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Just a heads up.... KSL will have a rappelling accident in Zion on tonight. I saw the teaser and it looked like the final rap in Pine Creek.... big ass fall....
"Alex Cabrero: A guy rappelling in Zion NP fell 100 feet to the ground, but WALKED AWAY! His buddy got video of it. We'll show it on KSL 5 News at 10. ..."
:popcorn:
I just watched. WTF?
i just saw it..... I hope my mom didn't. she's still conviced that canyoneering is a sin. :lol8:
Man survives 100-foot fall, catches it on tape
June 18, 2009
LEHI -- A Lehi man fell more than 100 feet while rappelling at Zion National Park and walked away with barely any injuries.
Eric Schriever is experienced at rappelling, and admits he made some mistakes, but still can't believe he's alive to talk about it -- not to mention the fact that his friend videotaped the entire fall.
Some say being in Zion National Park is like being closer to a higher power, and Schriever isn't going to argue. "I know there's a God, because there is no other way that I should've come out of there. I was protected," he said.
He and his buddy were getting ready for a 300-foot rappel in the park this past Tuesday. Schriever went first while his buddy videotaped him. Right away, though, both knew something was wrong.
"I lose control and stop midway because there was a knot in the rope. So that saved me from falling even further," Schriever explained while watching the video.
But once he untied the knot, he couldn't stop. Schriever fell more than 100 feet, banging hard against the rock wall before dropping to the rocks below.
"I remember the first hit on my head, and it wasn't until I watched the video that I realized I hit at least two more times on the way down," he said.
In that split second, all Schriever could think of was his wife, two daughters and his unborn son, who is due in just two weeks. "I was like,
The friend: Hey, you ok? :popcorn:
Anyone know this guy? I'd really like to know what he meant by didn't use the right gear and rope.
Helmet? Check
Harness? Check
Rigging enough friction? NOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooo..........
Wrong rope...WTF?
Looks like he cleared a tangle and had basically let go of his brake hand...I think the "wrong rope" and "not wrapping the safety line enough times" is a load of BS to save face that he fu**ed up and let go of the brake hand.
The lord is my brake hand and he has a plan for me. :2thumbs:Quote:
Originally Posted by nonot
Let's see:Quote:
Originally Posted by Don
- 300' rappel. You start down and lose control...
- A Miracle - there's a knot in the rope which stops you from going to the bottom - praise the Lord!
- OK, now I'm ready to shake the knot out and continue out of control to the bottom.....
oops.
T
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=6867912
No helmet, no gloves, and a knot in the rope
rap his safety line around his rope? what does that mean?
maybe people should pay more attention to what they are doing.. :ne_nau:
O! O! I know this one... my total time rappelling is 3 hours, so don't take my word for it. :lol8:Quote:
Originally Posted by denaliguide
what is: a small rope that raps around the rappelling rope and hooks into the leg loop so if for some stupid reason you take your brake hand off the rope the safty line will hold it down and keep the break on....
Are you and expert rappeller?
No but i did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night
:roflol:
ah yes, the prussik. that must be what they were refering too.Quote:
Originally Posted by theking648
That is one lucky guy. Can you say GLOVES!!!!!
No gloves rope burns, $14.99 on Mastercard. PRICELESS.
Glad he is ok.
Mark
Or-----Quote:
Originally Posted by moab mark
He could get some training and learn how to rappel correctly as to not heat your hand. I've done Englestead twice and never required a glove, and my hand never got hot. Now that's PRICELESS.
So knowing when to use a 8mm rope.
knowing when to use an auto-bloc, more importantly--HOW(rarely).
knowing how to lock off on rappel.
knowing how to adjust friction on a 300' rappel.(especially 8mm)
getting over your head on canyon selection--priceless
I'm sure all the bogleyfesters know about all these techniques(and more) as they head into Englestead. :nod:
It's all fun and games until someone DIES.
I wondered how long it would take for you to respond.No matter how much training something can always go wrong. When it does ill take cowhide over flesh.
He's a lucky dude.
Gloves may have prevented the blisters on his fingers, but unlikely they would have stopped him from falling. Key point is he should have rigged more friction for such a long rappel on 8mm rope.Quote:
Originally Posted by moab mark
Autoblock = false sense of security.
I really don't have a problem with gloves, the problem is mis-use of gloves.
If you already know how to properly control and change friction on rappel and just want a glove to protect your dishwashing softened hands--that's o.k.
If you want to use a glove as a mask, to hide the fact you don't know how to adjust proper friction, that will result in eventual problems.
just sayin' :ne_nau:
he did not do a good job of hiding...Quote:
Originally Posted by oldno7
T
Quote:
Originally Posted by ratagonia
Seems kinda obvious from the video, huh. :eek2:
I dunno. From this picture, almost looks thicker than 8mm? I'm comparing the width of the rope to the width of his thumb...Quote:
Originally Posted by rcwild
http://media.bonnint.net/slc/1216/121614/12161487.jpg
I think an autoblock, properly deployed, can be pretty useful.
http://mtncommunity.org/dc/user_files/1803.jpg
One of my main climbing partners (see above) uses one all the time. He can stop and start on a rappel on a dime, with no effort. Of course, its usually on double ropes...
Couple of comments...I can't imagine dropping into Englestead on a single 8mm rope, on a single ATC, and not rigging for additional friction. The very idear is frightening. Glove or not (I didn't use a glove on that or any of the times I've done Heaps). Two ATCs, one above the other: smooth as silk.
Knot in the rope? I can't imagine deploying rope for a long rappel like that and having a knot in the rope. Should be carefully lowering the rope, or, using a rope bag? Yikes. It can be pretty darn scary to stop on a super steep rappel to untangle a rope...
Ain't no miracle. Had enough friction from the ATC on the rope to slow him down enough, but, that video is painful to watch.
Take care out there you canyoneering rappellers!
-Brian in SLC
Your EXPERIENCED partner. My issue is with autoblocks being sold to beginners as a panacea. Emphasis should be on rigging for the correct amount of friction. I am seeing people getting slopping with their friction because they "know" their autoblock will save them if they get it wrong. Nervous beginners are unlikely to let their autoblocks lock up. Instinct says to grab the rope tighter when you lose control.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian in SLC
Knot? Or birds nest form a sloppy throw? Either way, sounds like it was the knot that stopped him ?? He should have locked off above the knot/nest to untie/untangle. Would have given him an opportunity to fix his autoblock -- more wraps, tighter wraps, whatever.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian in SLC
Absolutely. And, he's got his system super dialed. Learned from a long time guide in the French alps (also a fairly well known Petzl guy)...Quote:
Originally Posted by rcwild
He was oughta control, hit the knot/tangle, stopped, undid the knot, and went out of control again? Wow.Quote:
Originally Posted by rcwild
I think for most folks, if they've blown their friction, and their autoblock isn't working, they won't be able to "fix" most anything on a really steep rappel, especially on a skinny single rope.
Go for the body wrap around! Get your friction on...
Makes my hands sweaty thinkin' about it...
Cheers, Rich!
-Brian in SLC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian in SLC
Wonder why he thought he would have more control after the knot than he had above it?
Cheers!
Philosophic aside: this is always true about everything, even life itself.Quote:
Originally Posted by oldno7
So if next weekend there happens to be a couple of bogleyites get killed it's o.k.?Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Barron
And "maybe" it could have been prevented, with a little training, but no need to mention it. It was just their time. c'est la vie................
:roll: I think Richard is just pointing out there is danger in everything we do.....
At some point in life people have to cut the apron strings and actually experiance the adventure.
I don't think there is a soul on this forum who considers training a bad thing..... but sooner or later you have to get off the porch and run with the big dogs..... or you could visit Disneyland instead....
:popcorn:
And I'm not disputing that........Quote:
Originally Posted by Iceaxe
It's all about calculating risk vs, unnecessary risk.
Do we toss the keys to our kids when they're 16 and say, have a great night out on State street. Or do they go through a drivers ed program and learn about what they are doing, then casually sneak down to State street?
I'll be done, sorry for the break in fun.
Think I'll head to disneyland next weekend :mrgreen:
Bad example.... drivers ed in the US is probably the biggest joke I know of.....Quote:
Originally Posted by oldno7
There is no way in hell my kids are getting the keys to the car until after they have been through a real driving school and completed both a Highway Safety and High Proformace class.... but after the class I'll turn them loose....
FWIW: Miller Motorspors Park teaches them in Salt Lake and Las Vegas Motor Speedway teaches them in Vegas.
:cool2:
My job is done here............ :haha:Quote:
Originally Posted by Iceaxe
I'm going to be in Englestead next Friday for Bogleyfest. We've already done some planning and training for this canyon but we've gone over our plan again this morning because of this.
We'll still do the canyon but it sure gets a person thinking...
And what is your plan???Quote:
Originally Posted by Don
I have 2 - 300' 9mm ropes which you can use. I plan on using them.
Tom
Oh, no, not the dreaded, don't say it, double rope rappel?Quote:
Originally Posted by ratagonia
Pad that edge well would be a decent start...
Ha ha.
-Brian in SLC
That is so NOT what I meant.Quote:
Originally Posted by oldno7
Sorry I even joined the conversation.
Not having the 300' rope we were going to stage it. Are your ropes available next Friday? Let me talk to Josh but we might take you up on that...Quote:
Originally Posted by ratagonia
Staging Englestead is not that big of deal. For a number a reasons I prefer to stage this start over the 300' direct entry....Quote:
Originally Posted by Don
:cool2:
While getting down 2-9mm static ropes would be a worthy challenge, no... I set two ropes up side by side, and two people can rappel at the same time. Helps to do this at the head of the watercourse, because there is no loose rock there (thus allowing a simultaneous rappel). Also, the 'rescue' line is already set up, if someone should get stuck.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian in SLC
Tom
First time could be an accident, second time proves the guy is not the brightest bulb on the shelf.
Someone said it best.
He got out of control and began falling to his death. By some miracle he got stopped halfway. So what does this dimwit decide to do...free the rope with no hesitation and try the second time to kill himself?
Miracle he survived...some divine power? Not really...just shows at least his rappelling device was rigged properly. I've always wondered how fast you would go if you just let go of the rope. Now I know and it doesn't look like there's too much to be scared of as long as you have a helmet...which after looking at the video again, he didn't.
Did anyone else notice his burns are on the tips of his fingers...if I was falling and grabbing onto the rope I damn well would have my palms scarred for life. (Edit: he was wearing fingerless gloves, so this last statement is not applicable)
Hmmm...Quote:
Originally Posted by nonot
Pretty common, when grabbing for rope, that the fingers take the brunt of it.
http://mtncommunity.org/dc/user_files/1804.jpg
Folk who were at the rondy on Crete might remember the above...
-Brian in SLC
This accident has me stumped. Could the camera have played a role in this? Trying to look cool and fast from the top? I gotta tell you I hope I would have had the good sense that IF I were to have lost control and by chance a knot has stuck me, I hope I would have tied off, screamed for help like a girl or something other than lose it again. Also, with the weight of the rope, I have never been able to go fast or anywhere near fast at the start of that rap. :ne_nau: It is the bottom 100 feet that needs my attention on that rap and the Heaps final rap.