The Needles - Virginia Park

[asdf]

Who's been?
Whats the scoop?

We attempted to access the area this weekend with little to no beta and after 2+ hours of scrambling, climbing, and route finding gave up. Here it is Monday and I am going over maps and pretty sure I found where we messed up, I just wanted to see what info you guys have....

I would love to get some cords for both Chesler Park and Elephant canyon routes.

[Jammer]

I haven't done it, so take this with a MAJOR grain of salt, but... I sized it up when I did Elephant Canyon several years ago. I had some beta at the time (maybe from Kelsey). It looked pretty steep, but doable (but I couldn't see the other side.) While going UP Elephant there is a distinct spot where streambed turns left to head SSE. At about 38.100436

[Brian in SLC]

We attempted to access the area this weekend with little to no beta and after 2+ hours of scrambling, climbing, and route finding gave up. Here it is Monday and I am going over maps and pretty sure I found where we messed up, I just wanted to see what info you guys have....

Isn't it still closed?

I believe you need a permit to go there. Do you have one?

If you are going to illegally enter Virginia Park, please at least stop prior to gaining access, and completey inspect your footwear, socks, and pants for any seed pods you might have picked up enroute and remove them. There used to be a sign explaining all this at the entrance, but, someone burned it down. Tread lightly. Try hard to avoid leaving any tracks.

You know the park monitors this, right?

[Udink]

Have you noticed via Google Earth in Virginia Park that are several square outlines on the ground? At first they look like corrals-- but that can't be. Maybe dirt sample areas?

Yeah, probably: http://esp.cr.usgs.gov/info/sw/clim-met/virginia.html

[asdf]

BTW -- how much snow and/or water was in Elephant Canyon?

Good luck.

Skiff of snow here and there near druid and a bit of ice in the potholes.
Ice and snow was pretty avoidable and made only one or two scrambles a bit sketchy.

You know the park monitors this, right?

wait.. the park is watching me know? I under your concern and did not inquire about a permit (or know one was required).
I have heard that the area can be viewed without setting foot on any soil.
Do all entrances to the park have a sign? Have you been out there?




anyways... interesting read and a few photos
http://windsourceii.blogspot.com/200...s-np-utah.html

[Brian in SLC]

I under your concern, I have heard of at least three entrances.. what one had the sign?

In the link you posted, the photo with the cave like crack entrance had a white sign with red lettering, I seem to recall. Was right at the entrance. I've not been since the 80's and haven't seen the newer sign since they designated the area an RNA.

We exited out the back door. Made a nice loop.

Its "ok", in terms of seeing it, but, I dunno. Not worth the hassle and risk of getting caught in there. So many places to see without punchin' that ticket, methinks.

Have talked to folks that ran into the monitering crew out there, so, the area is being watched.

I used to spent a gob of time in the Needles. Fun stuff.

[asdf]

I used to spent a gob of time in the Needles. Fun stuff.

Very cool indeed.

[stefan]

I have heard that the area can be viewed without setting foot on any soil.

i am not sure if there are any recent changes, but the management plan says that while it's closed to all non-scientific entry, 'views will still be possible from rock formations around the grasslands.'

as brian has mentioned, i would expect the very real possibility of being monitored. the nps has a vested interest in maintaining their closed areas. and i echo brian's sentiment of not entering the area (not suggesting you were summit, but the thread will be read by others)

seems that, by keeping a respectful distance and staying high and away on the rock formations, you would be complying with the management plan unless changes have occurred. (anyone know if there has been any?)

[Jammer]

Wow -- I had no idea this place was off limits. I thought it was just closed to camping. Guess I'm glad I didn't climb all the way up and over that day I was "next door".

Seems a little too protective for my taste (and I am very pro-conservation in general.) Is the concern really migration of seeds? Wouldn't birds/rodents do this much more than hikers?

- Jamal

[erial]

Easiest way to gain a view of Virginia Park would be to continue south on the Joint Trail until you reach Chesler Wash. Hike east in the wash for 15 to 20 minutes and then hike up the side wash 7 to 8 minutes to reach the tunnel like feature that provides a viewpoint at the upper end.

If you turn too soon off of Chesler, you'll likely hike up a side wash where travel ends at a dropoff and where pictographs can be viewed.

If you continue eastward in Chesler Wash, you'll eventually reach an impressive amphitheatre.

From Elephant Canyon and the intersection with the Chesler Park trail (the southern one), you'd want to hike about 15 minutes to a side drainage. At the top of this drainage you can reach a couple of viewpoints of Virginia. The direct one requires surmounting a pouroff and a bit of class 3 or 4 manuevering. Alternatively, at the base of the pouroff, circle several hundred yards around to the right, jump a crack, and eventually reach another viewpoint at a drainage/pouroff into/above the park.

[qedcook]

Does anyone have a clearer route description? Are people still allowed to go to the edge but not inside? I'm assuming something like this but I'd prefer to have a clearer path before I go. Thanks.