Backcountry Adventure Expo? How about this idea...

[jman]

(Note: I apologize for my grammar and run-on sentences. I intially wrote it without proofreading. I'll go back later and fix em.)

I have been toying with the idea of having a Canyoneering expo or fest, etc. It differs from other fests like Freezefest, FamilyFest, ZionFest, Noobfest, etc... as this one could be a great location, every year. It would contain workshops and demos, of course there would be vendors, and hopefully sponsors.

Before I continue with my overzealous idea, just hear me out to the end and then offer any suggestions or if this would be impractical, too expensive, liability issues, etc of this potentially great venue.

The location I was thinking of is at a actual business - not just someplace random in the outdoors. It's a place where most Northern Utahns could reach within 1-2 hours (or less) and Southern Utahns would take 3-4 hours to reach. The place has a giant amphitheater, lots of grass, LOTS of trees, about 7-9 waterfalls reaching as high as 60+ feet (it boasts the tallest manmade waterfall in the western hemisphere).

The place I'm thinking of is: Thanksgiving Point.

Here is a pic to give you a visual of what I'm thinking:


The prominent feature or attraction would be rappelling down the waterfalls. If not a few of them, we could do the highest one. This rappel would have expert canyoneers on the top and the bottom who would safely help the person rappel down. Oh and it would be a guided rappel. What is hard to see in the picture is inbetween the base of the waterfalls, there are aspen trees a small level/dry ground where the bottom folks would station at.

The plunge pool, I hear but haven't confirmed, is not much deeper than 6 feet and the average is about 4 feet. So if someone went into the lagoon, they would have no problem walking out of it. And its not that far to dry ground anyways.

Another feature of the expo would be having "workshops" to teach the public about the basics of canyoneering. Also there would be advanced technical workshops too. Some examples could be: anchor building, equalizing anchors (there are lots of trees to use in the amphitheater), knot tie-ing and demonstrations, wet vs. dry canyon knowledge, essential gear, examples of different ropes and where to use them, different types of ascenders/descenders and carabiners, learning how to jumar and learning what a prussik system is, gps learning, map reading, etc. etc.

Another feature of the the expo would be having retailers or sponsors. As I would imagine, using the amphitheater venue would not be free (obviously) and having these retailers (such as REI, Sports Warehouse, Dicks, outfitters, clothing specialists, wetsuit/drysuit people, etc.) would offset the cost - and of course they would have the ability to show off their products.

Best part about this, the retailers/sponsers, is it would bring all of gear companies in one collection to this specialized sport - and all of us would want to check it out and try on the gear. I for one, when I have visited Tom's website or Northwashoutfitters, I wanted to see exactly what it looked like and feel it, before I buy it. Online, unfortunately you can't do that - but having a expo like this, would allow all of us to see what's out there in the market. Plus, other retailers for example if REI showed up could have lots of harnesses, and headlamps, tents, pads, and water purifiers, and helmets, etc. would be a huge hit too. With that, I don't imagine too many companies who would NOT want to come. Besides, us canyoneers LOVE Gear.

I forgot one thing to mention above, as I'm not entirely sure about the whole waterfall rappelling idea (I did actually contact Thanksgiving Point management but have only got one response via email back paraphrasing "Sounds like a fun idea! I will forward this to my boss"). So if any of who have connections to Thanksgiving Point management please pass on the info, as I'm serious about this idea.

If it's a point of liability of rappelling down the waterfall, I'm sure there is someway around it such as having ACA certififed members there, and signing disclosure forms, and probably getting insurance for it - again, we could have those who want to rappel pay a certain price (say $30 for 2 rappels or something) to pay for the insurance, and we could ask our sponsors to help pitch in.

If that gets approved by some miracle, then I have other ideas that can be tied into the water. Example: there is one part of the waterfalls, that's more of gentle cascade into the lagoon, and we could set up a belay line while downclimbing its tiers into the lagoon. I'll look for a pic so you can understand better of what that would look like.

Oh, on the concrete pad, there would be changing tents for those wanting to rappel could change from streets clothes into wetsuits and visa versa. After each use and thankfully at that location, there are spigots where we could attach hoses and clean and sanitize the wetsuits after they are returned.

And I need to mention this: those working at the workshops would all be non-paid volunteers. Just offering their talents and skills for the betterment of all...and of course, the love of the sport!

Another idea, I had is using that concrete pad as where a microphone and speaker system could be setup and some type of narrator could be announcing what is happening throughout the day.
Example, on a Saturday, s/he would announce 10-12am would have these workshops going on, and 12-2pm would have these workshops going on, at 3pm would have a guest speaker sharing a story or tech tip, etc. And so on and so on.


Wow....

I'll stop here for now as this is basically part 1 of 2, but would like to hear some feedback, criticism, just like I mentioned above about this overzealous endeavor.

[Scott Card]

Fun idea but do you think there is enough of us crazies in this sport to support this large of an event? The cost of Thanksgiving Point must be very big and liability on the waterfall would be a huge issue for them too. With that said, I'm still listening....

[jman]

Yes, I recognize that.

First, I'm still waiting to hear back from the upper management if it's even feasible. If we can't rappel down the waterfall, I'll ask him if there's any way of rappelling anything in that area, maybe not down the water chute but to the side or something.

Second, yea to rent out a place say for a wedding reception on a weekend costs around $5000. But with that price, their staff covers a lot of the logisitics. FOR US, we would just need to rent out the time and logistics would be covered by us and our sponsors or other retailers.

Third, I was thinking just like you were - if a Canyoneering Expo would bring in over 200 people, at least. Maybe, just maybe. But even with that - that's not NEARLY enough people, as I'm realizing, to cover the costs.

So what if it was changed from explicitly a Canyoneering Expo to a Rock Climbing, Canyoneering, Hiking convention, or maybe just call it a Backcountry Outdoor Expo. That way, potentially more retailers could come in and bring new sports, like fishing, kayaking, etc and much more people...

I'm not saying anything will happen, but it is kind of fun to think about and toy with the idea. And thanks for "still listening" Scott...

[caverdan]

..

[jman]

I'm liking your idea and would be up to driving out to it if you put something together.

These types of events usually have a cover charge and you could charge per class to cover instructor expenses and such. Maybe $20 for the expo and $30 for expo and classes. Just a thought.

Good luck.

Thanks for the optimism!

I'm not sure obviously of how the logistics are run of an expo or convention, etc, but the more I think about it - charging someone like $20 for an entrance fee, and $40-50 all day classes/entrance and 1 rappel or something...I'm sure most would be more than happy to pay that.

I just think it would be great to get all the gear manufacturers together and show off merchandise and a chance to try it on, especially as the canyoneering cliche goes, "fastest growing backcountry sport in the world."

Also, I was thinking since it would be now be more of a backcountry outdoor expo - if we can recruit different outfitters to show off their guiding service and the canyons, or adventures they sport off.

Example: Zion Adventure Company, North Wash Outfitters, Moab Desert Adventures, Desert Highlights (Moab) Paragon Adventures (including ziplining in St. George), Zion Country Action Tours, Red Mountain Resort and Spa (St. George), Tex Riverways (Green River riverafting), etc. etc.

And I already have a connection with the Utah Department of Tourism (utah.com), and I'm sure I could get some recognition on their homepage and possible a sponsor by them if said businesses come along.

I'll bet most people don't know that there are so many outfitters - and that's just a sample of them in Utah. They would be there showing off their services and signing up new individuals, couples, families, business retreats, etc. They would have lots of photographs and hopefully offer discounts to get people to sign up (or at least the general public).

Just throwing out more ideas to chew on...

[jman]

I've been to probably 2 or 3 outdoor expos in my entire life, one in Cali and one in Colorado, and I think, one in Utah. But the one in Utah was focused on boating, hunting, kayaking, and camping. There wasn't a lot of emphasis on hiking, or even rockclimbing. But this one, would not be one that is focused on boats but more sporty, physical activities.

With that said, the above kayakers would have a place to show off their gear on actual water. Say for example, they could take from 2-4pm or whatever of that expo day, and they could use the entire lagoon and have a class teaching the basics of kayaking, or a have a demonstration of how to rollover correctly, and at the very least, the customers can see how the kayaks cooperate on the water and get a first-hand look. Compared to other expos, where the showcasing kayaks are on dry land. I want to see it in action, and hopefully learn a new technique or something.

And once the kayakers are done with their timeslot on the lagoon, then the Fishermen can use it and teach the public about fishing, flyfishing, learning to bait, fileting a fish, etc. etc.. And once again, compared to other expos, they would learn and teach using the lagoon and its thousands of gallons of water, and not just a big room and on dry ground or something.

Plus some of the fishing retailers could have those float tubes and waiters for people to try on and ACTUALLY test them at the expo in the lagoon.

If there wasn't enough room at the lagoon which is the base of the waterfalls, then they could follow the stream down to the bigger pond...seen here:


Obviously, they can't fish the pond. But the point would be to practice throwing and reeling - especially when it comes to flyfishing.

Well, so those are a few more ideas of the Backcountry Expo.

[Iceaxe]

Funny you should mention this.... Poaching the waterfall at Thanksgiving Point has been on my to-do list for a while now.....

Outside of that all I can say at the moment is you might have something BIG if you can pull it of.... Good Luck....

[jman]

thanks Shane!

I think it would be really cool if everything came together, but first thing first,

1. I need to present a formal plan to Thanksgiving Point and they need to talk to their lawyers about rappelling down the waterfall and have them come up with total cost to host it there.

2. I have to pick a hot day in the summer.
3. Then I need to go to businesses and recruit and ask for sponsors and donations, etc in return for a booth or spot at the expo.

4. Then I need to ask for volunteers and instructors to help teach the workshops.

5. Then marketing and marketing and more marketing...
and much more from there.


If any of you have ideas, or who are willing to donate time, services, money, etc. please let me know.

One last thing: I'm sure I can rent out the place - but the main attraction would be the waterfront. So if any of you have any connections to the management or have any other ideas, please let me know!
Thanks a million!

[DiscGo]

This sounds awesome. If you can get the ball rolling on this, I'd be happy to help solicit sponsors, or help in some other way if needed.

[jman]

This sounds awesome. If you can get the ball rolling on this, I'd be happy to help solicit sponsors, or help in some other way if needed.

Thanks Discgo! I'll need all the help I can get and I'll keep you and everyone else up to date on it.

So I have officially renamed it from the "Canyoneering Expo", to the "Backcountry Adventure Expo".

And I have some good news to report on tomorrow about this project that I just received from someone in management! Well...that is if I get ANY spare time tomorrow...

[Canyonbug]

Sounds like a big plan. Keep us up to date with ideas and movements forward. I can see your potential and excitement, but see some setbacks and hangups from other expos I have been involved with. Would love to see what can be done.

[jman]

Thanks Jared (it's jared if I remember correctly?)!

LONG Update:

I'm finally finished with my 8-page, formal presentation about the expo. I'll try to convert it to PDF and upload it here so you can guys can check it out too. This is the one I'll be using to give to companies, including prices, and contact information. It looks pretty good too! A few pictures, proof-read!, and easy to read!

So all these showcasing events happen at Thanksgiving Point all the time I hear...so with that, I got quick reply from them asking me to come in for a personal tour and explain my ideas and features to them.

And to backtrack a little, I asked in the email, if playing in the water or even rappelling down the waterfall would be possible. In the email they responded, "sounds like a great, unique idea!" And then they said they will talk to the upper management and liability with it.

Now, I have to mention it will not be happening this year. SO MUCH work has to be continued with...And besides, they are all booked up for June and July, and August is wayyy to late.

So next year in June is the aim. That way, the season just begins and all the vendors and sponsors, will still have plenty of time to get people signed up for outfitters and buy (hopefully) lots of products.

Also: awhile back, my older sister dated the owner of a major biking company in Utah (can't say just yet) and I presented my plan to him asking if he'd like to participate and showcase his mountain bikes - and of course, the best part at the location is that they will be able to test them out in a real environment, not just in the store on the carpet - Anyways, he said he will bring 30+ mountainbikes to it, if I mass market and advertise to the mountainbike community. Awesome! Already, a semi-commited business!

Also: I'm good friends with one of the managers of the Sportsplex (giant gym in Kaysville - and the same place were some REAL players practice) and presented him with my idea for next year, and he said he would be happy to sponsor it! Yea!

Also: Last week, I went scuba-diving in the Homestead Crater (Midway, Utah), and rent my equipment from a scuba-diving company in Ogden. I told the manager about the idea (about 1/2 done on the formal presentation then) and he LIKES it a lot. He said, scuba diving is a small-niche of people in Utah who do it, but they are loyal he said. He said anything to promote scuba-diving and certifications here - he is all for it! He said he would be happy to donate money to the expo! Awesome!

Also: I sent a formal presenation to the folks at Spot for them to review. That would be great if they could commit! Or even give a 15min presentation of how it works and what happens behind the scenes, and possibly share a few stories.

When I get to formally present the presentation to the Thanksgiving Folks and get approval for using the waterfront, then I believe good things will happen.

Oh, Jared, I have a document and have read a few books about organizing "social events" and some notes from designers of previous expos. So the plans are made, and I have a map of Thanksgiving, and mapped/grid-ed out so everyone can have the same space as the next retailer (unless you wanna pay more for bigger space). Also, I organized it by section - canyoneering section, mtn biking section, fishing section, etc. This way it will be easy for folks to navigate their way through it.

Another thing I have been working on is a program, per-se, to give to everyone when they enter, and it will have a map of the expo, a section for workshops and prices, a itinerary of the day, and my favorite part is located on the back of the program, in which it would be divided into two sections. One would be a Top 10 Places to Visit in Utah - for Life, and the bottom would be Top 10 Places to Visit In Utah - for the year. If the exhibition is annual thing - I'd like to have the bottom half rotate every year and the top section stay permanetly. And the bottom half would also contain a checklist and to those folks who completed and date it, can return it the next year into a raffle for a Mtn bike, or new camera, or other cool products.

You probably laughed when you read the last paragraph, but that believe me, I have thought of LOTs of details so far and my notebook devoted to this project is nearly 3/4 full of ideas and plans.




aye aye aye...so much work! But I'm committed and the beginning will be the hardest part.

Question: Thanksgiving Point is closed on Sunday, so the expo would have to be on Friday and Saturday. Is one weekend enough? or do you think two weekends (in a row) would be best?

[Iceaxe]

Question: Thanksgiving Point is closed on Sunday, so the expo would have to be on Friday and Saturday. Is one weekend enough? or do you think two weekends (in a row) would be best?

If you need more days start it Thursday Afternoon... maybe 3 pm, that allows an entire evening free for more people to attend.

I think the two weekend deal would be a bad idea.... those with displays will not want to set them up twice.... those with product will not want to haul the crap around for a week and set it up a second time.

Just my 2 cents....

Sounds like you are already over the first huddle, which is getting TGP interested.

[Scott Card]

Jman, nice work. I can see you have thought this through quite well. I will be interested to see your plan. By then, I may be interested in being a sponsor if some plans I have work out.... And I agree with Ice. Thurs through Saturday in the summer would be ideal for this area of the state.

[DiscGo]

Good for you for taking a project like this on. It sounds awesome!

[jman]

thanks for the encouragement everyone. I appreciate that! And thanks Scott! I'll, of course, keep everyone updated.

Quick Update:
To start off with building interest, since I'll have a year and half or less, I'll go to small lecture groups across Northern Utah, and handing out flyers for the expo - but probably 95% will forget about it until the expo begins, which sucks, but that's reality. But that way I can introduce myself to everyone and start networking myself out and gaining interest and possibly commitments.

Hopefully, by April 2010, I will start monthly lecture groups in various places across the state (such as in free places like the Library or Lecture halls or Universities) and have guest speakers give a 1hr long presentation/demonstration/lecture about canyoneering, rock climbing, ice-climbing, fishing, or photography (like having Summit or CarpeyBiggs (Dan) show off their work and photography skills or having a Q&A, etc.) hiking, mountaineering (similar to what Party Animal does in regards to Everest) kayaking, etc.

And at the end, I would close the group and tell everyone about the expo and pass out flyers and tell them to mark it in their calendars and iphones, etc, and pass on the information to businesses and their friends and families.

Now I just need some takers or people who want to present their skills, or passion for love of the outdoors (not just canyoneering), and share stories. Larry Canyon incident folks? River-rafting folks? Canyoneers with LOTS of experience, perhaps in other countries and can do slideshows? Photography slideshows? Basics of ice-climbing? Leadership skills? etc. etc.

If you give me your name and phone number, I'll get in contact with you with the next few months and you can plan it how you want - educational, presentation, lecture, story, debate or discussion about a incident, etc. And I'll take care of the rest, including 75% of publicity and the venue.

Also, I have a connection with a Rock Climbing wall (30-35feet) so I can rent one out and charge $5/per climb for it, that would be used at the expo.

BTW - here is the current price listing just for attending the expo (not including classes, etc.)

12 and older:
Individual: $10
Couple: $15
Family up to 5: $30
Over 60: free
12 and under: free

[jman]

One more quick update:

Yesterday, I got in contact with 2 book retailers and 1 map retailer, and explained briefly about the expo, and how successful these companies could be here:

Example: Barnes and Noble would be there and have a 10x10 slot, but they would ONLY sell outdoor related books, guides, directions, maps, etc.

And Map World - as they have the most complete topographical map collection I have seen, well at least for Utah. But they would brings loads of topos for the entire state - Zion, Moab, Wasatch Front, Uintas, Lake Powell, Escalante, etc. These would sell like hotcakes.

[jman]

Wow, lots of quick updates huh!

Here's another one:
I just got off the phone with one of the event specialists for Garmin, and he said they would be happy to come and show off their latest gear (as compared to other expos which are indoors they can't really get GPS reception which he explained which would be a nice addition).

YAY!

[CarpeyBiggs]

do you think you can get Mike Kelsey to set up a booth and sell some books?



seriously though, i could put you in touch with some folks who run some of the other utah county expos. they could possibly help. (or try to take/buy/steal your idea...)

[jman]

do you think you can get Mike Kelsey to set up a booth and sell some books?



seriously though, i could put you in touch with some folks who run some of the other utah county expos. they could possibly help. (or try to take/buy/steal your idea...)

haha yeah true. He would probably show up - but no one could go to his booth because of his comments.

HEY a buyout! nice! I'm only asking for 10 million, nothing too much, just petty cash.

Thanks for the connection, I'll let you know once I present the idea formally to TGP managment and I officially set the date.