Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: Bear problem? Guns won't make you safer, study shows

  1. #1

    Bear problem? Guns won't make you safer, study shows


    PROVO
    I have decided to stick with love. Hate is too great a burden to bear. -Martin Luther King, Jr.





  2. Likes PineMartyn liked this post
  3. # ADS
    Circuit advertisement
    Join Date
    Always
    Location
    Advertising world
    Posts
    Many
     

  4. #2
    Reminds me of this classic.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  5. #3
    Outdoor Guru
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Craig, CO
    Posts
    4,841
    hike in groups
    That way you only have to outrun the slowest person.
    Utah is a very special and unique place. There is no where else like it on earth. Please take care of it and keep the remaining wild areas in pristine condition. The world will be a better place if you do.

  6. #4
    Two wheels from Hell live2ride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Northern Utard
    Posts
    2,167
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott P View Post


    That way you only have to outrun the slowest person.
    Just what I was thinking!



    Two wheels are better than four, keep the rubber side down.

  7. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott P View Post


    That way you only have to outrun the slowest person.
    Nuts. I gotta get different hiking partners...
    Life is Good

  8. #6
    In a life or death situation, it doesn't matter whether it's a bear, or a burglar, many victims will fire their weapon prematurely often fireing low and in front of the target. I'm betting one who researched attacks where a person tried to defend themselves with a weapon would find similarities concerning effectiveness in firearm defence.

    I'm a fan of guns that increase the odds in the shooters favor such as; shotguns, handguns that can fire shotgun rounds, and handguns with lazer targeting. A shotgun can increase a shooters accuracy as they shoot multiple projectiles at once covering a wider area, however is very large to carry as a defense weapon, a handgun that will shoot shotgun rounds (the Taurus Judge) is easy to carry, but has a limited range, however one who carries a Judge can has the option alternating shotgun rounds and pistol rounds which will give a shooter more range. And as far as lazer sites go; the Crimson Trace is very effective for all handguns.

    Sent from my T-Mobile myTouch 3G Slide using Tapatalk
    "You Sombitch's couldn't close an umbrella"
    Sheriff Beuford T Justice

  9. #7
    Outdoor Guru
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Craig, CO
    Posts
    4,841

    I'm betting one who researched attacks where a person tried to defend
    themselves with a weapon would find similarities concerning effectiveness in
    firearm defence.
    Before doing the Chilkoot Trail (Alaska to Canada) we had to listen to the bear talk. We also had some interesting conversations. They basically said the thing there as they said in the study. Same with the hiking Alaska book.

    A few points:

    1. The chances of getting attacked by a bear are extremely slim. If you see a bear, especially a brown bear, condider yourself to be very lucky. Bear attacks are very rare.

    If you are unlucky and an attack actually does happen:

    2. Pepper spray is much, much more effective than firearms to ward off a bear attack. Still, it isn't 100% effective and people have done things like spray upwind which incapacitates the user rather than the bear. Wait until a bear is at closer than 25 feet to spray.

    3. An injured bear is a dangerous bear. After shooting a bear that didn't die after the first shot, playing dead won't work. If you injur the bear it won't scare, nor will it lose interest if you play dead. If you didn't kill it with the first shot, chances are you're dead.

    3. If you do shoot a bear, you had better make sure that you have the right weapon. The only thing a handgun is good for is shooting yourself if you need to in the event of a bear attack. An appropriate weapon is a 0.300 or greater caliper rifle or a 12 gauge shotgun using rifled slugs.

    4. Bear bells, at least in SE Alaska are now considered to attract rather than deter bears. One of the bears' favorite snack is a juicy marmot. Apparently bells can be confused for marmot calls.
    Utah is a very special and unique place. There is no where else like it on earth. Please take care of it and keep the remaining wild areas in pristine condition. The world will be a better place if you do.

  10. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott P View Post
    4. Bear bells, at least in SE Alaska are now considered to attract rather than deter bears. One of the bears' favorite snack is a juicy marmot. Apparently bells can be confused for marmot calls.
    Yikes!

  11. Likes PineMartyn liked this post
  12. #9
    A good book on the subject - arguably the definitive book on the subject - is Stephen Herrero's Bear Attacks: Their causes and avoidance. The author is an expert on bear behavior and researched every reported bear attack going back for many years. His findings would seem to corroborate what the study above says, including what it says about the efficacy of bear sprays. If memory serves me here, the author also concluded that there were no reported unprovoked bear attacks upon groups of 4 or more adults, so even someone who is bearphobic (and I admit to suffering from that a bit myself) can feel very safe in bear country if he or she is with 3 or more people.

    Cheers,
    -Martin

  13. #10
    Carbon Footprint Donor JP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    In Nothing But Sunshine
    Posts
    8,858
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandstone Addiction View Post
    Reminds me of this classic.


    Quote Originally Posted by Scott P View Post


    That way you only have to outrun the slowest person.


    Quote Originally Posted by Scott P View Post
    Before doing the Chilkoot Trail (Alaska to Canada) we had to listen to the bear talk. We also had some interesting conversations. They basically said the thing there as they said in the study. Same with the hiking Alaska book.

    A few points:
    If you are unlucky and an attack actually does happen:

    2.....Still, it isn't 100% effective and people have done things like spray upwind which incapacitates the user rather than the bear. Wait until a bear is at closer than 25 feet to spray.

    3....After shooting a bear that didn't die after the first shot, playing dead won't work. If you injur the bear it won't scare, nor will it lose interest if you play dead. If you didn't kill it with the first shot, chances are you're dead.

    3. If you do shoot a bear, you had better make sure that you have the right weapon. The only thing a handgun is good for is shooting yourself...

    4. Bear bells, at least in SE Alaska are now considered to attract rather than deter bears. One of the bears' favorite snack is a juicy marmot. Apparently bells can be confused for marmot calls.
    I have a little knowledge when it comes to handguns and non-lethal defensive weapons. And the numbers game works in many situations, but like everything else, it's not fail safe. As been mentioned.

    2) I could assure you, during an "oh $hit" moment and someone who has no training in the chemical side of less than lethal usage, people are not going to "test the wind" just after they lost control of their bowels. Telling the average person to wait until the threat gets closer is not something the average person is going to do. Twenty-five feet seems like three when you're caught in that type of situation.

    3) Shooting and then playing dead? Who does such a thing? What moron is going to fire once and say, okay it's play dead time? It's dead time for the threat that you are facing. Who is carrying a weapon with just one round in it? Maybe if you had a RPG, you would only need one round, but seriously, who arms themselves with one round? Not the person who feels the need to pack heat anywhere they go. You continue shooting until the threat is neutralized. That goes as well when you have the right to use deadly physical force against a person. This is not the movies. People don't always die with a one shot stop, neither is a animal that outweighs you twofold. And in those "oh $hit" moments, it's not like you're shooting at a piece of paper at your leisure.

    3a) There are choices in handguns that will take down bear. The 500's, .444, .445 .454, .460, .480 by no means are these small framed guns...These are the big boys, big bore.

    4) Out of curiosity I listened to the little marmot, not one that I heard sounded like a bell. They chirp, more like a squirrel or birds. I wonder if some bears relate the bells to humans because the humans need to feed wild animals. I'm thinking that is more the likely correlation.

    And, I understand data and how it can be used. But, if we have a conservationist, the last thing they would want to see is an animal killed. If there are ways to keep the animal alive, they will push arguments in that direction. Sure pepper spray could work, it works by attacking and inflaming mucus membranes. Eyes, nose, throat are areas of effectiveness. But, it doesn't always work either and there is always a risk of cross contamination. So, now the bear has a seasoned dinner The more options you have at the ready, the better off you'll be if the threat ever shows it head.


Similar Threads

  1. Marijuana... Safer Than Peanuts
    By bbennett in forum The Political Arena
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 11-21-2011, 01:57 PM
  2. 5 Popular Safety Measures That Don't Make You Any Safer
    By accadacca in forum General Discussion
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 10-06-2010, 09:17 AM
  3. Scientists find safer way to make human stem cells
    By DiscGo in forum The Political Arena
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 03-27-2009, 07:17 PM
  4. Wireless router problem? Computer problem?
    By KAH in forum General Discussion
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 12-01-2008, 06:30 AM
  5. Study: iPods can make pacemakers malfunction
    By stefan in forum General Discussion
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 05-11-2007, 10:11 AM

Visitors found this page by searching for:

Outdoor Forum

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •