2008 Zion Noobfest June 6-9 - See 1st post for info summary

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Originally Posted by Iceaxe

You don't need a permit for Boundary or Eye. neither route contains any technical skills inside park boundaries.

You can also easily do Eye or Boundary at a much higher flow.... 30 cfs is not a problem.

Rock, let us know your plans ASAP so we can adjust the lists... also... it might be nice if you guys grabbed a strong hiking noob to join you... nothing like teaching a noob to carry the rope. :haha:

:cool2:

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Oops! :oops: The way it reads according to the Park is: No permit required for Oak or Boundary if exiting MIA since they are not in the park.

Permits required for Kolob Creek upper section. Water less than 5cfs above oak creek; less than 10cfs between oak creek and MIA; less than 15cfs below MIA. Not sure what this all works out to, but the way it reads.

So in conclusion....Boundary or Eye of the Needle "aka'Oak Creek" are a go....just hoping that they (WCWCD) don't start releasing massive amounts of water! :nod: and that the exit is done at MIA?

Sorry for my mis-information in previous post. :ne_nau:

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Originally Posted by intellectualdesperado

I'm going to do the subway with utahadventureguide. I would love to help out or just hit some canyons with the non-noobs.

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Very Good! This will be a blast!

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Originally Posted by Bo_Beck

So in conclusion....Boundary or Eye of the Needle "aka'Oak Creek" are a go....just hoping that they (WCWCD) don't start releasing massive amounts of water! :nod: and that the exit is done at MIA?

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Hmmm. You might keep an eyeball on that snowpack level in there. Still showing 20" of snow at Lava Point. And, when Tom and I did Oak Creek in 2001, on 26 May, was still wall to wall snow at one point in the canyon. On a much bigger snow year, hard to say, but, my bet is that you might still see a bit of snow in there.

Also, careful on the flow due to snow melt, too. Brrrr...

Cheers,

-Brian in SLC

I thought eye has access issues. Has it changed?

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Originally Posted by Brian in SLC

Hmmm. You might keep an eyeball on that snowpack level in there. Still showing 20" of snow at Lava Point. And, when Tom and I did Oak Creek in 2001, on 26 May, was still wall to wall snow at one point in the canyon. On a much bigger snow year, hard to say, but, my bet is that you might still see a bit of snow in there.

Also, careful on the flow due to snow melt, too. Brrrr...

Cheers,

-Brian in SLC

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Yeah...I'm startin to see the writing on the wall. Maybe we can work somethin out for a friendlier (ie less snowpacked) route?

I wouldn't mind giving up my spot on Sunday and doing something a little harder or new to me.

Utahadventureguide and Porter (whatever his name is on here) told me to come here and say I'm coming along with them.

Don't know what I'm doing, but I'd be up for imlay or heaps sometime. (Not the full imlay, but the sneek-and-peak)

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Originally Posted by tanya

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Originally Posted by DiscGo

If there is space for me, I would love to come. I also have a friend who I believe would want to come with me if possible.

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You and your friend are on the list for Saturday so far. If a break-away group forms for Sunday that will open up spots for you on that day. Stay tuned.

You said you will be camping. Are you going to stay with everyone at Smith's Mesa? So far no one is camping anywhere else that I know of.

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Yeah, I think I will try and camp at Smith's Mesa just to try and be close to people. I can't tell you guys how excited I am for this trip. Thank you so much for all the work you have done putting this together guys.

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Originally Posted by rockgremlin

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Originally Posted by Iceaxe

You don't need a permit for Boundary or Eye. neither route contains any technical skills inside park boundaries.

You can also easily do Eye or Boundary at a much higher flow.... 30 cfs is not a problem.

Rock, let us know your plans ASAP so we can adjust the lists... also... it might be nice if you guys grabbed a strong hiking noob to join you... nothing like teaching a noob to carry the rope. :haha:

:cool2:

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Yeah, I suggested taking a competant n00b or two along with us, which I think is a great idea. Christian has yet to comment on that idea. So - if you're a n00b, and have a few toughies under your belt, and have rolled through at least 8-10 canyons within the last year or two, sign on up! First come, first served. Limit two (for now).

A small disclaimer: Be ready to carry rope, hike for long distances, and not be afraid of big rappels. Ownership of your own gear definitely a plus!

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I'm fine with noobs joining as long as they are semi experienced and are okay with the criteria established by Justin. I just don't want the group to get too large.

I'll be up there on the kolob terrace for Memorial weekend so i'll check out the snow levels and the flow, see if i can get to a vantage point that may offer a view of possible snow pack at the bottom. I'm open to suggestion for those coming on Saturday if they have something beefier that they really want to hit.

I think i've got the GPS coord for the usual camping spot at smith mesa. I'll put something together for the location and put it up this weekend.

Getting excited.

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Originally Posted by Bo_Beck

Oops! :oops: The way it reads according to the Park is: No permit required for Oak or Boundary if exiting MIA since they are not in the park.

Permits required for Kolob Creek upper section. Water less than 5cfs above oak creek; less than 10cfs between oak creek and MIA; less than 15cfs below MIA. Not sure what this all works out to, but the way it reads.

So in conclusion....Boundary or Eye of the Needle "aka'Oak Creek" are a go....just hoping that they (WCWCD) don't start releasing massive amounts of water! :nod: and that the exit is done at MIA?

Sorry for my mis-information in previous post. :ne_nau:

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WCWCD won't be releasing water unless the dam is full at that point (unlikely, but possible). Check flow at the Kolob Terrace Road.

Access to Oak Creek is OK - but PLEASE!!!! be very low key. You can park on the road back a 1/4 mile from the no-trespassing GATE and head down the hill into the drainage. No "No Tresspassing" signs seen or passed - perfectly legal. Park well off the road, be ready to go, make very little sound, leave the car quickly.

Word on the street is that Lava Point and Oak Creek will not be open that early. People are expecting it to still be snowed in.

Unfortunately, I am otherwise committed that weekend.

(Buckethead Rules!) Can we get a Buckethead Emoticon?? :rockon:

Tom

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Originally Posted by ratagonia

Access to Oak Creek is OK - but PLEASE!!!! be very low key.

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It's not trespassing if no one sees you....

:lol8:

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Originally Posted by tanya

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Originally Posted by rockgremlin

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Originally Posted by Brian in SLC

Hmmm. You might keep an eyeball on that snowpack level in there. Still showing 20" of snow at Lava Point. And, when Tom and I did Oak Creek in 2001, on 26 May, was still wall to wall snow at one point in the canyon. On a much bigger snow year, hard to say, but, my bet is that you might still see a bit of snow in there.

Also, careful on the flow due to snow melt, too. Brrrr...

Cheers,

-Brian in SLC

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Yeah...I'm startin to see the writing on the wall. Maybe we can work somethin out for a friendlier (ie less snowpacked) route?

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Courtney is interested in doing a harder canyon during the fest as well. Hopefully he will post his ideas. Maybe you guys could all get together and talk. Someone doing one on Sunday would really help out so more N00bs can do the easier canyons, but as Shane says, without taking all the talent. :haha: It looks like we have talent galore on this trip though!

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Sorry for my ignorance about what's going on. I haven't been following the thread.

Anyway, if Eye or Boundary are still on for that Saturday, myself and DB are interested. Or if something else cool is planned, ditto.

As for Sunday, I could dig Englestead or perhaps something like Hidden Canyon from the top. I've done neither but want to do both.

I'm hearing mixed opinions on Corral Hollow. Any good? Questionable in early June?

CP

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Originally Posted by cp0915

Anyway, if Eye or Boundary are still on for that Saturday, myself and DB are interested. Or if something else cool is planned, ditto.

As for Sunday, I could dig Englestead or perhaps something like Hidden Canyon from the top. I've done neither but want to do both.

I'm hearing mixed opinions on Corral Hollow. Any good? Questionable in early June?

CP

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Might not be a bad idea to make two breakaway groups for Saturday -- as long as each group is willing to run with a few intermediate n00bs. The two groups could run staggered in the same canyon, or run two different canyons.

Something to think about, now that there is more and more interest in the more technical canyons. It appears that breakaway group #1 is at capacity, but why not start up a second?

I'd like to get on that list for a break away group for Sunday. I'd consider myself an intermediate canyoneer, I have descended about 20 technical canyons and should be able to keep up.

I can also help out with noobs wherever needed on Saturday.

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Originally Posted by DiscGo

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Originally Posted by tanya

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Originally Posted by DiscGo

If there is space for me, I would love to come. I also have a friend who I believe would want to come with me if possible.

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You and your friend are on the list for Saturday so far. If a break-away group forms for Sunday that will open up spots for you on that day. Stay tuned.

You said you will be camping. Are you going to stay with everyone at Smith's Mesa? So far no one is camping anywhere else that I know of.

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Yeah, I think I will try and camp at Smith's Mesa just to try and be close to people. I can't tell you guys how excited I am for this trip. Thank you so much for all the work you have done putting this together guys.

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DiscGo, you made the list for Sunday now and your friend is at the top of the Sunday waiting list.

SLCmntjunkie you are on the list to go with CP on Sunday!

Tanya - thanks for doing such a great job organizing these groups!! You're awesome!! :2thumbs:

Granted they're not particularly challenging canyons, but given the uncertainty of when certain ones will be in condition, I thought I'd throw out these suggestions for Saturday/Sunday:

-Saturday: Telephone Cyn (with a possible link-up of Behunin Cyn)

Isn't the Telephone Canyon trail closed? The online system shows permits available. I haven't used the online system before, so I'm not very familiar with its in's and out's.

-Sunday: Hidden Cyn from the top.

I haven't done Hidden, but I've done Telephone. It's a fine canyon of about 14-15 nice rappels and some fun downclimbs. Nothing too burly. 3BIII, as I recall.

CP

Hey, glasscutter wants in on the waiting list....

awesome!!!!! I am so excited!

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Originally Posted by Sombeech

Hey, glasscutter wants in on the waiting list....

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Glasscutter should ask for himself and keep his hands to himself around the ladies too. :lol8: