Trapping

[chunick]

Hey just wondering what's everyones thoughts about trapping coyotes, coons, etc.?

[denaliguide]

get after it.

[ilanimaka]

I give it . It's a necessary means of controlling the population of many animals. One of these days, I'd LOVE to get into it myself, just not quite yet.

[asdf]

It's a necessary means of controlling the population of many animals.

oh please explain

Do trappers pay vet bills for domestic dogs caught in traps?

[chunick]

It plays a vital role in controling animals that are causing issues. Non native type animals that people release. You gotta learn how to control your dog, then they would not need the vet.

[asdf]

You gotta learn how to control your dog, then they would not need the vet.

This has been discussed before... http://www.bogley.com/forum/showthre...ighlight=traps

[Udink]

Hey just wondering what's everyones thoughts about trapping coyotes, coons, etc.?

Only if they really deserve it.

[Sombeech]

Where's @Rev. Coyote at?

[ilanimaka]

oh please explain

Do trappers pay vet bills for domestic dogs caught in traps?

There are 2 points here.

1) If a dog is in a location where it can get caught in a foothold trap, then it stands to reason that either the dog has a problem with running off, and therefore the owners have a problem controlling their dog, or that the dog is feral and needs to be destroyed anyways. Yes, I believe that all feral dogs & cats should be shot on sight. If the dog has an issue with running off, then being trapped may well cure its wanderlust & if the dog was lost then as an owner, I would prefer to get my dog back with a broken leg than not at all.

2) Of the trappers that I DO know, if any of them were to put their traps near an area where somebody's pets frequent, then they would pay for at least PART of the vet bill, depending on the circumstances. If I were the trapper (though I know better than to put the traps in such area), I know that I would as recompense for my carelessness.

[Udink]

If a dog is in a location where it can get caught in a foothold trap, then it stands to reason that either the dog has a problem with running off, and therefore the owners have a problem controlling their dog, or that the dog is feral and needs to be destroyed anyways. Yes, I believe that all feral dogs & cats should be shot on sight. If the dog has an issue with running off, then being trapped may well cure its wanderlust & if the dog was lost then as an owner, I would prefer to get my dog back with a broken leg than not at all.

The truth is, some people are f*cking idiots. There are some irresponsible dog owners, and some irresponsible coyote trappers. If a trap is less than six feet from a dirt road, and only a few hundred feet from a paved road, in an area where people (and their dogs) recreate, would you still unreservedly defend the trapper? I'm not against trapping, but I would be in favor of some regulations that place some areas off-limits to trapping (similar to existing laws regulating discharge of a firearm within a certain distance of a road, building, etc.).

[ilanimaka]

The truth is, some people are f*cking idiots. There are some irresponsible dog owners, and some irresponsible coyote trappers. If a trap is less than six feet from a dirt road, and only a few hundred feet from a paved road, in an area where people (and their dogs) recreate, would you still unreservedly defend the trapper? I'm not against trapping, but I would be in favor of some regulations that place some areas off-limits to trapping (similar to existing laws regulating discharge of a firearm within a certain distance of a road, building, etc.).

Udink, you & I would be in complete agreeance over the fact that stupid peple can be found everywhere. If a trapper is irresponsible with his traps, even if it's "technically" legal, then he/she needs to be tased. I also agree that the regs should be adjusted to minimize the possibility of overlapping trapping areas with stompin ground.

[Brian in SLC]

Hey just wondering what's everyones thoughts about trapping coyotes, coons, etc.?

I think its barbaric.

Grew up in Montana, owned traps I got from a relative. One day, I couldn't find them. Years (many many years) later I found out mom tossed 'em out. Kinda funny in hindsite. I was pretty bummed at the time. As a younger feller, I'll admit some detached and morbid facination with watching a wild animal suffer. Then I grew up I suppose.

Pretty darn cruel to leg trap an animal. I kinda get the method of trapping beaver or muskrat where they are drowned and die fairly quickly. Or, a Havahart type trap that live traps a critter. But, not checking a trap for days and days...that's some serious suffering.

The domestic dog issue is tough, too. Who doesn't let a dog run off leash when they can? How would you even train a dog not to step in a trap designed to fool a wild animal? I'm not sure how you blame the dog or dog owner.

Kind of an issue here in the Wasatch foothills. Folks find dogs stuck in traps, along with critters that have long sufferred and died. Has made the news here a number of times. Some graphic stuff. Some very pissed off people.

I've seen and talked to folks setting traps (west desert out by Little Sahara). I respect what they're doing, even if I don't agree with it.

Saw a coyote last weekend, down south, east of Mesquite. Watched him for a few minutes. Really neat to see. The thought of that wild critter, stuck in a trap, for days, suffering. Just sounds so cruel and unnecessary to me.

This is in the news because they're thinking of extending the time required to check a trap from two to seven days? Yikes. I think two days is too long. Bullet is quicker if you need to dispatch a critter.

Geez, maybe I oughta go and hug a tree now...ha ha.

Cheers,

-Brian in SLC

[Deathcricket]

Not for them. Seems to me like a lazy way to hunt, causes needless injuries to non designated targets, and is just all around bad. Heck, I almost stepped on one, half buried in leaves. Be a man and hunt with a gun.

[trackrunner]

Be a man and hunt with a bow. Or better yet a knife and your bare hands.

fixed

[asdf]

how about...

climb a tree
wait
jump on the back of your prey
ride it back to camp
then slit is throat

now thats much more awesome then laying traps.

[ilanimaka]

how about...

climb a tree
wait
jump on the back of your prey
ride it back to camp
then slit is throat

now thats much more awesome then laying traps.

Ya know, I tried that once. But in the end, it just called its lawyer & the whole thing got ugly from there. If I was allowed, I'd use land mines. Oh yeah... Just sit back & watch Wille E. come on by and BOOM!

Sorry... Feelin a little bit childish tonight.

[StudChild]

Ya know, I tried that once. But in the end, it just called its lawyer & the whole thing got ugly from there. If I was allowed, I'd use land mines. Oh yeah... Just sit back & watch Wille E. come on by and BOOM!

Sorry... Feelin a little bit childish tonight.

I like it.

Trapping animals has been done, try trapping people, with men all it takes is something cold to drink, for women credit card works every time.

[MY T PIMP]

I don't know how many are following the mule deer situation in Utah. But, after a decade of extensive research the DWR is finally answering the question where have all the deer gone? For years it was assumed no water, winter kill, and depleting winter habitat has been the main reasoning behind dwindling deer herds in Utah. But apparently according to the extensive research conducted by wildlife biologists it has been concluded that massive predation is responsible and ( I'm not talking about the 10,000 or so deer taken by hunters every year). Due to the falling price of pelts and virtually no factor of natural selection Coyotes and Mountain Lions are populating out of control in Utah. It is estimated there are for more of these animals now in Utah then there were before the pioneers homesteaded the area. In 2012 Deer hunting will be conducted in a 29 unit draw system in Utah on top of that the DWR is going to dramatically increase the number of predator tags and construct additional programs to get predators under control. In doing this it is the DWR's goal to achieve growing deer populations.

Coyote trapping is one of these programs. The new proposed program will allow a trapper to check traps lines up to seven days instead of the current 48 hour law. I believe Mule Deer to be one of Utah's greatest biological and natural treasures. Unlike Mountain Lions and Coyotes who can virtually live in any wild eco-system, Mule deer have specific needs and requirements which can only be met in a handful of states. I can't imagine Africa with out the Zebra because people wanted to see the Lion more.

[mattandersao]

I decided to look up the alleged decade long extensive research blaming predators for dwindling deer herds in Utah. Here is what I found

"Mule deer were common in Utah at the time of settlement, although not as abundant as today."

"Mule deer are adaptable to a wide variety of habitats throughout their range (Wallmo, 1981). In North America, they live from the northern boreal forests to the hot deserts of the southwest and from the coastal rain forests to the Great Plains. In Utah, mule deer are found in nearly all of the state although they are less abundant in the desert areas."

"Loss and degradation of habitat are thought to be the main reasons for mule deer populationdeclines over the last few decades...The quality of mule deer habitat is the major factor in determining herd size. Habitat quality for mule deer has declined in Utah over the past 40 years"

Predators are apparently the scapegoat rather than the cause

" Predators are often identified as one of the main causes for mule deer herd declines in Utah. However, predator-prey relationships are complex and not always easily understood. There are
often many factors which can negatively affect mule deer populations including predation. The
complex relationship between predators and habitat is described by Geist (1999). “Inevitably
predators are blamed for declining mule deer populations, in particular when the survival of
fawns is low. There is no doubt that today’s predators are effective in killing deer. However,
predation is not independent of poor habitat quality. Such translates itself less as a reduced birth rate, but as fawns born too small, too poorly developed and too weak to be viable. Here
predators take fawns that have a low chance of survival anyway. Improved habitat quality,
which leads to better growth and larger body size in deer, is also expected to lead to large,
vigorous fawns that are more difficult for predators to catch.”

UTAH DIVISION OF WILDLIFE RESOURCES STATEWIDE MANAGEMENT PLAN FOR MULE DEER. http://wildlife.utah.gov/hunting/big..._deer_plan.pdf

[ilanimaka]

So what you're saying is that this text that you've copied from the Mule Deer Management plan (which by the way has no material dated sooner than 2008) IS the "alleged decade long extensive research." Sorry but you're gonna have to do better than that...