South Jordan considering ban on fake guns

[jumar]

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=3465891

South Jordan considering ban on fake guns
June 5th, 2008 @ 8:58am

SOUTH JORDAN, Utah (AP) -- South Jordan city leaders are considering a ban on air guns, BB guns, paintball guns and some firearms replicas.

Police say they've had more than 15 complaints in the last year and a half about fake weapons that were mistakenly thought to be real.

The police department recently responded to a 911 call of a man lying in the bushes with a rifle that turned out to be fake.

Police are asking the City Council to ban certain kinds of weapons and the fakes. The rule would require residents to notify police if they plan to use items listed in the ordinance.

Similar ordinances have already been passed in Salt Lake City, West Jordan, West Valley City and North Salt Lake.

The South Jordan council is expected to discuss the proposal June 17.

Information from: Deseret News

(Copyright 2008 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)

[hank moon]

The police department recently responded to a 911 call of a man lying in the bushes with a rifle that turned out to be fake.

How about consequences for idiotic behaviour?

Also, maybe all "fake" weapons to be made of pink plastic!

[BruteForce]

Gads! I live in South Jordan and routinely chase my 14 year old niece outside with the paint ball gun! I've only shot into a neighbor's yard once (or over it).

On a more serious note, I do think banning the realistic looking toy guns is a good idea, but Airsoft, pellet and paint guns? I've purposely gone on neighborhood watch patrol with a paint gun, intent on plastering vandals (if caught); I figured that or just shoot them with the .40.

[stefan]

On a more serious note, I do think banning the realistic looking toy guns is a good idea, but Airsoft, pellet and paint guns? I've purposely gone on neighborhood watch patrol with a paint gun, intent on plastering vandals (if caught);

where is it legal to shoot such "weapons." never asked before. can i legally shoot a paint gun at a moving vehicle?

you know generally speaking as far as cities go

[BruteForce]

On a more serious note, I do think banning the realistic looking toy guns is a good idea, but Airsoft, pellet and paint guns? I've purposely gone on neighborhood watch patrol with a paint gun, intent on plastering vandals (if caught);

where is it legal to shoot such "weapons." never asked before. can i legally shoot a paint gun at a moving vehicle?

you know generally speaking as far as cities go

Good question. I have also never asked before. I don't recall any ordinances referencing pellet guns, Airsoft or paint. I can't imagine it would be legal to shoot at a moving vehicle, however (much like throwing a rock).

[Gutpiler_Utahn]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but by its legal description, a firearm is any device that launches any type of projectile, whether that projectile be a bullet, arrow/bolt, bb, or even airsoft pellet. TECHNICALLY, you can get yourself into a lot of trouble for shooting one in any populated areas. It depends on the local law enforcement and if they abuse their power. Many will just tell you to put it away, but I've met some who will confiscate it and even issue you a ticket.

Airsoft guns generally come with an orange tip on the barrel to help law enforcement distinguish it from the real deal. As for outlawing replicas, that's just stupid. If somebody is trying to scare people with a replica, then the police should treat the case as if it truly were a real weapon. When the truth is discovered, that person should still be charged as if they were brandishing a live firearm. Stupidity should not be a reason to infringe on my rights. The day this state follows the Republic of Kalifornia is the day I quit my job and move back to Kansas.

[Brian in SLC]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but by its legal description, a firearm is any device that launches any type of projectile, whether that projectile be a bullet, arrow/bolt, bb, or even airsoft pellet.

I don't think that's exactly true. I believe Utah follows the federal definition:

"Firearm. Any weapon, including a starter gun, which will or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive"

Here's the Utah definition:

"9) (a) "Firearm" means a pistol, revolver, shotgun, sawed-off shotgun, rifle or sawed-off rifle, or any device that could be used as a dangerous weapon from which is expelled a projectile by action of an explosive."

Pretty sure its illegal to discharge an air rifle and/or bow/arrow inside the city limits, though.

I think criminals use items which look exactly like firearms so they can't be prosecuted for, say, armed robbery.

I can't imagine folks lining up to register their red ryder BB guns...

-Brian in SLC

[MY T PIMP]

Paintball guns C'mon I used to be a huge paintball enthusiast I bet there is a huge population of paintballers in South Jordan, my next door neighbor is huge into air soft (much cheaper than paint ball). I can see perhaps regulating replica guns, I was just in big 5 and could not believe how real some of the airsoft hand guns look. But paintball you can tell from a good distance most of them hardly resemble firearms.

I will say this I used my peach tree for target practice of my paintball gun, and the damn thing died the next year!

[jumar]

Another article
http://www.abc4.com/news/local/story...8-714e27b0aa8b

South Jordan police considering banning fake guns
Reported by: Jill Atwood
Last Update: 6/05 8:48 pm

SOUTH JORDAN, Utah (ABC 4 News) - The South Jordan Police Department is considering an all-out ban on fake buns, BB guns, airsoft guns, and anything that looks like the real thing.

Officers said there have been too many close calls and they're afraid someone is going to get killed.

Last year a student at Granger High School was seen with a gun in his waistband.

Also last year, Juan Diego High School went into complete lockdown over another gun scare.

Neither incident involved a real gun, but cases like this are prompting South Jordan and other cities to take a hard look at the problem.

However, an all-out ban seems like a knee-jerk reaction to at least one city council member.

Aleta Taylor said, "The truth is, you cannot legislate stupidity. There's no way, so you ban this and then you have to ban something else."

Taylor said she would like to see more education in the community and more specifics in the proposed ban ordinance. She said right now it's too broad and lacks balance.

Police Lieutenant Matt Evans said he agrees the ordinance needs some tweaking, but feels it is necessary to protect the public and police officers.

Evans said, "The ordinance doesn't ban anything. It's simply trying to get people to have these activities in a responsible manner."

Police officers said this ordinance will be open to public comment. The city council will discuss it again on June 17. Salt Lake City, West Valley and West Jordan already have similar ordinances in place.

Aleta Taylor said, "The truth is, you cannot legislate stupidity. There's no way, so you ban this and then you have to ban something else."

[Udink]

Evans said, "The ordinance doesn't ban anything. It's simply trying to get people to have these activities in a responsible manner."

Hmm...I'm not sure what to make of this. The first line in the article states that they're considering an all-out ban on fake guns.

Aleta Taylor said, "The truth is, you cannot legislate stupidity. There's no way, so you ban this and then you have to ban something else."

What's this? A member of city government with some common sense?

[JP]

How about consequences for idiotic behaviour?

Also, maybe all "fake" weapons to be made of pink plastic!

Oh yea, there's consequences for that. It caused some type of inconvience or alarm in a public place. Most, if not all States have something like that in place, it's Breach of Peace here...

Pink Orange is for "fake" guns, but if it's shooting a projectile, it cannot be classified as fake or a toy gun. The "projectile" can cause injury or serious physical injury. Death might be stretch, but cannot be left out. Losing an eye is serious physical injury.

where is it legal to shoot such "weapons." never asked before. can i legally shoot a paint gun at a moving vehicle?

you know generally speaking as far as cities go

Paintball and those AirSoft ones? They have places for such things or get into the woods and have at it like the rest of the Paintball fanatics. Again, if doing this in a public place that will cause someone some type a fear or actually think that they are in danger, you can get into trouble. It comes down to a discretionary thing and or how bad the complainant wants to push an issue.
As far as shooting anything out of a moving vehicle, you're violating some State law. Usually there is a law in place for either something out of a vehicle or at a moving vehicle.
Put it this way, fake gun or not, pointing it out a car window at another motorist...Somebody sees this happening...cops are being called and you'll be stopped by several sets of pretty lights who will not take that complaint with a grain of salt. It won't be funny staring down several loaded weapons pointed at your head. Just some food for thought. At this point, discretion is probably out the window. And later don't be all pissy that they didn't treat you nicely.

[Mooseman70]

Put it this way, fake gun or not, pointing it out a car window at another motorist...Somebody sees this happening...cops are being called and you'll be stopped by several sets of pretty lights who will not take that complaint with a grain of salt. It won't be funny staring down several loaded weapons pointed at your head. Just some food for thought. At this point, discretion is probably out the window. And later don't be all pissy that they didn't treat you nicely.

And the truth shall set you free!

[JP]

And the truth shall set you free!

[Jaxx]

where is it legal to shoot such "weapons."

There are actually alot of paintball fields in slc area. I play at a field in Provo. Not many people know about them though. They are speedball type fields and most people think of paintball as sneaking in the woods.

[Sombeech]

any device that could be used as a dangerous weapon from which is expelled a projectile by action of an explosive

I'm wondering if "explosion" can be defined as a huge mass of air moving at high velocity down the barrel of a BB gun... ?

[JP]

I'm wondering if "explosion" can be defined as a huge mass of air moving at high velocity down the barrel of a BB gun... ?

Yes, a BB Gun can be classified as a weapon, it is in other states. Projectile that can cause injury, serious physical injury or the stretch, death. It is a mass of air, but explosion maybe an other term for the result in contact with a primer, cap, flint lock, etc. But mass of air can be what places BB/Pellet guns into that category as well, by not saying gases.