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Thread: New Mexico won't recognize Utah's concealed carry licenses

  1. #1

    New Mexico won't recognize Utah's concealed carry licenses

    April 25th, 2010 @ 12:31pm
    SANTA FE, N.M. (AP) -- New Mexico is no longer recognizing Utah's concealed carry licenses in New Mexico, saying Utah's license requirements don't meet New Mexico standards.
    Utah licenses require significantly less training than New Mexico licenses do, state Public Safety Secretary John Denko said.
    New Mexico's concealed carry requirements are designed to protect public safety while ensuring Second Amendment rights, Denko said.
    New Mexico won't recognize another state's license unless its rules allowing people to carry concealed weapons, including training and other provisions, are as stringent as New Mexico's.
    The Department of Public Safety said questions over licenses obtained by New Mexico residents in Utah also are making it necessary to evaluate which states' licenses will be recognized as valid.
    New Mexico is reviewing licenses of 18 other states it now recognizes on an informal basis.
    The state intends to enter into written agreements with other states to ensure compliance with New Mexico law.
    States being reviewed are Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Delaware, Florida, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri, Montana, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia and Wyoming.
    New Mexico officials say a written reciprocity agreement with Texas will not be changed.

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  3. #2
    Thats the problem with lax training, ease of getting one, don't blame them.

  4. #3
    Reciprocity goes both ways. You think Utah will stop recognizing NMs permits now?

  5. #4
    You gotta admit that Utah CCP courses are pretty weak. In my class there were 15 of us. The instructor asked how many had taken hunter safety... 3 hands went up. He made some comment about the need to focus on gun safety. When he asked about how many owned, or had fired a handgun... about 1/2 of the hands went up. So to recap - most of my class is now out there packing weapons that they didn't know how to use - or hadn't had basic firearm safety instruction.

    Talking to the instructor after the class he noted that this is the reason that many states require range time to get a CCP permit - to demonstrate some minimal proficiency with that weapon. He felt that Utah will have to make changes in the next few years. Some states have it as 4 hours classroom and 4 hours range time. I personally feel we should go this route.

  6. #5
    I wonder if this has some good consequences though, the ease of obtaining a permit.

    Just throwing a situation out there... If you wanted to carry, but failed the course, would you still carry while continuing to try passing the course? People carry because of safety, so they'll do it anyways. Hopefully intending on getting the permit soon.

    So Utah makes it easier, but the good thing is more people are registered, fingerprinted, etc... Guessing that about the same number of people would carry either way, would we at least rather have more of them on the books? Maybe this helps reduce the number of "outlaws" who are just good citizens trying to have some personal protection and peace of mind. Easier permit courses would in fact increase the number of law abiding citizens who carry.

    And I'm not saying a ton of people carry without a permit. I've got a permit, but don't carry. So it goes both ways.

    Just throwing that out there.

  7. #6
    I believe Utah is too lax. I was disappointed by how little I learned in the course. Mostly I just sat there and listened to some cop go off about how great and funny he is and learned nothing. Utah should require gun range shooting, and some form of test.

    And Beech to counter what you are saying there is a push starting right now in Utah to abolish the CCW altogether and just let everyone carry (without permits). I hate that idea!

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by DiscGo View Post
    And Beech to counter what you are saying there is a push starting right now in Utah to abolish the CCW altogether and just let everyone carry (without permits). I hate that idea!
    I agree, that'd be bad. There needs to be some registration.

    To argue that though, no matter how easy, some people will just carry illegally no matter what.

  9. #8
    Here is the main thing I believe most people don't know about the CCW. Your record is run multiple times in a day. So if you break the law today, they will notify you of a suspension of your license in the next 3-5 days. Meaning everyone who has their CCW is (at least according to the Government) a law abiding citizen. If the cops see you have a gun and you have the permit, they don't have cause for concern. If the cops know you are carrying and don't have the permit, they know that you are already breaking the law and to handle the situation carefully.


    I agree with you about the more people that have it means the more people who are finger printed and identified (which is good). I just believe that there should be a system to it, so we know that we don't need to be scared of those that do carry.

  10. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by DiscGo View Post
    I believe Utah is too lax. I was disappointed by how little I learned in the course. Mostly I just sat there and listened to some cop go off about how great and funny he is and learned nothing. Utah should require gun range shooting, and some form of test.

    And Beech to counter what you are saying there is a push starting right now in Utah to abolish the CCW altogether and just let everyone carry (without permits). I hate that idea!

    So you want law abiding citizens to jump through hoops to be able to legally carry a firearm, when there is a large portion of society that could care less about a silly permit?

  11. #10
    In the state of Utah open carrying is already legal. I would like people to have to "jump through the hoop" of showing they know how to handle a gun before they go concealing it and carrying it everywhere.

  12. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by DiscGo View Post
    In the state of Utah open carrying is already legal. I would like people to have to "jump through the hoop" of showing they know how to handle a gun before they go concealing it and carrying it everywhere.
    not quite sure i am catching the logic. you are ok with people carrying open who don't know how to use the gun but not ok if people carry concealed and don't know how tto use it? so, the hoop you are looking for people to jump through is how best to conceal the gun properly?

    alaska requires no ccw to carry concealed. however if you want to carry concealed in other states that have reciprosity, then you need to take the alaska ccw course.

    i am not sure how not having a permit is more dangerous to the average citizen. the crooks don't give a damn whether they have a permit or not, and they are the ones i worry about.

  13. #12
    If someone open carries their weapon is easily identifiable, and you know for whom and what to watch out. When the weapon is concealed, you let you guard down and are exposed to a greater threat.

  14. #13
    I really doubt your threat needs to be some Soccer Mom carrying concealed, who shoots her handgun every so often. If a person is looking to use a weapon against another person, I'm sure they are not concerned with a permit, nor could they probably attain one.

  15. #14
    My belief is that the solution to gun related deaths and crime is educating people about guns and gun safety. That is the reason I believe it is important to have a CCW course. But I don't want to violate anybody's 2nd amendment rights, so I maintain that open carry should be allowed.

  16. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by DiscGo View Post
    My belief is that the solution to gun related deaths and crime is educating people about guns and gun safety. That is the reason I believe it is important to have a CCW course. But I don't want to violate anybody's 2nd amendment rights, so I maintain that open carry should be allowed.
    DiscGo i completely agree. education is the key. thats why it should be taught in school. just like drug safety and sex ed. not just as a hunter saftey or ccw course. start em young.

    as far as seeing someone open carrying and knowing who to worry about. i would rather have the criminals worrying about the possibility that everyone is carrying concealed.

    never let your guard down and always be polite.

  17. #16
    I totally agree DenaliGuide. I have my CCW for that reason.

  18. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveOU812 View Post
    Reciprocity goes both ways. You think Utah will stop recognizing NMs permits now?
    No, Utah will continue to recognize New Mexico's permit. Utah accepts ANY permit that is issued by any state.

    Also, I think Utah should take after the Alaska, Arizona & Vermont and don't require a permit at all as long as you can legally own a weapon. I think it's against the 2A to require me to have my permit just because I want to carry a gun.

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