Man shopping with rifle at Utah JCPenney

[oldno7]

Still looking for the actual bill--here is it's intent:

Utah is an open carry state, meaning you can carry a gun in public for all to see. But that law also carries hefty responsibility. If you cross the line your legal right could turn into disorderly conduct.

There have been some inconsistencies when it comes to filing charges against people carrying guns in public. Oftentimes police are hesitant to take action because they don't want to infringe on someone's civil rights.

State Representative Paul Ray is sponsoring House Bill 268 in an attempt to clarify when carrying a gun becomes disorderly conduct.

[oldno7]

If this bill goes to the floor, is there any chance at all someone will mention the jc penney incident?

[Iceaxe]

If it goes to the floor they should mention the Penny's incident as that is exactly what the bill is designed to protect.

Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[oldno7]

Ice
I'll even make a friendly wager with ya.
If the bill is scheduled to be heard, you and I go to the Capitol, we each put a $100 bill on the rail.
If within the first 15 minutes of this debate, jc penney gun toter is mentioned in a negative light, I pick up.
If there is no mention of jcpgt, you pick up.
Winner buys the afternoons beers
Interested?

[Iceaxe]

Why would I care if the comments were positive or negative? So long as the comments are accurate and factual I'm good with that. I think it's good our representatives know exactly what they are protecting or eliminating and why.



Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[oldno7]

Why would I care if the comments were positive or negative? So long as the comments are accurate and factual I'm good with that. I think it's good our representatives know exactly what they are protecting or eliminating and why.



Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

Your right, legislation is based upon accuracy and facts.
Peoples opinions, regardless of basis are never figured in.
I stand corrected.

p.s.--have you heard lately of the legislation these guys are trying to pass based on their accuracy and facts?

Something about "assault rifles" something or another

[Sandstone Addiction]

H.B. 268

1
DISORDERLY CONDUCT AMENDMENTS
2 2013 GENERAL SESSION
3 STATE OF UTAH
4 Chief Sponsor: Paul Ray
5 Senate Sponsor: ____________
6
7 LONG TITLE
8 General Description:
9 This bill includes displaying a dangerous weapon under certain circumstances in the
10 definition of disorderly conduct.
11 Highlighted Provisions:
12 This bill:
13 . provides that displaying a dangerous weapon in public under certain circumstances
14 may be disorderly conduct; and
15 . confirms that merely displaying a dangerous weapon in public without other
16 behavior is not disorderly conduct.
17 Money Appropriated in this Bill:
18 None
19 Other Special Clauses:
20 None
21 Utah Code Sections Affected:
22 AMENDS:
23 76-9-102, as last amended by Laws of Utah 1999, Chapter 20
24
25 Be it enacted by the Legislature of the state of Utah:
26 Section 1. Section 76-9-102 is amended to read:
27 76-9-102. Disorderly conduct.

---

28 (1) A person is guilty of disorderly conduct if:
29 (a) [he] the person refuses to comply with the lawful order of [the police] a law
30 enforcement officer to move from a public place, or knowingly creates a hazardous or
31 physically offensive condition, by any act which serves no legitimate purpose; or
32 (b) intending to cause public inconvenience, annoyance, or alarm, or recklessly
33 creating a risk thereof, [he] the person:
34 (i) displays a dangerous weapon in a public place under circumstances that would
35 cause a reasonable person to fear for the safety of any person;
36 [(i)] (ii) engages in fighting or in violent, tumultuous, or threatening behavior;
37 [(ii)] (iii) makes unreasonable noises in a public place;
38 [(iii)] (iv) makes unreasonable noises in a private place which can be heard in a public
39 place; or
40 [(iv)] (v) obstructs vehicular or pedestrian traffic.
41 (2) "Public place," for the purpose of this section, means any place to which the public
42 or a substantial group of the public has access and includes but is not limited to streets,
43 highways, and the common areas of schools, hospitals, apartment houses, office buildings,
44 transport facilities, and shops.
45 (3) The otherwise lawful possession of a dangerous weapon, whether visible or
46 concealed, without additional behavior, does not constitute a hazardous or physically offensive
47 condition, threatening behavior, or a cause for public inconvenience, annoyance, or alarm
48 under Subsection (1).
49 [(3)] (4) Disorderly conduct is a class C misdemeanor if the offense continues after a
50 request by a person to desist. Otherwise it is an infraction.

[Sandstone Addiction]

I'm not very good at interpreting this legal stuff...

[Iceaxe]

It says the guy at Penny's can not be charged with disorderly conduct just for having the firearm. It says he must display additional provocation.

In other words... lack of commonsense is not a reason for a ticket if you are minding your own business.

Or at least that is my take.

Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[Sombeech]

He shouldn't be penalized for carrying a firearm, but what he was doing was trying to prove a point, open peoples' eyes, or whatever he wants to call it, in somewhat of a shocking manner. THAT is what he should be penalized for, causing somewhat of a disturbance.

[Iceaxe]

The guy at Penny's was not cited, but a guy at the provo mall last year was for doing the same thing. The law is being changed to protect your right to carry.

Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[Iceaxe]

FYI - The 2013 session of the Utah Legislature convened on January 28. The following bill has been introduced:

House Bill 268, sponsored by state Representative Paul Ray (R-13), would provide that, in the absence of threatening behavior, the otherwise lawful possession of a firearm, whether visible or concealed, does not constitute a violation of Disorderly Conduct.

There is a problem in Utah that some jurisdictions are arresting people for open carry when it is clearly NOT prohibited by statute. These jurisdictions have sought creative ways to harass law-abiding firearm owners who are legally carrying unconcealed firearms for self-defense. HB 268 would remove one of the ploys (charging the person with Disorderly Conduct) being used by some jurisdictions within Utah to circumvent state law and the Utah Constitution in an attempt to go after these law-abiding firearm owners.