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Thread: SUGGESTIONS! For Coyote Buttes area

  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by peakbaggers View Post
    Now, would anyone care to reveal where Sidestep Canyon, Rainbow Valley and White Valley are? Was once told by a local tour operator of more hoodoo formations and fantastic colors in another location near & east of the Wahweap hoodoos. About two miles or so before the end of 431, there's a road that heads off SE. It takes you to the top of and beyond some other canyons directly east of the Wahweap formations. Haven't been on that road yet but I think that what the tour operator described fits this road & area. On satelite images, it's hard to tell if there's anything really interesting in there or not. From maps, it's clear you could enter this area from a walk up Wahweap from Bigwater - but would be a significant haul. If anyone has some beta on these others but don't want to post here, please contact us directly.
    The access to these sites is by White Sands Jeep Road that branches BLM 431 at 37

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  3. #82
    Little conclusion,
    it is forbidden, to drive on BLM 431 - hmm.

    So is the loop BLM 400 (Cottonwood Rd.), BLM 430 and BLM 431 death now?

    Little bit OT...need a litttle help...plz, maybe from the folks west of Zion.

    Has anybody experiences about BLM 586, BLM 584, BLM 580 and BLM 587 - connects from US 89 to Nipple Lake?
    It is possible to drive directly from BLM 587 to Mollies Nipple?
    Thank you.

  4. #83
    Bogley BigShot
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    I don't seem to have the ability to split this thread, but if we could make one for general questions on the subject separate from Allison and Chere's trip it would be nice.

  5. #84
    You're right - sorry.

  6. #85
    Bogley BigShot
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    No sorry necessary. I do it all the time. We just need to split the thread is all. :)

  7. #86
    Sorry to hear your trip didn't go as planned. Spring travel in the desert can be kind of a crap shoot. Slot canyons this time of year can be fluid due to precipitation. Fall travel is much easier and more reliable due to the stable weather. Those of us that live here are quite lucky to be able to plan our trips on a whim depending on the weather forecast. As far as the Coyote Buttes permit system though, I do not share your sentiment. That area is extremely fragile. I've been hiking out there for 6 years now, and every time I go, I see more and more damage. Fins busted off, shoe marks on the rocks, garbage left behind....and that is with a maximum of 20 hikers a day, many days not even that many make it out there. Lets say when you finally do get a permit (and you will if you keep trying), would you want 50 other people standing in the Wave when you are trying to get a picture? Do you want to see picnic tables and bathrooms around every corner? Or how about a paved trail for the first mile and a half? Basically increased visitation will simply ruin the experience. There aren't very many places left that can be considered pristine, and unfortunately, Coyote Buttes can hardly even fit the description anymore.....

  8. #87
    Content Provider Emeritus ratagonia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akavalun View Post
    There aren't very many places left that can be considered pristine, and unfortunately, Coyote Buttes can hardly even fit the description anymore.....
    I disagree (and agree). There are plenty of pristine places left, I visit them all the time. Coyote Buttes has been a "hot" destination for at least 10 years, and is visited almost every day. It is a great place, and has been highlighted as such for quite some time. It is true there are very few to none pristine, highly-hyped locations left...

    Tom

  9. #88
    Ok, pristine yes...but attractive to 99% of the population, probably not. My point was that Coyote Buttes is one of the most amazing places on this earth, for hiking, geology, photography, natural history etc...and the permit system helps to maintain that.

  10. #89
    Coyote Buttes has been a "hot" destination for at least 10 years, and is visited almost every day.
    ...and since this article, the run on the Coyote Buttes becomes an hype

  11. #90
    ephemeral excursionist blueeyes's Avatar
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    I don't mind the limit on the number of people they let hike a pristine place like Coyote Buttes. I am in total agreement with that. What I thought was a joke was the way they choose walk ins for the hike. For me as a single mom and for Alison traveling with her kids, there is no way you can go as a group unless you win a online permit. Alison and I had misunderstandings about how the walk in permit system worked down there. Now we know.
    Chere'




  12. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by akavalun View Post
    Ok, pristine yes...but attractive to 99% of the population, probably not. My point was that Coyote Buttes is one of the most amazing places on this earth, for hiking, geology, photography, natural history etc...and the permit system helps to maintain that.

    That's true and absolutely ok.

    But...
    Most of the visitor of the wave, take a look and went back.
    That's all.
    Some visitors don't know about - Leave no Trace.

    So it's very hard to obtain a permit for the CBN, for visiting the beautiful surroundings like Top Rock, Sand Cove, etc, etc.

  13. #92
    What is wrong with the way they do the walk in permits? What part of it is a joke?

  14. #93
    ephemeral excursionist blueeyes's Avatar
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    The amount of people that want to hike it compared to the availability of spots... on the day Alison went 45 people were there and that is unusually low....I personally find that comical.
    Chere'




  15. #94
    Yeah, but thats not a problem with the permit system. It just happens that a lot of people want to visit the area, and it has to be limited, other wise it will just turn into a zoo out there. Certain areas are more vulnerable to traffic, and Coyote Buttes is one of them. You have a way better chance of getting a permit in person than you do online, so if anything, you should be upset with the online drawing, not the in-person lottery. Were you expecting that they give away as many permits as needed in person? Its pretty well stated that 10 are available online, and 10 are given out each day in a lottery. They even give you hypothetical situations on the website so you know exactly how the system works. And they don't "chose" the walk-ins. Its a random drawing....how could that be any more fair???? Honestly I just think that you are upset because its a difficult draw. Its no different that hunting mule deer on the Arizona strip. The area can only sustain so much hunting pressure, so tags are limited. It takes 13 years to draw a strip tag, but thats just how it is......

  16. #95
    ephemeral excursionist blueeyes's Avatar
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    ya read too much into what i said don't stress it i am not..... like to add maybe it was more i thought it was a joke that WE thought we would get a permit. There does that make you happy. I find the whole experience comical. One I am sure I will laugh at again and again when I look back.
    Chere'




  17. #96
    An old thread, perhaps, but thought that I'd give an update.

    As mentioned, the BLM has closed 431 at at 37

  18. #97
    Just picked up a buckskin permit on-line today..... the BLM computer permit system sucks. It kept kicking me out... I called the BLM to complain and was told they are aware of the problem and working on it. I wish they would hurry up as that system has sucked for the past ten years and I'm always told they are working on it. It would let me make reservations right up to "Click to Pay" button, which would not show up.

    The sad part is every time I went back in I noticed the permits I had tried for were now blocked out. The system was counting every time I tried as if someone had obtained a permit, but it would let me finish paying for them Eventually the Click to Pay button showed up and I was able to obtain permits, to bad about the other 20 permits I blocked out that will probably go unused.


  19. #98
    Just picked up a buckskin permit on-line today..... the BLM computer permit
    system sucks. It kept kicking me
    Welcome into the club. Every year the same procedure w/ online permits.
    I've tried it out to catch a permit for buckskin at work on my netbook, later from the office PC. My wife tried it at home. What a nightmare.

    I wish they would hurry up as that system has sucked for the past ten years
    and I'm always told they are working on it.
    Me too.
    1.5 hours later the spook were over and I've caught my permits. Many, first shown as blocked, were free.

    Aha axe, you were the blocker.

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