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Thread: Spry canyon 8/18/07
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08-23-2007, 05:35 PM #21
Tricks are for Kids
Originally Posted by chabidiah
"Best done in spring or fall, or with an early start in summer".
Ummmm, how do I say this politely. Ummmm, wait, which forum am I on? OK, no need. If'n you don't want to make the back of the second edition, you might want to develop some more skills before tackling something substantial like Kolob.
My first reaction to your trip report is: Great Pictures!, lots of water! Looks like you had lots of fun. But you also rapped a couple spots where it is easier to downclimb, took a really long time, and missed a couple of tricks. (Although, admittedly, *tricks* are my forte, and with 10+ trips through Spry, I know ALL the tricks).
So, just some friendly advice. Spry is a nice, easy, half-day canyon. When it is a nice, easy, half-day canyon for you, then you might be up for a full-day canyon like Kolob. I know you already know this, but working your way through the easy stuff to develop your skills is a good idea. Jumping into the bigees because you want them really bad - not a good idea.
Tom
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08-23-2007 05:35 PM # ADS
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08-23-2007, 05:44 PM #22
Trix are for Squids
Originally Posted by Jaxx
Total rap count "usual route" is 10. From the pictures, looks like you rapped two additional places.
Not to say you should not have. You should do what is appropriate for your group, and what is appropriate for your skills and basically any way you want to just because you want to. Free country, all that (though the canyon will cost you a couple bucks).
Tom
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08-23-2007, 07:48 PM #23
Here's hoping we can legally descend kolob sometime soon
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08-23-2007, 10:31 PM #24
Wow, friendly group eh? Whatever...
Stop checking my spelling! I know I suck but I amn't in school anymor, so back off.
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08-23-2007, 10:35 PM #25Stop checking my spelling! I know I suck but I amn't in school anymor, so back off.
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08-23-2007, 10:40 PM #26
beta was good! map reading skills...not so good. plus we thought we spotted the trail head the night before in the dark. thought it would save time in the morning. I guess it was not such a good idea.. live and learn...
Stop checking my spelling! I know I suck but I amn't in school anymor, so back off.
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08-24-2007, 08:01 AM #27
Re: Tricks are for Kids
Originally Posted by ratagonia
But, 9 hours, car to car, with a larger group? That's not terrible. Two extra rappels? Ehhh, I dunno.
When Tom and I (and Mel, our savior that trip on a chilly december day, as he was the only one with any cold water protection: dry suit) did Spry, onsite, so to speak, we were 7 hours car to car with a hiking diversion at the end of the trip. So, really only about 5.5 hours to the last rappel finish. And, was significant ice on the first rappel that took us some time to negotiate. Can't recall exactly how much beta we had, but, I don't think any of us had done it before. We had word-of-mouth beta? Something along those lines. And we rappelled 10 times.
Being climbers, we kinda nailed the approach, but, weren't going to be denied if it got a bit harder either. For most non climbers, 4th class should be hard, especially to down climb. Heck, it is for me usually.
We rappelled 180 feet on the first rappel to avoid ice in the potholes.
Balance of the rappels were all single rope (single 60m). 90 feet the longest.
So, I dunno. How does one decide when one is ready for stepping it up? Kolob isn't that hard a canyon in "easy" conditions (ie, low flow, long day light, no wierd conditions requiring extra effort). Much longer cold water exposure. And, depending on how you exit, a loooong day (or two full days) either way (MIA or the beauty of hiking out the bottom to the Temple of S.).
One thing about Kolob...it'd be much harder in the dark. So, moving slow isn't optimal in that canyon. If you did get benighted, then, you'd just get that much slower, and, because your in the water so much, colder too. Kolob tends to be a canyon where you want to err on the side of caution and stack the deck in your favor. Get a really early start. Move efficiently and quickly. And, try to go as light as possible (ie, trim the overnight gear to the essentials. Maybe leave those three pairs of blue jeans home this trip).
Anyhoo, some thoughts...
-Brian in SLC
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08-24-2007, 08:44 AM #28
Re: Tricks are for Kids
Originally Posted by ratagonia
I should point out that we take our time on purpose through the canyons. Stopping to take pictures, a really long lunch, enjoy the scenery, etc.
Chabadiah is defininetly a better climber than I am. I remember a couple spots that we talked about down climbing but decided to rap because we couldn't spot our wives because of the height or water being at the bottom and floating while spotting doesn't work to well. That doesn't mean that I think I am a good down climber. I need to work on, well everything.
I was told from a little bird that it took you 8 hours to get through the canyon with the group this person was in. I guess a big difference is made by what the group consists of.
I suppose if Chabadiah and I went we could probably do it faster. Me being the one to slow him down, but again I don't like to rush in canyons. I only get to do a few might as well make a day out of it.
All in all we had an awesome trip. I do appreciate your input and criticism, there may be better ways for you to express it but to each his own. I am a big boy I can handle it. I know I need it.
I would love to go through some canyons with you and learn your tricks some day. Actually there are quite a few people on here that I would love to meet in person and learn from them. Most of the people on here to be honest. And if anyone wants to point out a few things we could change then post up or PM me, I would love to hear it.The man thong is wrong.
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08-24-2007, 09:43 AM #29
Re: Tricks are for Kids
Originally Posted by Jaxx
We woke up at about 6 am to some sprinkles so we through all our stuff in the car and pulled a tarp over us and went back to sleep. We were worried about the forecast of 40% chance of rain.
It took us a couple of hours to get breakfast and put all our gear back together and we were at the Spry trailhead at about 10 am.
I couldn't figure out the terrain from my topo map. I am not very good at reading them in the first place but usually I can make sense of it.
We eventually made it back down to our car and started on the right path at 11 AM.
Get an early start the 4th class pitches last for about 2 1/2 hours.
After we found it we noticed a cairn and were happy that we were on the right track.
We ate lunch at the first rap and watched the clouds. We felt good about it so I set up the first "rap" with our two 60 m ropes.
At the bottom of the 9th rap there is a large pothole that is very shallow, like ankle deep. I walked to the end of it and noticed a bunch of rope burns over the side. I could not find any anchors. At first I thought to tie the two 60m ropes we had. I didn't think that would be a good pull though. There is a large chunk of rock that was sticking out on the left side that I could see a rope burn on. I was going to set up some webbing for an anchor there but when I climbed to the top of the ledge on the left I notice there was already an anchor about 15 feet to the south on two trees.
We raced back to the ZAC and made it at about 8:57.
Couple of other comments from looking quickly at some of the pictures.
How much emergency or standard gear do you guys each carry on your harnesses when you're rappelling? I didn't see much. Could you stop in mid rappel and rig for ascent, if need be? Could you anchor in to the next anchor if required? As a standard, I always carry a set of Prusik loops, and several shoulder length slings and a few carabiners on my harness, at the ready, able to grab them with either hand. Also, an extra rap device in the group is a good idear. Anyone have a knife stowed on their person? Also, where was the position of the spare (backup) rope compared to the team position? Always ready to help, or, down first (or second) where its not as deployable in an emergency?
Looked like a great trip. Thanks for opening up for discussion and criticism. Take 'er with a grain of sand(stone) and make it fun.
Cheers!
-Brian in SLC
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08-24-2007, 10:08 AM #30
Thanks Brian.
The late start had us a little worried as well. We planned on waking up at about 6 am but since it was raining with 40% rain in the forcast we weren't to hopefull about doing the canyon that day. We woke up about an hour later and we had blue skies. perfectly clear. I have to admit, I am glad we slept in, since we did Keyhole late the night before and got to sleep around 1 am I was happy to have the extra hour.
We planned on having all our gear ready to get a quick start but since doing keyhole we wanted to dry out everything that we could.
I usually do pretty well with topo maps. When we went in the wrong drain I just had a map of the pine creek area. That is why I couldn't find it on my map. I should have gotten out my big National Geographic map from the start, live and learn. That is why it took us so long on the hike in, I think we should have stayed in the creek bed a little longer, now I know.
The 4th class pitches weren't really a scary problem. We didn't deploy any ropes on the way up, none of us were worried about it. Do people usually tie together or something like that on the way up?
My wife and I always carry 2 prussic loops on us they are hanging on our harnesses. I usually have a sling or two as well but I just had the one on me that I was using to hook to anchors. Chabadiah and his wife had knives on their harnesses. We all had an extra biner or two with us. I usually carry more on me but didn't this time. Because of your recommendation I always will now, plus it looks cooler.
We usually had the second rope (me) in the back, but a few times we did have one rope in front of us while others were rapping. I didn't think about needing a second rope at the top. I was just usually last and Chabadiah used his rope and I had mine on me. We are lucky we didn't need it and I was at the bottom. I will be more aware of that now. Thanks again.The man thong is wrong.
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08-24-2007, 10:20 AM #31Originally Posted by chabidiah
Don't mind the ratagonia...he's done everything in Zion backwards and with his eyes closed....not to mention Heaps + Imlay in less than 24 hours. He's a walking Zion encyclopedia...he gives good advice, but admittedly can come across callous at times. Don't take it personal - we've all borne the brunt of his axe at some point...it's almost like initiation.It's only "science" if it supports the narrative.
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08-24-2007, 01:18 PM #32Originally Posted by rockgremlinLife is Good
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08-24-2007, 10:32 PM #33
Well, at least we didn't get our ropes stuck... could have been worse
Stop checking my spelling! I know I suck but I amn't in school anymor, so back off.
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08-25-2007, 04:44 PM #34
Re: Tricks are for Kids
Originally Posted by Brian in SLC
Our first rap was the same as usual first rap these days, with is 180'. If you rap 165' you are at the other edge of that second pothole.
Was I in a surly mood or what?
Tom
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08-25-2007, 04:51 PM #35Originally Posted by rockgremlin
The main point I was TRYING to make is, Spry is a great canyon, but it is not particularly long or difficult. If'n you worked hard to get through it in 9 hrs car to car, then you need to work on skills and proficiency before stepping up to bigger projects like Kolob.
And thanks, Brian, for taking this poorly prepared noob through Kolob. We had a great time, and I learned a lot (like, a "shortee", even two of them, is not the same as a "wetsuit").
Tom
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01-05-2010, 07:35 AM #36
that is pretty funny because I got Esmacked from Tom on my first post as well. It was a little different because well you can just look it up under "Wayne County Search and Rescue", but I very much appreciate being helped out by the seniors on here! I really look forward to going through some canyons with the veterans of bogley!! Thank you to everyone who posts and helps the noobs get there baring. I really love reading about all of the cool canyons that everyone has done and I really like the criticism that we all get. It is pretty hard to take it sometimes because of that dang male-ego, but I really do appreciate it. THANKS
Murphy's Law: "If anything can go wrong, it will."
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01-05-2010, 07:44 AM #37
I didn't even mention the trip report! Thanks Jaxx that was an awesome TR! I love reading your TRs because they are always so detailed and give you a very good image of what is happening. That sounds like a really good canyon for noobs....... I will have to go in there and take my wife too!!
Murphy's Law: "If anything can go wrong, it will."
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08-29-2011, 11:31 AM #38
worth a read again?
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08-30-2011, 08:57 AM #39
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08-30-2011, 12:18 PM #40
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