Essential equipment for Mystery Canyon

[Geary]

Scott,

On your comments regarding trail building, seems that there are a lot of folks with good intentions that have never used a chain saw or drill, or even a pick and shovel and may be prone to hurting themselfs or just screwing things up. I've been a volunteer property manager for a cave owned by a conservation group and have worked with all kinds of folks - from newbees to professionals. In addition, you have issues with you want built and how long it will last verses someone else's vision of what is write. As a resource manager, you want to utilize the man power to get some work done but you don't want to have to redo it in a few years. What I have found is when you get ahold of some real professionals like you and your group, the best thing is to stand back and let them work and make sure they have the tools and material to get the job done and then ask them back.

What I've found is that if you develop a relationship with the property managers, you get more freedom and standing invitations to help. We've done work for a state natural area and the park manager gives us a list of tasks and throws us the keys to the truck and the tool barn and says have at it. So, don't give up, you may want to get more involved as I know these parks are understaffed and can use the help. Anyway, thanks for volunteering and hope you have a little understanding of what these resource managers are faced with.

Geary

[ratagonia]

We did Mystery just after the snow melt this year and it was very obvious that the canyon itself is responsible for a lot of erosion down there. Fresh loose rock and snapped trees everywhere. I dont think we were making it much worse.

The Death Gully is in the Carmel formation, which has a lot of sticky icky mud/shale and forms a hard layer after being wetted. When we clamber down the Death Gully, we are mostly on the surface of a debris flow from the big winter in 2005, and the surface is hardened. The effect of our many feet is really quite minor.

Tom

[Bubbles]

Hello all,

I just found this thread after coming over from the ACA, and I have to agree with what several posters said about Mystery not being the most spectacular canyon I've ever done. I led a group in Zion on the week of June 14th and was (according to the backcountry desk when pulling a walk-in permit) to be the first in Mystery that season, though there was evidence of a group about an hour ahead of us. Perhaps they were poaching it, but over the five days of being in Zion I had no problem getting walk-in permits for whatever I wanted. I just showed up to the permit line about a half hour before it opened. Maybe it was easy because the water levels were just coming down that week?

We did the Subway from the top, Mystery, Pine Creek, and Keyhole. We also pulled a permit for Behunin but ended up doing Mystery instead, and had a permit for Imlay but didn't do it because we would have been the first in it that season, and I didn't feel comfortable pioneering it.

In Mystery's defense, the last two rappels are kick butt.

Sarah, glad you got to do it!

[ratagonia]

Hello all,

I just found this thread after coming over from the ACA, and I have to agree with what several posters said about Mystery not being the most spectacular canyon I've ever done. I led a group in Zion on the week of June 14th and was (according to the backcountry desk when pulling a walk-in permit) to be the first in Mystery that season, though there was evidence of a group about an hour ahead of us. Perhaps they were poaching it, but over the five days of being in Zion I had no problem getting walk-in permits for whatever I wanted. I just showed up to the permit line about a half hour before it opened. Maybe it was easy because the water levels were just coming down that week?

We did the Subway from the top, Mystery, Pine Creek, and Keyhole. We also pulled a permit for Behunin but ended up doing Mystery instead, and had a permit for Imlay but didn't do it because we would have been the first in it that season, and I didn't feel comfortable pioneering it.

In Mystery's defense, the last two rappels are kick butt.

Sarah, glad you got to do it!

Welcome to the Bogley, Bubbles!!!

Tom

[Bubbles]

Thanks, Tom!

As for the whole permit system boondoggle at Zion, the way I've always viewed wilderness experiences is that National Parks get the majority of all visitation compared to National Monuments, NRAs, NWRs, NFs, etc. Everyone knows Zion has great canyoneering, and its all very accessible. So everyone goes there.

Coming from So. Cal and spending lots of time in the Angeles and Death Valley, I am not used to meeting anyone who does canyons, let alone running into anyone in canyons. I was surprised and a little disappointed to see other groups on every canyon we did in Zion. But again, everyone knows that what Zion is about. Some guy even went out and wrote a book on it!

I think the 80 person/day quota on the Subway is ridiculous, they should allow a heck of a lot more, but having dealt with a couple aggravating traffic jams on Pine Creek and Keyhole, I can't say I fully disagree with the low limits.

I agree with what an earlier poster said about a lottery system for people waiting at the window. It's not a Zeppelin concert, lives are on the line!