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Well, and there is the Balkanization aspect--instead of a consistent BSA climbing training standard, now (at least as interpreted by UNPC), no locally administered training travels, so any volunteer...

Very careful as in probably don't take scouts climbing or in a canyon at all.

A small update to this conversation:

In a conversation with Debbie Spoons of UNPC yesterday, she stated very clearly that the guidelines in Climb on Safely apply only to unit activities, not...

That flake he nails is like the finger of God reaching out and saying "base jumping is stupid".

Hope he has a full recovery.

Have you met the human race?

Not to mention the troops that just fail to go to camp at all...

I get what you're saying, sombeech, but at some point if the training isn't there and they aren't implementing the programs as designed (with necessary adaptation of course), it isn't scouting, it's...

A big problem with LDS BSA is that the only required training is Youth Protection. It would be safe to bet these guys had no training whatsoever and were just making it up as they went along because...

Ironically, the Utah National Parks Council was offering a 16-hour Leave No Trace training course just this past weekend.

This certainly doesn't help the perception of LDS-sponsored BSA troops...

"Adventure is a sign of incompetence." -Vilhjalmur Stefansson, a polar explorer who actually lived to a ripe old age.