To Slot Canyon or not To Slot Canyon?? need some advice

[moab mark]

You mention Mystery - I can only speak for myself, but as someone with not much experience of technical slots, I think I'm happier to leave Mystery for another trip. I think that would be pushing my comfort zone a bit.

Technically I think Mystery is easier than Pine Creek. None of the rappels in Mystery are free hanging and there is no swimming in Mystery (Pine Creek can have a lot of swimming). The final rappel in Pine Creek can be a little intimidating. I know I've backed off of it before to calm myself before taking the the "final step". But than again, I'm a pussy when it comes to rappels....

I'm with Ice on this one, Mystery is a bigger day but technically easier. The rappel at mystery falls has some exposure rigging it but thats about it.
As far as Pinecreek, rigging the cathedral rappel where the bolts are around the edge is attention getting. That last rappel at pine creek seems to get everyones attention. The way the bolts are on the edge and then just going over the edge. Me do not like it.

As Ice would say "your mileage may vary"

Mark

[ratagonia]

Technically I think Mystery is easier than Pine Creek. None of the rappels in Mystery are free hanging and there is no swimming in Mystery (Pine Creek can have a lot of swimming). The final rappel in Pine Creek can be a little intimidating. I know I've backed off of it before to calm myself before taking the the "final step". But than again, I'm a pussy when it comes to rappels....

I'm with Ice on this one, Mystery is a bigger day but technically easier. The rappel at mystery falls has some exposure rigging it but thats about it.
As far as Pinecreek, rigging the cathedral rappel where the bolts are around the edge is attention getting. That last rappel at pine creek seems to get everyones attention. The way the bolts are on the edge and then just going over the edge. Me do not like it.

As Ice would say "your mileage may vary"

Mark

I concur, Dr. Ice, Dr. Mark. Mystery presents few and straightforward technical challenges, and if you can fit it into your itinerary, you really should. Hard to get a permit for on weekends, otherwise not too bad.

Tom

[sarahlizzy]

Interesting indeed. I'd got it into my head that Mystery was the "next level up". I do expect to be extremely nervous around that last rap in Pine Creek (even if it is only 85 feet now ), but I don't mind the free aspect of it - the lack of presence of a cliff tends not to bother me so much as the brief, "this isn't going to work and I'm going to die" moment I have right at the start any time I go over the edge.

But this thread has made me think a lot more seriously about doing Mystery. I have a question for the Zion regulars - what sort of time would I need to be at the permit window on Monday July 6th in order to have a reasonable chance of getting a permit for Tuesday 7th?

[Iceaxe]

the lack of presence of a cliff tends not to bother me so much as the brief, "this isn't going to work and I'm going to die" moment I have right at the start any time I go over the edge.

yeah.... that's the feeling I sometimes get.



.

[trackrunner]

But this thread has made me think a lot more seriously about doing Mystery. I have a question for the Zion regulars - what sort of time would I need to be at the permit window on Monday July 6th in order to have a reasonable chance of getting a permit for Tuesday 7th?

Depends. Subway & Mystery are the two most popular canyons that people show up early morning hours to get a permit. You'll have better chances for a Tuesday over a weekend. But I've known people show up before 6am and still not get a permit for a weekday Mystery permit. But that was because the first group in line took all 6 walkin for Mystery. First 3 groups in line were trying to get Mystery.

YMMV

[Iceaxe]

One item that would improve your odds.... show up at 6am Monday morning and be willing to except Monday or Tuesday Mystery permits.

Who knows, you might get permits for Monday... you just never know with the worthless crappy permit system.

[cookiecutter]

Any idea on what the weather will be like next week. I hear chance of thunderstorm..anyone heard the same??

AH thunderstorms would kill our trip!

[sarahlizzy]

One item that would improve your odds.... show up at 6am Monday morning and be willing to except Monday or Tuesday Mystery permits.

Who knows, you might get permits for Monday... you just never know with the worthless crappy permit system.

Sadly, Monday is when we have Pine Creek permits - the only time we have two free days in a row is after the Subway, and I suspect we'll want to do something slow to recover after that, like Angels' Landing, the Narrows or the technically challenging Hot Tub.

[Iceaxe]

Sadly, Monday is when we have Pine Creek permits

But Pine Creek permits are easy to get.... I've never missed getting one as a walk up in the morning... so I'm just saying... if you can get permits Monday and not Tuesday for Mystery you might want to go that route. And that same morning you could swap your Monday Pine Creek permits for Tuesday.... just food for thought....

Isn't the permit system wonderful....

...

[Jaxx]

Any idea on what the weather will be like next week. I hear chance of thunderstorm..anyone heard the same??

AH thunderstorms would kill our trip!

I would still go down and see what the weather is like the day of. I have had bad weather forecasts and gone anyway to beautiful weather. If it is raining then just do a non tech hike with the masses and enjoy the beautiful but crowded scenery. That is still funner that being at home doing chores.

[sarahlizzy]

But Pine Creek permits are easy to get.... I've never missed getting one as a walk up in the morning... so I'm just saying... if you can get permits Monday and not Tuesday for Mystery you might want to go that route. And that same morning you could swap your Monday Pine Creek permits for Tuesday.... just food for thought....

OK, that would work. Thanks for the tip!

[Stick]

One item that would improve your odds.... show up at 6am Monday morning and be willing to except Monday or Tuesday Mystery permits.

Who knows, you might get permits for Monday... you just never know with the worthless crappy permit system.

Sadly, Monday is when we have Pine Creek permits - the only time we have two free days in a row is after the Subway, and I suspect we'll want to do something slow to recover after that, like Angels' Landing, the Narrows or the technically challenging Hot Tub.

If permits for Mystery are available Monday but not Tuesday I would still get the permits for Mystery and ask the rangers to release the permits you had for Pine Creek that day. You should have no trouble getting Pine Creek permits for Tuesday or any other day. You are out the $5 you spend to reserve the permit in the first place though...

But chances are the Mystery permits for Monday will be claimed on Sunday.

[ratagonia]

One item that would improve your odds.... show up at 6am Monday morning and be willing to except Monday or Tuesday Mystery permits.

Who knows, you might get permits for Monday... you just never know with the worthless crappy permit system.

Sadly, Monday is when we have Pine Creek permits - the only time we have two free days in a row is after the Subway, and I suspect we'll want to do something slow to recover after that, like Angels' Landing, the Narrows or the technically challenging Hot Tub.

Mystery is not a physically demanding canyon, especially if you get a shuttle to the top. Makes a good "rest day" canyon. Pine Creek too - it only takes an hour or two or three - kinda restful.

Tom

[moab mark]

Myself, wife and buddy did mystery last year in about 5 hours. That was from when the shuttle dropped Us off. It goes pretty quick with a small group. Rappeling into the narrows is pretty awes.
If you can get a permit just move pinecreek. BUT DEFINITELY PAY FOR THE SHUTTLE.

Mark

[Scott P]

Personally, I wouldn't get a shuttle for Mystery.

The most scenic part of Mystery is the bottom end from Mystery Springs to the Narrows. I would say the second most scenic part is the hike from Zion Canyon up to Observation Point. If you did the shuttle you would miss that part.

Any idea on what the weather will be like next week. I hear chance of thunderstorm..anyone heard the same??

There are currently flash flood warnings out. Use caution. The backcountry desk should inform you of the forecast when you get your permit.

As said you can still do something non-tech even if the weather is bad. In fact, when the weather is bad in Zion, it is actually really interesting and with waterfalls spilling off the cliffs all over the place.

[ratagonia]

Personally, I wouldn't get a shuttle for Mystery.

The most scenic part of Mystery is the bottom end from Mystery Springs to the Narrows. I would say the second most scenic part is the hike from Zion Canyon up to Observation Point. If you did the shuttle you would miss that part.

Any idea on what the weather will be like next week. I hear chance of thunderstorm..anyone heard the same??

There are currently flash flood warnings out. Use caution. The backcountry desk should inform you of the forecast when you get your permit.

As said you can still do something non-tech even if the weather is bad. In fact, when the weather is bad in Zion, it is actually really interesting and with waterfalls spilling off the cliffs all over the place.

For those who don't know, Scott is a very strong, very energetic young man. Please consider this when incorporating his opinion.

Not being all that strong or all that young, I have done the hike up from the canyon once, and have done the shuttle many other times.

Had friends who drove to the top. Hiked the canyon, then realized that the keys for the bottom car were in the car at the top, so Steve hiked up to Observation Point and the trailhead AFTER doing the canyon, while his wife went into town for some R&R.

T

[oldno7]

I'm with Tom...
The hike up is right at 2400' of elevation gain. Just when you feel proud of yourself for such an accomplishment, you hit death gulley and immediately loose 1200' in a relatively short distance. Unless your in top physical shape(not me), get a shuttle

[sarahlizzy]

Presumably one can hire a 4WD taxi from Springdale, removing the need to drive back up there at the end of the day?

[moab mark]

Presumably one can hire a 4WD taxi from Springdale, removing the need to drive back up there at the end of the day?

Lots of shuttles, Zions Adventures is who we use. If you have two cars you can shuttle yourself. But it's time consuming. On Tom's statement I did Mystery with him one time and his demeanor changed greatly when we told him we were paying for the shuttle and not hiking the east rim trail.

Mark

[sarahlizzy]

Presumably one can hire a 4WD taxi from Springdale, removing the need to drive back up there at the end of the day?

Lots of shuttles, Zions Adventures is who we use. If you have two cars you can shuttle yourself. But it's time consuming. On Tom's statement I did Mystery with him one time and his demeanor changed greatly when we told him we were paying for the shuttle and not hiking the east rim trail.

Mark

Cool! Thanks. If we get a permit, I'll check them out.