Wayne County Rescue Fees

[Davewyo]

The Wayne County Sheriff asked Penny and I to spread the word that fees for rescues have been instituted in Wayne County, Utah.

The base fee for a "call out" has been established at $500, with extras added according to the resources needed (ie. helicopters, etc.).

He explained that Wayne County's tax base does not provide for the increase in Search and Rescue costs which are being experienced lately(since 127 Hrs.), and that individual SAR volunteers have expended all the personal funds they can.

In previous conversations with SAR volunteers, Penny and I are under the impression that three rescue/search incidents were carried out earlier this year, and that those efforts consumed the budget which had been put aside for such operations.

Dave

[oldno7]

Sounds to me like they should bill Aron Ralston

[stefan]

Sounds to me like they should bill Aron Ralston

you're not into the personal responsibility thing?

[mdd]

The general consensus in SAR circles is that charging is a bad idea because it can complicate rescues, which then costs SAR even more, and potentially makes the situation more dangerous. They started charging in Clear Creek Canyon near Golden, CO a while back, someone was charged who then went to the press, and the sh!tstorm was so bad Golden relented. The National Assoc for SAR, Mountain Rescue Assoc, and many local and state SAR groups are opposed to charging, and for good reason. Here are some examples why (pdf file):

http://www.coloradosarboard.org/csrb...SAR%20Help.pdf

I hope Wayne County reconsiders. Or I hope they are at least braced for the bad publicity that will come the first time they charge someone and the media catches wind, as happened in Clear Creek.

M

[qedcook]

I think it's a great idea. $500 is a small price to pay for such quality SAR. Tickets in Zion are worse than that! Why should the Wayne County citizens have to pay all the expenses for a costly rescue? It's not like SAR is something hikers should be entitled to when they're hiking on farmland. It's a service, not a right.

[stefan]

The general consensus in SAR circles is that charging is a bad idea because it can complicate rescues, which then costs SAR even more, and potentially makes the situation more dangerous. They started charging in Clear Creek Canyon near Golden, CO a while back, someone was charged who then went to the press, and the sh!tstorm was so bad Golden relented. The National Assoc for SAR, Mountain Rescue Assoc, and many local and state SAR groups are opposed to charging, and for good reason. Here are some examples why (pdf file):

http://www.coloradosarboard.org/csrb...SAR%20Help.pdf

I hope Wayne County reconsiders. Or I hope they are at least braced for the bad publicity that will come the first time they charge someone and the media catches wind, as happened in Clear Creek.

M

thanks for posting this, mike. something to think about to be sure

[stefan]

Why should the Wayne County citizens have to pay all the expenses for a costly rescue?

i can't say i know how SAR (wanye county or elsewhere) is specifically funded, but how do you know it doesn't include funding from the state of utah? or whether any of it comes from federal dollars?

anyone know where the money comes from? and did they cut back this year?

i always liked the idea of donations to SAR

[JP]

It seems to be the trend, the cost of doing business is getting higher. Obviously when they came out with their budget for the year, it was sold short. In all budgets, some areas get very little attention and receive very little within a county. They're deemed not as important, as say education. The only way to get more, is to have well, more rescues. This way when they hit the negotiating table for the next budget year, they can say we had an increase in rescues that drained the previous years budget by, whatever percent. There are still funds they can pull from, like the general fund, administers don't seem to like that much. So, they're kind of forced to start charging for service. Sort of like a volunteer ambulance service. Nowadays, if you need more than basic care on the way to the hospital and they call in paramedics, well, it's going to cost you. When in years past, volunteer services were free. Now, the patient can decline that extra care. Sometimes it works, sometimes it leads to death. Who knows, the family that has a person needing rescue may decline the part of the help that will cost money and the outcomes maybe very different.

[Iceaxe]

Here are some examples why (pdf file):

http://www.coloradosarboard.org/csrb...SAR%20Help.pdf

Interesting read. Thanks for posting that.

[UtahAdventureGuide]

They should institute this policy state wide. I'm sure the cost of the resent rescue in The Subway was in the range of $250,000.00 (Every time I take my black hawk helicopter for a spin it costs a fortune). If those involved would fork over about $50k a piece we could probably get The Subway reopened.

[mdd]

Colorado has a program called CORSAR. It is a SAR fund that counties and SAR groups can use to get reimbursement for SAR operations. It is funded by recreationalists buying CORSAR cards, and also from hunting, fishing, boating licenses, etc.

Details are at (pdf):

http://coloradosarboard.org/csrb-doc...ct%20Sheet.pdf

Does Utah have something similar?

M

PS, if you explore canyons or hike or whatever in Colorado, please purchase a CORSAR card, you get them at just about any outdoor and sporting store.

[ilipichicuma]

They should institute this policy state wide. I'm sure the cost of the resent rescue in The Subway was in the range of $250,000.00 (Every time I take my black hawk helicopter for a spin it costs a fortune). If those involved would fork over about $50k a piece we could probably get The Subway reopened.

Yeah, I'm not a fan of that idea. Those helicopters were partially looking for me and my group, and we weren't lost, we were helping the other people get out!

[darkmatter]

Seems a reasonable policy, to me.

Does anyone know how the Colorado system is working out? A portion of fishing and hunting license fees goes to a SAR cost reimbursement fund. There is also a voluntary CORSAR card one can purchase to contribute to the fund.

[Spidey]

Yeah, I'm not a fan of that idea. Those helicopters were partially looking for me and my group, and we weren't lost, we were helping the other people get out!

In the report it didn't sound like anyone was lost, just stuck. Without the Fabled Canyon man who's to say they wouldn't have been looking for you guys as well.

I have absolutely no problem with Wayne county charging for rescues, or anywhere else for that matter. Might and I emphasize might get people to think a little harder about whether or not they are qualified or capable of doing what they are about to jump into.

[Deathcricket]

Pay $500 or wait for canyonman to show up? Tough choice!

[accadacca]

Pay $500 or wait for canyonman to show up? Tough choice!

[UtahAdventureGuide]

Colorado has a program called CORSAR. It is a SAR fund that counties and SAR groups can use to get reimbursement for SAR operations. It is funded by recreationalists buying CORSAR cards, and also from hunting, fishing, boating licenses, etc.

I purchased rescue insurance with my SPOT. I think it was about $10.00 for an entire year.

[Brian in SLC]

Sillyness.

I don't think most folks will even know there's a fee for SAR services. Or care. Its no deterrent.

If they're going to charge, how much say will the public have in the services provided? Say, I don't want to pony up for a helicopter when the back of my friend's truck will do fine for transport to the hospital. Problem seems to be, once they take over a situation, then, you get no say. And, you can't have friends come help, either.

Sticky situation at best.

Thought there was a federal pool of money these folks tap into? Maybe the volunteer folks have been stretched to the limit? Got to be a local burden.

A situation best viewed from afar, methinks...

[ratagonia]

Sillyness.

I don't think most folks will even know there's a fee for SAR services. Or care. Its no deterrent.

If they're going to charge, how much say will the public have in the services provided? Say, I don't want to pony up for a helicopter when the back of my friend's truck will do fine for transport to the hospital. Problem seems to be, once they take over a situation, then, you get no say. And, you can't have friends come help, either.

Sticky situation at best.

Thought there was a federal pool of money these folks tap into? Maybe the volunteer folks have been stretched to the limit? Got to be a local burden.

A situation best viewed from afar, methinks...

Seems like there was a STATE of UTAH fund, but it probably was defunded.

Tom

[restrac2000]

We can't blame Wayne County. They have a small tax base and historically received a small portion of the state monies for this issue. The State does have a fund but its allocated to higher populated regions or those with more rescues. Its not like the money allocated is large or in proportion to costs. As canyoneers we don't pay into the fund anways. Most of it comes from motorized equipment sales.

Seems we need to come up with a way of funding these programs that is better. They need money to operate (beyond helicopters). Gas cost alone for driving out to a rescue for 4-6 cars roundtrip alone must cost in the hundreds. That can often be out of pocket.

Historically the solution is taxing the gear used for the sport. Its a tradition that goes back to fishing and conservation (Pittman-Robertson Act). Might be time to institute something similar on technical equipment.

Phillip