Winter in southern Utah

[Rob L]

Hi all; following your warm welcome, some questions from a newbie if I may.

I'll be flying into Las Vegas for two weeks of hiking in Utah & Arizona over Christmas.

1. 4x4 hire in Las Vegas: Are there any cheaper car rental places in Las Vegas other than the usual suspects at the airport?

2. Winter weather Although I'm familiar with winter conditions in Zion & Moab, What is the typical winter weather in the following areas at the end of December:

Upper Paria
Hole-in-the-Rock
Canyonlands (needles)

...I don't mind the cold, just a question about typical snow conditions.

3. Topo Maps Does anyone know a store in St George that can supply topo maps for the above areas?

4. Walk-in's for the Wave If I turn up at the Kanab office, what is the likelihood of getting a walk-in? Or will the queue be very long?

Thanks in advance; this is a great site.

Rob

[RedRoxx]

I am not the best resource but will take a stab at a couple of things.

Beware some car rentals will disable the 4wd capability to limit the tendency to go gonzo off road. I got this info from the Death Valley boards.

If rain or wet snow BEWARE most of the clay based roads southern utah. They can be impassable even with a mod 4wd. Esp Cottonwood Canyon road. I know this from first hand experience.

The Wave, if during the week and not around peak tourist periods you have a decent chance I think. I've been there 4 times, the first around 20 years ago and have never bothered to get a permit. Now is a lot more popular tho. If you can't get a permit for there cruising around in Wire Pass and Buckskin can be fun for a day and the White Pockets area is pretty nice, although I think requires permit but shouldn't be hard to get.

TOPO's--- I would think would be somewhere in St George but know in Escalante can get some from several of the Canyon outfitters in town.

[trackrunner]

3. Topo Maps Does anyone know a store in St George that can supply topo maps for the above areas?
Rob

Sure do, Outdoor Outlet 1062 E Tabernacle St St George, UT 84770. Not sure if they will carry all your mapping needs. Here is the way to find out. The manager of this store, Bo Beck, is a regualr poster on this forum. Hit him up with a PM. Give him enough advance warning he might be able to order in everything you need.

[trackrunner]

Beware some car rentals will disable the 4wd capability to limit the tendency to go gonzo off road. I got this info from the Death Valley boards.

NO.

What's the differnece between a rental car and a Jeep?





























There just some place a jeep wont go. Don't believe me ask Iceaxe where he has seen rental cars go.

[erial]

another place where you can pick up topos:

St. George Field Office
345 East Riverside Drive
St. George, Utah 84790
(435) 688-3200
(435) 688-3252 fax
utsgmail@blm.gov
Monday - Friday 7:45 a.m. to 5:00p.m.
Saturday 10:00 a.m. to 3 p.m.

[Kent K25]

Or just get them for free....if you want digital copies for a GPS...

http://www.miscjunk.org/mj/mp_uttopo.html

[slickrocker]

What is the typical winter weather in the following areas at the end of December:

Canyonlands (needles)

If there is snow/ice on slickrock trails, like in The Needles, a pair or crampons would almost be a requirement. There are a number of steep scrambles and canyon areas that will be in the frozen shade til March, watch your step and be careful. Check with the rangers about trail conditions.

[Rob L]

To All: thanks for the reponses. I'll be visiting Escalante too, so the contact there for topo maps is useful, as are those for St George.

Is it likely that the "back road" (not 12) from Escalante to Torrey/Teasdale will be open...or is it high enough above the snow line for it to be usually closed at the end of December? (hence my need for Topo maps).

The

[stefan]

dang. i just wrote a bunch for ya, got distracted by a phone call and somehow closed the browser window. sigh

so, winter can be quite nice, though cold with long nights ... often 10

[brookiekiller]

Is it likely that the "back road" (not 12) from Escalante to Torrey/Teasdale will be open...or is it high enough above the snow line for it to be usually closed at the end of December?

I assume you are talking about the road over Boulder Mtn. - it will most likely be closed unless they have a freaky dry December. I find that Highway 12 is the most scenic unless you prefer forest.

[Rob L]

Airline ticked bought, 4x4 hired...here's hoping for the weather!

Rob

[Rob L]

Or just get them for free....if you want digital copies for a GPS...

http://www.miscjunk.org/mj/mp_uttopo.html

Thanks for the suggestion, Kent. I did look at it (hence the delay in replying...I was not ignoring you, I promise!)

I looked at the options of buying/renting a GPS for the duration of my trip, and it is probably not worthwhile for me. Tha one I have at home would work in it's basic format, but will not accept US downloads. But thanks for the suggestion. I'll bring my compass (I'm used to working with large Mag variation) and get the hard-copy topos.

Rob