Oct 4-16 We're On Our Way (Back)!

[jdgibney]

So, my friend Karen and I are making our return to southern Utah/Northern Arizona in early October. Unlike our first trip 2 years ago where we drove 2300 miles and did a huge loop that included Monument Valley, Moab, Goblin Valley, Capitol Reef, Bryce and a drive through Zion, we are keeping it to two areas, Zion-ish, and Page-ish. Our planning had to wait until we found out if we got permits for CBN/The Wave, which we were fortunate enough to get, for Fri, Oct 12. We traded our two extra permits (originally intended for Karen's aunt/uncle, but they can't make it) for a ride to White Pocket with someone with high clearance 4WD. Our other plans are very tentative, but my tentative outline that is starting to come together is:

Thurs, Oct 4 - Arrive in Vegas at 1:30p Visit with a friend and her family (possibly stay with them)
Fri, Oct 5 - Find a good day hike near Vegas. Karen Arrives in Vegas at 10:40p (yuk) (stay with Karen's friends in Vegas)
Sat, Oct 6 - Drive up to Hurricane - hotel for a few nights as our base - explore easy Zion stuff, intro to Narrows perhaps?
Sun, Oct 7 - Kanarra Creek more easy touristy Zion stuff?
Mon, Oct 8 -Observation Point/Hidden Canyon
Tues, Oct 9 - Head towards Page, maybe hike Willis Creek? Camp out at Alstrom Point for sunset? (is this do-able in a normal rental SUV or should we not dare?)
Weds, Oct 10 - Wahweap Hoodoos hike check into hotel in Page
Thurs, Oct 11 - Lower Antelope Canyon, maybe Upper? (I've been to Lower, Karen hasn't been to either), Horseshoe Bend Sunset, meet up with Wayne our awesome driver for Fri-Sun
Fri, Oct 12 - Coyote Buttes North/the wave, camp at/near State Line
Sat, Oct 13 - Drive to, explore, and camp at White Pocket
Sun, Oct 14 - Sunrise at White Pocket, drive back out, pick up our car (not sure where yet), head back towards vegas (maybe stop at Coral Pink Sand Dunes if we can get there in late afternoon/sunset?)
Mon, Oct 15 - Drop off Karen at McCarran by 1:00p Maybe re-visit Valley of Fire
Tues, Oct 16 - Get to Airport to fly home by 9:30a

So, that's just a basic outline off the top of my head. It'd be great to meet up with anyone who'd be around for some hiking/photos, etc, or whatever. If anyone has any more specific suggestions, warnings, etc, it'd be great to hear. I'll be posting more questions about specific things later. I got a lot of help on here for my last trip out (Jan 2011), and it was greatly appreciated!

We'll be looking for suggestions for good sunrise/sunset spots in/around these locations, and also must see spots along the way.

[zzyzx]

Tues, Oct 9 - Head towards Page, maybe hike Willis Creek? Camp out at Alstrom Point for sunset? (is this do-able in a normal rental SUV or should we not dare?)

If the road conditions are good, that's no problem w/ normal rental SUV.
Check them please in advance.

Btw. very nice trip planning.

[jdgibney]

Thanks, Michael. We'll see what we end up doing, I don't want to over-do it, and get worn out :)

I am thinking about going to Death Valley as a day trip on Friday, Oct 5 before picking up my friend that night at the airport, since its only 2.5 hours.

[zzyzx]

An other nice sunset spot is a little south of Horse Shoe Bend. A short rim hike along the Waterholes Canyon. You'll see a little Arch and sandstone structures similar the 2nd Wave in the CBN.
If you heading Hwy 89 from Page to Kanab, have a litte stop at Blue Pool Arch.

[jdgibney]

An other nice sunset spot is a little south of Horse Shoe Bend. A short rim hike along the Waterholes Canyon. You'll see a little Arch and sandstone structures similar the 2nd Wave in the CBN.
If you heading Hwy 89 from Page to Kanab, have a litte stop at Blue Pool Arch.

Michael, I found this page: http://www.isaczermak.com/arizona-ar...es-canyon.html which has a beautiful sunset picture, is that what you were talking about? That is pretty awesome! Do you need a navajo land permit to get to this part as you do the slot canyon?

[zzyzx]

jdgibney, Yes we talk about the same place. You need a permit for that area.
Grab them at the Chapter house, or at Antelope. Ask in advance.
I've visited the best slot in 2008. I bought a permit and I've never asked. The rules has been changed in the years. As first till the powelines, then guided tours only, now they split the upper section.
IMO - Navajo change her mind, like other ones her undies.
You can find additional info here and some pics there .

[erial]

Thanks, Michael. We'll see what we end up doing, I don't want to over-do it, and get worn out :)

I am thinking about going to Death Valley as a day trip on Friday, Oct 5 before picking up my friend that night at the airport, since its only 2.5 hours.

Don't wish to deter you from your DV day trip, but if you get up on the 5th and decide 5 hours in a car is a bit much, may I offer some places to visit closer to Las Vegas:

Sloan Canyon: extensive petroglyphs. Access is via dirt road off of I-15 just south of Vegas. I've gotten to about a half mile of the trailhead in a passenger car.
Road gets a bit rough, but you can be in the midst of the rock art within 30 to 45 minutes after leaving your vehicle.

Turtlehead Peak: Two miles from trailhead to summit. Mostly class 1, wee spot of class 2. You'll have to pay an entrance fee to get into Red Rocks unless you have one of the National Parks passes. There are more challenging hikes/climbs in Red Rocks, but Turtlehead affords a pleasant introduction.

Liberty Bell Arch: Believe it's about a 1.5 mile hike on a well established trail. You'll pass a mine on the way and have a view of the new bridge over the Colorado.

Anniversary Narrows: Haven't done this hike, but it's supposed to be a short but superlative slot canyon.

Goggling these places should provide you with additional descriptions/directions.

[jdgibney]

Don't wish to deter you from your DV day trip, but if you get up on the 5th and decide 5 hours in a car is a bit much, may I offer some places to visit closer to Las Vegas:

Sloan Canyon: extensive petroglyphs. Access is via dirt road off of I-15 just south of Vegas. I've gotten to about a half mile of the trailhead in a passenger car.
Road gets a bit rough, but you can be in the midst of the rock art within 30 to 45 minutes after leaving your vehicle.

Turtlehead Peak: Two miles from trailhead to summit. Mostly class 1, wee spot of class 2. You'll have to pay an entrance fee to get into Red Rocks unless you have one of the National Parks passes. There are more challenging hikes/climbs in Red Rocks, but Turtlehead affords a pleasant introduction.

Liberty Bell Arch: Believe it's about a 1.5 mile hike on a well established trail. You'll pass a mine on the way and have a view of the new bridge over the Colorado.

Anniversary Narrows: Haven't done this hike, but it's supposed to be a short but superlative slot canyon.

Goggling these places should provide you with additional descriptions/directions.

Thank you for these suggestions! I think we are going to do death valley on the Friday before we leave, but I will still have a full day on the back end of the trip to explore solo, so these are great ideas.

It looks like my friend is going to be able to fly in about the same time as me in Thursday as her work plans got changed for that week. We were going to go up to st. George on Friday but with the marathon on Saturday, we decided to wait.

[jdgibney]

Semi-Updated/Stil very Tentative Timeline

My friend Karen is arriving Thursday now, which makes things a little more awesome


Thurs, Oct 4 - Both of us arrive in Vegas by 1:30, pick up car, pick up gear, stay with Karen's Friend in Vegas
Fri, Oct 5 - Day Trip to Death Valley (definitely looking for suggestions/ideas for a single day there, will arrive hopefully shortly after sunrise and stay til sunset) return to Vegas, stay with Karen's Friend
Sat, Oct 6 - Drive to Watchman Campground, hopefully visiting Kanarra Creek in the morning on our way up. Sunset in Zion. Stay at Watchman Campground.
Sun, Oct 7 - Touristy Day in Zion, stay at Watchman Campground
Mon, Oct 8 - Observation Point/Hidden Canyon hike in Zion. Stay in Kanab
Tues, Oct 9 -Drive to North Rim Grand Canyon spend day there, shooting sunset, staying at campground
Weds, Oct 10 - Grand Canyon north rim sunrise, morning hike, pack up and head for Page, stopping along the way, maybe Lee's Ferry and marble Canyon? Stay in hotel in Page.
Thurs, Oct 11 - Antelope Canyon/Horseshoe Bend/local Page stuff stay in hotel in Page
Fri, Oct 12 - Coyote Buttes North/the wave Waynee-ack Camp near CBN (Stateline?)
Sat, Oct 13 - White Pocket with Waynee-ack Camp near White Pocket
Sun, Oct 14 - Sunrise at White Pocket, pick up car (not sure where we'll leave it yet), head back towards Vegas, stop at Coral Pink Dunes? Stay with Karen's friend
Mon, Oct 15 - Karen Flies out wicked early Monday morning, find a good place to spend the day. Stay with my friend.
Tues, Oct 16 - Get to Airport to fly home by 9:30a


So, that's what I'm looking at as of right now.


If you had a full day (sunrise-sunset) to spend in Zion how would you spend it to see the most amount of stuff without hiking too much (we are doing observation point as our 'big' hike on Monday.


Any suggestions for the Grand Canyon North Rim?


Thanks again!

[erial]

During your Zion day you could take a ride up the Kolob Reservoir/Terrace Rd north of Route 9 in Virgin. The half mile hike to the Cave Valley rock art is worthwhile. Further up the road is the Wildcat Canyon trailhead/parking area. A level trail departs there for pleasant alpine travel to viewpoints of Russell Gulch and the Northgate Peaks. Even further up the road is Lava Point and the lookout vista there. You can actually continue to take the road north past the reservoir all the way to rt 14 and Cedar City. If the aspen leaves happen to be reaching their peak, that ride might be worthwhile although you'd likely see similar on your way to the North Rim.

Closer to Zion: a ride out to Grafton would be touristy fun. Also for sunset viewing, drive up to the transmitter towers just past the Eagle Crags trailhead. You won't necessarily get a good view of the sunset, but Kinesava et al will definitely fire up as the sun goes down. Alternatively, a mile or two ride up the Smithsonian Butte road will offer similar viewpoints.

[tanya]

Grand Canyon North Rim!

Yup - Here are the usual options:
http://www.zionnational-park.com/ghike.htm


There are great picks depending on the energy and time you want to spend.

Great 4WD to a nice viewpoint
http://www.zionnational-park.com/gra...on-sublime.htm

Best Quickie
http://www.zionnational-park.com/gra...cape-royal.htm

If you want the best of the best do Toroweap, but that's a full day. Great place to camp. Not a bunch of hiking options, but what a view!
http://www.zionnational-park.com/toroweap.htm

[tanya]

Fri, Oct 5 - Find a good day hike near Vegas. Karen Arrives in Vegas at 10:40p (yuk) (stay with Karen's friends in Vegas)
It's Vegas! Hike in the enclosed downtown section. You will have a blast!


Sat, Oct 6 - Drive up to Hurricane - hotel for a few nights as our base - explore easy Zion stuff, intro to Narrows perhaps?
Don't miss Emerald Pools and Weeping Rock.

Sun, Oct 7 - Kanarra Creek more easy touristy Zion stuff?

Kanarra Creek upped their parking fees. I am not sure what they are at right now, but I need to update the website with it. The water might be cold in October, in fact, it probably going to be downright chilly.



Mon, Oct 8 -Observation Point/Hidden Canyon

That is a steep and hot hike, but a great choice for October.


Tues, Oct 9 - Head towards Page, maybe hike Willis Creek? Camp out at Alstrom Point for sunset? (is this do-able in a normal rental SUV or should we not dare?)

Heck, I take my mini-van to Willis Creek. But be aware if the roads are wet, even a 4WD will not help much on that clay road. Check out Bull Valley Gorge while you are at it!
http://www.zionnational-park.com/sta...lley-gorge.htm


Weds, Oct 10 - Wahweap Hoodoos hike check into hotel in Page
Oh yeah, but this is a brutal hike in the heat. Absolutely magical at the right time of year. October should be nice!~


Thurs, Oct 11 - Lower Antelope Canyon, maybe Upper? (I've been to Lower, Karen hasn't been to either), Horseshoe Bend Sunset, meet up with Wayne our awesome driver for Fri-Sun

Photogenic!

Fri, Oct 12 - Coyote Buttes North/the wave, camp at/near State Line

Show up early. There are only 4 spots. First come, first use. This is really close to the Wahweap Hoodoos and the Wave. You could use the same camp spot for all 3 hikes. You could also add Buckskin gulch.
http://www.zionnational-park.com/buckskin-gulch.htm

Sat, Oct 13 - Drive to, explore, and camp at White Pocket

I don't think you can camp at South Coyote Buttes, but you can go back to that campground you mentioned before or better yet, keep the same camp while you do this, Wahweap Hoodoos, and the Wave. There is a nice slot canyon near by too -

Sun, Oct 14 - Sunrise at White Pocket, drive back out, pick up our car (not sure where yet),

[jdgibney]

Tanya! Thank you for chiming in, I appreciate it! And I can't wait to check out the new book :)

We are meeting up with someone in Page to go to the Wave and then White Pocket (they have high clearance 4WD), I'm wondering what to do with our rental car for the 2 days that we will be 'gone' from Page....Any suggestions? (ultimately, on Sunday after we catch sunrise at White Pocket, we want to head back to Vegas)

[Dayhiker]

Fri, Oct 5 - Day Trip to Death Valley: The two best guides to Death Valley are “Road Guide to Death Valley National Park” and the “Photographer's Guide to Death Valley” So from my time in the Park, which the last few years has just been a driving through to get from Lone Pine to Beatty.

Sunrise from either Dante's View or Zabriskie Point. Most people go to Zabriskie Point for sunrise. Dante's View is more off the beaten path but I think better views.
South of Furnace Creek: Golden Canyon hike is a nice hike, Devil's Golf Course, try an get away from the area around the parking lot, and Badwater the lowest point, there are paths and there was a boardwalk there.

The Photographer's guide list some other places further south but I don't remember much about them (I was that area in 2005).

North of Furnace Creek: There are a couple of Interpretive Trails that I have never done. Stay on 190 as it heads Left (West) at the junction and head over to Stovepipe Wells. There are some sand dunes on the right side. There is now a parking lot for them that you can't miss. Sunset there is generally very nice there and be crowded with photographers. Make sure you have plenty of gas to at least get to Beatty. Gas in the park generally runs over $1.00 more a gallon than here in Vegas. And there are only two stations in Beatty.

Back at the junction you can go North up to Scotty's Castle or East to Beatty. I think you will be short of time to explorer the North part. If you go toward Beatty and it is still daylight stop at Ryolite, the turn off will be on your left at about 4 miles from Beatty on one of many long straight stretches of highway. The desert art (Goldwell Open Air museum) and the old buildings are quite interesting.

Once in Beatty you are a little over 100 miles from Vegas on US 95. There are a few things to see on that stretch of the Highway but I will assume it will be dark. But as you get closer to Indian Springs keep an eye out for Predator and Reaper Drones (there about the size of a Cessna), that is where Creech Air Force base is located and they fly them out of there and they control all Air Force drones world wide from there.

Sat, Oct 6: Both Zion and Kanarraville are about 2.5 hours/156 miles from Vegas
Kanarra Creek: I'll second what Tanya says, the water will be very cold. It is pretty cold year around and even with proper shoes and socks your feet will go numb. In the past I have hiked it in both mid September and late October, September I don't remember being too bad but late (26th) October was really cold. This last July it was still $10 to park and there was no agent at the water tank on a Monday.

Sun, Oct 7: The shuttle will still be running. One of the hikes I take people on that have never been there is the Kayenta Trail from the Grotto to Emerald Pools to the Lodge. The Upper Emerald Pools loop section was closed when I was there this last May.

Tues, Oct 9: North Rim Grand Canyon: You are cutting it close to when they close for the season. You have campground reservations?
If you are there at least be at Cape Royal for the sunset. In the spring it can get quite crowded out there but I have never been there this late in the season.
Hikes: Transept Trail is a nice trail that you can take from the campground to the Lodge and there are enough trails in the area that you can do a loop back to the campground.
Widforss Trail is an very good hike with some interesting views. There use to be some benches out at the end of the trail to sit on.

Weds, Oct 10: Lee's Ferry and marble Canyon: Not a lot to see there but you can walk up to the Colorado River. And you can hike the lower part of Paria Canyon up to Lonely Dell Ranch and beyond.

Page: I seem to remember you didn't have good luck with restaurants in Page the last time. I've eaten at a few places, The Dam Bar and Grill use to be good but I seem to always eat at Slackers at least once when I stay there. Also the Safeway makes very good inexpensive breakfast sandwiches and if you are looking for coffee it has the only Starbucks in the area.

Why can't you take the car down to the State line campground?

[jdgibney]

Dayhiker, sorry I didn't respond sooner, but thank you for your suggestions!

my current tentative itinerary (if anyone wants to meet up, let me know!):
Thurs, Oct 4 - Both of us arrive in Vegas, pick up rental car, rental camera equip, borrow some gear from friend, stay with Karen's friend
Fri, Oct 5 - Day Trip to Death Valley, hopefully Zabreskie Point for Sunrise, Mesquite Dunes, Riolite Ghost Town, maybe Mosaic Canyon during the day, ending up with Badwater Basin for sunset then back to Vegas to stay with Karen's friend.
Sat, Oct 6 - Camping at Watchman Campground. Driving from Vegas up to Kanarra Creek and then over to Zion. Hoping to catch an awesome sunset, maybe of the Watchman.
Sun, Oct 7 - Spend day at Zion, not sure what we'll do yet, stay at Watchman Campground.
Mon, Oct 8 - Either Angel's Landing or Observation Point Hike, more Zion Stuff, then drive to hotel in Kanab.
Tues, Oct 9 -Sunrise at Coral Pink Sand Dunes then drive to Grand Canyon North Rim. Camp at North Rim Campground, explore the area, sunset somewhere.
Weds, Oct 10 - Sunrise at Cape Royal, drive back to campground and pack up, and head out. Drive to page, maybe stop at Lee's Ferry and Marble Canyon. Check into Hotel for 2 nights. Maybe sunset at Stud Horse Point?
Thurs, Oct 11 - Find somewhere for sunrise. Lower Antelope Canyon late morning, maybe some other stuff around Page. meet up with Wayne and head up to Horseshoe Bend for Sunset.
Fri, Oct 12 - Head over to Coyote Buttes North/the wave with Wayne, Camp near CBN (Stateline?)
Sat, Oct 13 - White Pocket with Wayne, Camp near White Pocket
Sun, Oct 14 - Sunrise at White Pocket, pick up car (not sure where we'll leave it yet), head back towards Vegas, spend the afternoon/evening at Valley of Fire?
Mon, Oct 15 - Drop off Karen at McCarran wicked early (6:50 flight) and head out for solo day of exploring, I'm thinking of going back to Valley of Fire for the day... staying with my friend in Vegas
Tues, Oct 16 - Get to Airport to fly home by 9:30a and head home

[Dayhiker]

Your welcome. That's quite the trip you have planned there with some long days. Enjoy the trip. If there's anything else or info you need just leave a post in this thread. I only check in once a week so I maybe slow to reply.

[jdgibney]

Your welcome. That's quite the trip you have planned there with some long days. Enjoy the trip. If there's anything else or info you need just leave a post in this thread. I only check in once a week so I maybe slow to reply.

Just realized you asked about driving to State Line.
I'm hoping we can camp at State Line the night after we explore Coyote Buttes North/Wave and then we are taking Wayne's 4wd High Clearance pickup to White Pocket, so I need to figure out where to leave the rental car safely while we go for the night to White Pocket (we're planning on camping there so we can shoot sunset and sunrise at White Pocket). I'm going to inquire at the BLM place in Kanab to see if we can leave our vehicle there and just take the pickup in for the weekend...

[JFstego]

Yep, "the Wall" is on the northern rim of the Waterholes Slot Canyon, about 2/3 of a mile from the road. We got our permits at the Leche-e Chapter House (see http://www.americansouthwest.net/slo...es/canyon.html). They are, I think, $5 per person.

Your itinerary looks great. And Krista will let you use my sand ladders. I already sent her an e-mail. I hope you will not have to use them.

Have fun!

Jessica

P.S.: Next time you have spare permits to the Wave, let me know!!!! I will go anytime.

[jdgibney]

Yep, "the Wall" is on the northern rim of the Waterholes Slot Canyon, about 2/3 of a mile from the road. We got our permits at the Leche-e Chapter House (see http://www.americansouthwest.net/slo...es/canyon.html). They are, I think, $5 per person.

Your itinerary looks great. And Krista will let you use my sand ladders. I already sent her an e-mail. I hope you will not have to use them.

Have fun!

Jessica

P.S.: Next time you have spare permits to the Wave, let me know!!!! I will go anytime.

That 'wall' looks amazing, I will have to check that out at sunset the first night we're there...

[jdgibney]

Only 3 more days! I'm not even close to ready!
blog post:
Prologue: Gib and Winger's Southwest Adventure, Pt II