites that changes the rules.

Stop looking for personal agenda's and start trying to understand what the forums are trying to accomplish and it will make more sense.

What happens when it's the other way around?

On the canyons group for example,

FWIW: Yahoo never moderated links to Bogley, and Bogley never moderated links to Yahoo.

[2065toyota]

All we ask is that both sites play fair with one another.

If you can start a Trip Report thread over there and post only a link to the report on bogley, and nothing else, and it does not get moderated, then let's go for it.

The bogley administrators are not looking to be Masters of Canyons. We only want equal treatment. If somebody could post a "thoughts on bogley" thread over there and let it roll with high popularity without moderation, then we're looking at equal treatment. And if you come across a Trip Report that only contains a link to a Bogley Trip Report thread in the first post, without being taken down or edited, then we are looking at equality and we may begin to actually get somewhere.

Would you agree with this approach?

You'll notice I have not moderated your link or post.

Thanks.

I didn't post the original trip report on CC. I was just a member of the party and Tom posted the trip report and the beta for the canyon. I was named personally in the report, so it would seem really stupid to copy and paste a trip report naming myself in it a few times.

What are the forums exactly trying to accomplish besides provide an atmosphere to share experiences and provide information. Bogley is my main site, but I still see no harm done

[Sombeech]

Tom posted the trip report and the beta for the canyon.

Wait.... you're saying Tom posted a Trip Report?

LOL. Maybe he just saves his arguments for bogley.

[ratagonia]

Copying someone else's Trip Report in full is bad form. Also, it violates the OP's copyright, though it would be pretty hard to get sued for that. Posting a link, or a teaser and link, is good form.

I generally post Trip Reports on my own Blog, and post a link at Bogley and Canyons. Now that I am using WordPress, I can see where my traffic comes from, and Bogley is consistently #2. Facebook #1, Canyons a distant third.

With the addition of CC, I am posting TRs there for a few months to help CC get started.

I appreciate that Bogley has never objected or complained about me posting links to my site. I am a BIG SHOT after all, so i did throw some money into the mix.

Tom

[Iceaxe]

What are the forums exactly trying to accomplish besides provide an atmosphere to share experiences and provide information. Bogley is my main site, but I still see no harm done

Ideally a forum's main objective is to generate discussion and content on their forum.

The reason a forum would oppose a redirect is it hi-jacks the public from one forum to anther. Linking to anther website or blog that does not have a discussion forum is not bad as any discussion moves back the the original forum.

This is not a Bogley vs CC thing... this is a proper forum etiquette thing that should be followed on all forums.

FWIW: I didn't realize your original link was to someone else's TR. Which I would consider a gray area. YMMV.

[Scott P]

The reason a forum would oppose a redirect is it hi-jacks the public from one forum to anther. Linking to anther website or blog that does not have a discussion forum is not bad as any discussion moves back the the original forum.

This is not a Bogley vs CC thing... this is a proper forum etiquette thing that should be followed on all forums.

What about linking full beta? For example, what if someone asks for information on Professor Creek?

You would either have to rewrite a summary of the canyon each time or just post links to either Summitpost, canyoncollective, or ajroadtrips (which is much easier). Is this not allowed?

[2065toyota]

What about linking full beta? For example, what if someone asks for information on Professor Creek?

You would either have to rewrite a summary of the canyon each time or just post links to either Summitpost, canyoncollective, or ajroadtrips (which is much easier). Is this not allowed?

I get the sense it's allowed to link any site but it may rub some people the wrong way because it is CC. Most all of Shane's TR's have links to his beta which I believe is a good idea and is very helpful if you are needing the info on it. Tom's TR's are generally posted as Rave's on his site, and links are posted here to direct them to it. It has never been an issue in the past and hopefully still wont be.

And to answer the issue
http://canyoncollective.com/threads/...-valley.18105/

This was a trip report posted on CanyonCollective with no words or pictures. Just a TR thread post with a direct link. No calling out or drama followed.

[2065toyota]

There are only 4 more days that the canyon is open. With the time change could easily be done after work this week