The gun market has gone crazy, I'm doing my part to help it

[donny h]

I've had stuff on order, but it's just not coming in, so I making it happen other ways.

Saturday, I got a barely used Glock 34, this is the 9mm full sized, it's an inch longer than the standard 17.



Sunday, I went back and got a Mossberg 590, 12 gauge, 20" barrel w/factory 9-shot magazine and heat shroud.



Friday, fedex showed up with the results of a gunbrocker auction.





Mid-week I got a box from J&GSales, 10 extra mags and 450 rounds of .308.





I'm just hoping I get the last things I have on order:

4 17round and 4 33round Glock magazines.

Kel-Tec Sub 2000 carbine that accepts the same Glock mags as the 17 and 34.









The price of ammunition is completely insane, if you can find it at all.

I need to get into reloading in a big way.

[CrazyFinn]

That Mossberg 590 is an awsome gun. I almost bought it, but got the 500 instead with a short and long barrel.

I'd kill (ha ha) for that .308 but I think it's illegal in Kalifornia. Too many rounds in that clip. I have a Ruger Mini-14 (.223) Target with a 5 shot clip.
My mini will shoot 300 yds which is about the limit here. That .308 will shoot a 1000 yds.

I was just going to do target shooting before the man got elected.

I have a ruger 22 rifle with a 10 shot clip which I love for shooting cans etc. at about 100 yds. The shells are practically free.

I also have a 9mm (actually the wife does) but it's worthless. The kinetic energy is way too low. Couldn't stop a squirrel in it's tracks.

I started with a .357 magnum revolver and it has some stopping power. Come to think of it I'm going too see if I can get more ammo tomorrow.
I was buyng 38 special shells for it but those are useless too. No energy.

[donny h]

That Mossberg 590 is an awsome gun.

It's been very well behaved so far, so I'm rewarding it with a pistol grip, side saddle shell carrier, and tactical light.

I'd kill (ha ha) for that .308 but I think it's illegal in Kalifornia.

So illegal.

H&K91 and their clones are specifically banned in the Roberti-Roos law.

I was just going to do target shooting before the man got elected.

That election is doing a lot of motivating, no doubt about it.

I don't think it's just about who won, it's that whole "we won and we're writing the laws" thing.










Here's how I sadly predict it will all go down:

There will be a tragedy, a gun massacre at a mall, schoolyard, college, eatery, or workplace.

There will be a flurry of laws proposed, most of them extremely draconian, the least onerous will be rammed through and passed into law, and held up as a compromise.

It will at least equal AWB Act I, probably far worse, like federal licensing or an outright ban on all semiautos.








Ammo taxes and bullet serial numbers are two ways to simply price everything out of existence without actually banning a thing, a $1 a bullet tax would set a brick of 1K .22lr at $1015, a box of 50 9mm $65, a box of shotgun shells over $30.

A defacto ban.

[CrazyFinn]

I am kind of new to guns. Bought my first only 2 years ago. I think people are also buying for fear of crime increasing. Thats why I bought my shotgun.

I used to have my wife's 9mm (small one - 380 auto) next to the bed. Then I learned about kinetic energy and I awoke one night thinking this little pea shooter could not stop a big man. So I went and bought the Mossberg 500. Her 9mm only has a muzzle energy of 200 ft-lbs.

My 357 with a magnum cartridge has 583 ft-lbs. That will do the trick.

I looked up your .308 and it's around 2680 ft-lbs. That just mean!!!

[CrazyFinn]

Just returned from my local Wal-Mart looking for 357 magnum rounds. Out of stock. In fact the shelves were so empty no one was even working the gun counter. On line places are also out. I guess this is real!

[donny h]

I guess this is real!

There is a lot of denial going on out there, even among gun owners, but the shortage of ammo is real, chronic, and it started in the summer of 07.

I went into Springvilles walmart on Friday, that had zero on hand of: .357, .38special, .40sw, .45acp, 9mm, 12gauge buckshot or slugs, .223, 7.62x39, and .22lr.

That's right, no .22lr on hand, and sportsmans warehouse had exactly 4 bricks on hand as of Thursday.

And the prices are just crazy.

I bought two case of 1k 9mm a few days apart from each other, the price went up in those 3 days from $240 to $270, two years ago they were $100.

I heard that at this last gun show in Utah 1k cases of .223 were going for $350 and up, those were $125 just a couple of years ago.

7.62x39 is really popular due to the vast amounts of SKS and AK47 rifles out there, 1k round cases of 7.62 sold for $150 in 85 when it first started coming into the country, steadily dropping in the years since then down to $60, right now it's hard to find and going for over $300 a case if you do.



It's not just ammo, some gun prices and values are through the roof:

Saiga 12 gauge shotguns are going for $650 or more, those were $250 frive years ago.

Norinco SKS went from $200 to $700, Yugo SKS from $90 to $350.

All ARs are worth at least a grand, Bushmasters in .308 are up around $2500 or more.

I bought a new H&K91 in the late 80s for $500, in new condition it's now worth close to $4k, the Colt AR15 I paid $725 for back then is now worth $2000 or more.

Even the lowly Ruger 10/22 is going for $250 in some areas.

Glocks have only gone up $50, but good luck finding new ones in stock, the factory is behind on orders to the tune of 125,000 to 150,000 units.

It really is getting crazy out there.

[ExpUt]

Started stocking up 2 years ago, thankfully I'm sitting happy just as things are climaxing and becoming obsolete, though I wish I had bought more, I've got what I feel is a small lot compared to what I plink off over a years time. I've watched the prices literally double in the last 18 months, its pretty wild.

One major factor, as all these surplus lots of ammo are getting purchased up, partly fueled by the speculation and scares of gun/ammo bans. They simply can't make new ammo for the price surplus ammo was selling for, the raw materials along usually cost more than old Czech, Russion, Israli, etc ammo was (is) selling for. Once all that surplus ammo is gone... we'll be buying 45 cent 7.62 rounds

[CrazyFinn]

OK Then. Maybe I should look into reloading. So I go online to Midway USA. Even 223 Remington bullets are gone. I want the Sierra Matchkings as they were the most accurate so far in my mini. I can still buy some brass.

Anyone reload? I haven't a clue how to reload. Thought I would buy a book first along with brass and bullets and then figure it out.

Shall I buy brass with primer or without?

[CrazyFinn]

Well, I found some ammo at Cheaper than Dirt and placed an order.

Found 22LR, 357 Magnum Hollow Point, and 223 FMJ Boat tail.

[Scott Card]

I have had a dickens of a time finding 410 gauge 2 1/2 in. cartridges for my new Taurus "Judge". I can't find a single buck shot cartridge out there. I assume they are still making this stuff but when Sportsman's Warehouse and Cabelas don't have pretty standard stuff, something is up.

[BruteForce]

Well, I found some ammo at Cheaper than Dirt and placed an order.

Found 22LR, 357 Magnum Hollow Point, and 223 FMJ Boat tail.

Be careful with that ammo. I've heard bad stories about Cheaper Than Dirt's quality control. Inspect your rounds before loading.

[fourtycal]

OK Then. Maybe I should look into reloading. So I go online to Midway USA. Even 223 Remington bullets are gone. I want the Sierra Matchkings as they were the most accurate so far in my mini. I can still buy some brass.

Anyone reload? I haven't a clue how to reload. Thought I would buy a book first along with brass and bullets and then figure it out.

Shall I buy brass with primer or without?

I reload, used to reload a lot but right now I can't buy powder or bullets anywhere and the prices have gone up for components if you can find them .

[donny h]

right now I can't buy powder or bullets anywhere

Or primers or brass.





If you want to overpay, check KSL classifieds, reloading stuff is on there but the prices are just lame.

[donny h]

I'm just hoping I get the last things I have on order:

4 17round and 4 33round Glock magazines.

Kel-Tec Sub 2000 carbine that accepts the same Glock mags as the 17 and 34.

I cancelled that order with Impact Guns after talking with them, Glocks and their mags aren't expected for another two months, longer for the Kel-Tec.

So I just bought it all off of gunbroker.

Sub 2000 and mags are on the way.

[Sombeech]

reminds me of all the denial in this thread

http://www.bogley.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14651

[donny h]

reminds me of all the denial in this thread

Ostrich heads + sand = bliss.

Investing in guns in October was wise, I believe even at current prices it still is.

I'm overpaying for a few things, just to get them into my hands now, but they'll still be a good investment inside of a year.






My short 'need' list is now complete, on to the 'want' list, starting with suppressed .22lr, although I hear the ATF backlog on the tax stamp is running 2-3 months.

[CrazyFinn]

Well, I found some ammo at Cheaper than Dirt and placed an order.

Found 22LR, 357 Magnum Hollow Point, and 223 FMJ Boat tail.

Be careful with that ammo. I've heard bad stories about Cheaper Than Dirt's quality control. Inspect your rounds before loading.

Order came in today. All Ammo is Federal but the .223 is Lake City and looks like it's reload. Brass is burnt. The 22LR and .357 looks new.

But at least it's not 'Beijing Ammo for You'.

[shagster]

Lake city is still owned by the same company as federal.

I feel bad for you guys, good thing I work for the manufacturer and can get what I need I will let you know what the factory looks like when I am there next month.

I just talked to Federal and CCI this week, they are working 24/7 hiring temps and still cannot keep up on production. .223 rounds are behind schedule until 2011, orders are being filled as quickly as they can. Primers are going to be tough to get as well. In fact when I asked about getting some .380 rounds for my ruger lcp's they said they don't have any in their factory and have no idea when they will have some available. I am sure you will continue to see price increases as well.

[CrazyFinn]

Lake city is still owned by the same company as federal.

Yeah, the boxes are marked Federal Lake City.

I feel bad for you guys, good thing I work for the manufacturer and can get what I need I will let you know what the factory looks like when I am there next month.

I just talked to Federal and CCI this week, they are working 24/7 hiring temps and still cannot keep up on production. .223 rounds are behind schedule until 2011, orders are being filled as quickly as they can. Primers are going to be tough to get as well. In fact when I asked about getting some .380 rounds for my ruger lcp's they said they don't have any in their factory and have no idea when they will have some available. I am sure you will continue to see price increases as well.

Ammo is scarce everywhere. Only store I've found is Bass Pro Shops in Mesa,AZ. They had full shelves a week ago per another website.

It's going to be get what you can.

[donny h]

I just talked to Federal and CCI this week, they are working 24/7 hiring temps and still cannot keep up on production.

I just heard that demand for ammunition is up 100% since just November.