Figure 8 block with lower

[ocanler]

How many of you use a figure 8 for a block with the ability to lower a beginner if he/she get someting jammed in the rappel (hair, fingers, clothing caught in descendeur).
It allows the person at the top to lower a stuck rappeler when things go haywire.
It has the advantage to go on a single rope and yet offer the contingency of lowering the person in trouble. Works for me!

[Canyonbug]

95% of the time! I love the Figure 8 Contingency Block.

[oldno7]

95% of the time! I love the Figure 8 Contingency Block.

X2

Just as easy to rig as a biner block.

[rcwild]

Please note that a releasable figure eight block is still a BLOCK. Take the same precautions you would with a static block to prevent people from rapping on the wrong side of the rope.

[Deathcricket]

No, never even heard of it. But that is an awesome setup and I can see it's usefulness. So it looks like super high friction, if you need to lower someone, do you modify it in some way to make it move or just hold on to it the whole time to keep it from moving? Then the last guy raps double strand or does it lock out??? Sounds like it's actually a block, but I don't get how you then lower someone down if you need to.

[oldno7]

Let me know when you have time and we'll get together and demonstrate.

[ratagonia]

Let me know when you have time and we'll get together and demonstrate.

Thanks Kurty. YES, I think the Cricket of Death is ready to accept some training. A delicate point in a canyoneer's evolution. Shhhhhhhhhhhhhh. (don't let him know we know)

[ratagonia]

X2

Just as easy to rig as a biner block.

A Munter-Mule - just as easy to rig.

Almost any method is easy to rig, once you have it dialed.

Tom

[canyoncaver]

A Munter-Mule - just as easy to rig.

Almost any method is easy to rig, once you have it dialed.

Tom

Too true, but the releasable 8 can be pulled down as-is, with no re-rig required.

[oldno7]

Thanks Kurty. YES, I think the Cricket of Death is ready to accept some training. A delicate point in a canyoneer's evolution. Shhhhhhhhhhhhhh. (don't let him know we know)

I guess I mentioned the price was steep...............FREE

[ratagonia]

Too true, but the releasable 8 can be pulled down as-is, with no re-rig required.

Oh yeah, Re-rig... not very difficult.

T

[optikal]

I've never seen this either and am interested in learning the proper technique. I found this link online, can someone verify if this is the appropriate method? http://canyonquest.com/~steve/cerber..._release8.html

This obviously shows how to use it as a block but seems like it needs a slight modification for belaying. From the way the OP described it they can rap down blocked, but if something happens, you can then rerig it for lowering?

[ocanler]

Deathcrickett,

Yes, it's a block just like you would have a biner block. Picking up the correct side is not really an issue as the pull side stays at the top in a rope bag to go down with last person. You need this side of the rope at the top if you need to lower somebody.

If you need to lower somebody, just undo the rope from the biner, undo the lower loop on the figure 8, and voila: You have a standard figure 8 set up as a belay to lower the freaked-out person.

Good set up when you have the set-up dialed in, and you are taking beginners. The first one to go down would be more experienced with friction setting and does a fireman belay for the beginners.

The only inconvenience I can see is that it's a bit more bulky that a biner block and maybe more proned to get caught on the pull.

[optikal]

If you need to lower somebody, just undo the rope from the biner, undo the lower loop on the figure 8, and voila: You have a standard figure 8 set up as a belay to lower the freaked-out person.

Good set up when you have the set-up dialed in, and you are taking beginners. The first one to go down would be more experienced with friction setting and does a fireman belay for the beginners.

The only inconvenience I can see is that it's a bit more bulky that a biner block and maybe more proned to get caught on the pull.

Great explanation, thanks. I believe I understand this, quite similar to the munter-mule. Time to go practice in the garage. :)

[UtahAdventureGuide]

I've never used a figure 8 block so I started playing with it tonight and couldn't get it to lock up with the 5mm accessory cord I was using. Is there a minimum diameter rope that should be used. I've never had a problem with a standard biner block slipping.

[ratagonia]

I've never used a figure 8 block so I started playing with it tonight and couldn't get it to lock up with the 5mm accessory cord I was using. Is there a minimum diameter rope that should be used. I've never had a problem with a standard biner block slipping.

Could be. Seems odd though, with all those over and unders, that it would still slip. Might be something to keep an eye out on skinny ropes.

Perhaps. Have we established the minimimum diameter might be 5.0001 mm?

T

[oldno7]

Get some real rope that you would use in a canyon. I would hope you would opt for 8-10mmish, ya ain't lowering me on 5mm acc. cord.
Works very well with 8-9mm rope...
So while you might have been only experimenting with skinny cord, try it again with the above criteria. If you can't get it to work, I guess you can join DC for a free instruction.

[oldno7]

A Munter-Mule - just as easy to rig.

Almost any method is easy to rig, once you have it dialed.

Tom

hard to argue with logic, when did you start down this path(just kidding of course)

[spinesnaper]

I've never seen this either and am interested in learning the proper technique. I found this link online, can someone verify if this is the appropriate method? http://canyonquest.com/~steve/cerber..._release8.html

This obviously shows how to use it as a block but seems like it needs a slight modification for belaying. From the way the OP described it they can rap down blocked, but if something happens, you can then rerig it for lowering?

Wow, those figures makes it look so complicated. I would use this method but then I would have to carry a figure of 8 for this purpose. Munter-Mule does the same thing with one less piece of gear to end up at the bottom of some muddy pool of water.

Ken

[ocanler]

Ken

With 8 or 9mm and your Figure 8, will lock like a charm. It's true: You'll need an extra figure 8.
I have not used a Munter-Mule for lower, so I can't really compare.