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Thread: Zion - Mystery Canyon
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07-28-2011, 07:47 PM #41
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07-28-2011 07:47 PM # ADS
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08-01-2011, 09:44 AM #42
I'm sure it all comes from each persons experience. I wouldn't doubt coming from the caving world you would wear a helmet. Rock climbing.. I should. In canyoneering my person experience is that I would talk someone into wearing an ankle brace before a helmet. In zion's with all the river sections I've had to carry a few people out but never because of loose rocks.
But for sure the next pictures I post I'll be looking like the Michelin Man.. Head to toe padding... But then you'll probably read about me dying from heat stroke ;)
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08-01-2011, 11:08 AM #43
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08-03-2011, 05:05 PM #44
I do canyons without a helmet and will continue to. Tom whats up with the criticism? It is like when the missionaries show up and tell me there is a church in town. I say I know I make the decision not to go. Free country I think.
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08-03-2011, 05:24 PM #45
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08-03-2011, 07:15 PM #46
I wouldn't go biking or on a motorcycle without a helmet. I wouldn't go kayaking without a helmet. I never went caving without a helmet, and I would not go in a canyon without a helmet. I might recover from a broken arm, twisted ankle, broken wrist, but I sure want to keep the risk of head trauma to a minimum. I'd rather die than end up being a vegetable.
My 2 cents: Wear a helmet, a small inconvenience and a great insurance.
That being said: Nice pics about Mistery once I got over the skull shots!
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08-04-2011, 06:31 AM #47
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08-04-2011, 08:21 AM #48
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08-04-2011, 03:35 PM #49
Might as well say I do canyons on garden hoses using your belt loop on harnesses. The flagarant disregard for yourself, and havoc you could cause on others(in canyon, rescuers, etc) is absolutely hiliarious here.
It's like the article on Reuters a few weeks back, where one state was getting ready to repeal their "helmets not required on motorcycles law", so a bunch of bikers held a protest rally, not wearing helmets, and one subsequently crashed and died, because well he wasnt wearing a helmet.
It's even funnier that you are attacking Tom for giving you crap about this that just further proves your absurdity.
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08-05-2011, 07:46 AM #50
Reminds me of the folks that protested the ban on base jumping in Yosemite where the person died base jumping El Cap. Kinda puts a damper on the protest.
I've done canyons sans helmet. And, I still occasionally climb without one. But, more and more, I wear one 'cause it makes sense and its easy to do so.
Still, if I forgot my helmet and showed up at a canyon, I'd probably still do it.
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08-05-2011, 09:01 AM #51
Nice report. Mystery is a good canyon. I love the second to last rap. I don't know why exactly. Mystery was my second canyon and it really got me hooked on canyoneering. I don't know why there is all the hate on Mystery. Is it the best. Certainly not IMO. But a fun canyon.
Thanks for posting the pics!The man thong is wrong.
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08-05-2011, 09:20 AM #52
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08-16-2011, 08:12 AM #53
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08-16-2011, 09:09 AM #54
I volunteer once a month at a County Hospital in Los Angeles. I see an extremely large number of individuals after head trauma. They can't hold jobs, they can barely remember what bus brought them to the hospital. Until you have seen the permanent effects of these injuries, it can be difficult to understand how devastating these injuries are. The brain does not take a joke. So free choice? Not on a motorcycle. It is important to understand how one fits into a community and the impact of these preventable disabilities on the credibility of that community. Not that we are going to settle this here. There will be those who wear a helmet and those who don't. We call that natural selection.
Ken
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08-16-2011, 09:58 AM #55
I think, based on this discussion, I will start to ask the many boys who date my daughters, "do you wear a helmet while canyoneering?" The answer will tell me a lot about how they will regard others including my daughter(s). The same could be said of motorcycles, climbing...etc.
Yep, free country with the exception of those dang consequences of violating the law, natural laws included.Life is Good
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08-16-2011, 10:44 AM #56
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08-16-2011, 12:07 PM #57
helmet discussions...
safety people frame it as a safety issue (personal and public)
freedom people frame it as a freedom issue (idealism)
It's hard to argue with the freedom-biased points, but I have yet to hear a good safety argument for not wearing a helmet while canyoneering. Anyone?Last edited by hank moon; 08-16-2011 at 01:32 PM. Reason: clarification
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08-16-2011, 12:52 PM #58
I have not great arguments.
When its really hot out, I don't want a helmet (or anything) on my head to overheat me.
If I'm in a super narrow confined space, a helmet sometimes takes up too much room. Of course, that's a pretty unlikely situation as I avoid those spaces like the plague.
I do seem to hit my head more on rock when I'm wearing a helmet. Just not used to the space it takes, I suppose.
I wear mine more and more often. But, I still rock climb without it from time to time. Especially on a top rope.
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08-16-2011, 01:32 PM #59
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08-16-2011, 01:58 PM #60
I can argue with the freedom-based point... (it's a talent, I know)...
The Freedom-based argument only works with a willing suspension of the knowledge that we are all connected together, in some way. So, yes, your actions effect me; but mostly, they effect people closely related to you. That you might want to express your appreciation for by wearing a helmet.
But, yes, it is your choice. I fully support your right to make your decision about what you wear. Even when you make the "wrong" decision.
Tom
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