Outdoor Retailer Show Boycott in Utah

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This site does have a strange anti-environment stance considering how we all like to recreate.

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I agree. With the retention of public lands issue, we should be on the same side here. It seems that one ones on Bogley that aren't are ignoring the rhetoric for their own politicians mouths and websites or just think that losing any access isn't a real threat

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I have spent enough time back east, where there is little public land, to not want that here.

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I agree. The solution seems simple enough. Those who like public lands can live from the Rockies and westward and those who don't like public land can live east of the Rockies, then we can drop this bull****. It seems perfectly reasonable to me.

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Originally Posted by uintafly

This site does have a strange anti-environment stance considering how we all like to recreate. I have spent enough time back east, where there is little public land, to not want that here. The easy and cheap access we have to a million different outdoor activities is what makes the west what it is. Are we ever going to see a drilling rig on Delicate Arch? No, but we very well may see one on the Kolob Terrace road soon. But I am personally more worried about locked gates and "No Trespassing" signs anyway.

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I don't know of anyone on this site that believes public land should be sold off into private hands. That rethoric is used by the left to attack those who would like to see the state have more say in how the land is used.

Something else to consider is while this is an outdoor forum it has a much broader reach then most outdoor forums in that we try to be more inclusive than most forums and also welcome the off road, mountain bike, fishing and hunting crowd among others. This forum does have a great cross section of those who use the Utah backcountry. Most outdoor forums are very sport specific and narrowly focused.

My personal experience is that often times a drilling rig is preferred over the Subaru crowd because after a couple years the drilling rig goes home and things return pretty much to normal, but once the Subaru crowd shows up things are never the same.

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Originally Posted by Brian in SLC

Funny...not even the conservative news folks got even close. But our own amazing Kreskin pulled a rabbit out of his hat. Bravo. Now...

If you could...let us know when the stock market is going to crash...that'd be super helpful.

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Actually a good number of people on Fox among others correctly predicted the election, Sean Hannity being one. Really a lot of people outside the liberal mainstream correctly predicted the election. The biggest problem with the left is they were living in a echo chamber.

As for the stock market pull your money out November 1, 2024. Trust me on this one.

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I don't know of anyone on this site that believes public land should be sold off into private hands. That rethoric is used by the left to attack those who would like to see the state have more say in how the land is used.

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Shane, the rhetoric is on the GOP websites. It's right here (among other places):

http://www.republicanviews.org/repub...e-environment/

Exact cut and paste, with some parts bolded:

They also believe that the large government land holdings in the west may be better used for ranching, mining, or forestry through private ownership. Republicans would also like to see all lands managed by the U.S. Forest Service available for harvesting, as timber is both a renewable resource and a source that can provide America with jobs.

Notice that it says all lands current managed by the Forest Service (including wilderness), not just "many lands", or "more of the land". The word all is pretty clear.


http://www.bogley.com/forum/attachme...3&d=1485535613

You (and Sombeech) seem to be ignoring this and just calling it "left rhetoric". The above is not from the left.

As far as State lands go, Utah has done an OK job of keeping state lands open to the public. Where I live though, there is quite a bit of state land. Most of it is closed to the public and the rest that does have seasonal public access is closed to the public for most of the year.

Even if Utah doesn't support selling off all the public lands if they were given to the State, I don't believe that they wouldn't sell of any of them.

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Originally Posted by Iceaxe

Actually a good number of people on Fox among others correctly predicted the election, Sean Hannity being one. Really a lot of people outside the liberal mainstream correctly predicted the election. The biggest problem with the left is they were living in a echo chamber.

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Nope. Fox news totally got it wrong. I printed out their predictions on election day. They were as far off as any of the blamestream liberal media.

I couldn't find a single media outlet on the conservative side that predicted a Trump win. I printed out 12 to follow during election night, trying to get a spread of liberal and conservative.

Hannity totally blew 2012. So did Rove. And Limbaugh. Etc.

Funny...Hannity predicted Trumps win would be a landslide based on Facebook "likes". Wasn't exactly a landslide, and, he was soundly beat in the popular vote. Hannity also predicted that Ryan wouldn't be speaker of the house past January, but...

A "good number" of people on Fox? Not really. Rove? Nope. Name one person from Fox besides Hannity.

What's funny is that Michael Moore also predicted a Trump win...the Rust Belt Brexit.

I watched the returns and channel surfed through the Fox coverage. No one thought Trump was going to win especially before 10pm. From the Fox coverage:

“We all thought it was going to be a fairly early night,” MacCallum said, citing the polls that consistently gave the edge to Clinton. But around 10 p.m. ET, when the raw vote totals confirmed razor-tight races in key battleground states like Pennsylvania, Ohio and Florida, the atmosphere changed for MacCallum and those manning Fox News’ Decision Desk. As much as they were under pressure to report new numbers and predictions for states, MacCallum and her team had to hit the brakes to make sense of it all.
“It got very quiet very quickly,” MacCallum said. “Everybody was just staring at their computers. Everybody slowed down a beat and we all said, ‘Something’s turning here.’ ”

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Originally Posted by Scott P

Shane, the rhetoric is on the GOP websites. It's right here (among other places):

http://www.republicanviews.org/repub...e-environment/

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I said nothing about the GOP with regards to private land. I said members of this forum. You are mixing the two. Both parties have things I really like and things I strongly oppose. Unfortunately the two party system really forces us to pick the lesser of two evils with regards to our personal values.

Could you guys help me understand why I am anti environment? I mean, name calling is fun and all, but I'd like to know why you think I am against the environment and that I hate nature. It's not some oddball accusation either, it's been repeated in this thread by multiple people.

If you can't answer this question without an internet search and a long ass boring article, don't bother. It shouldn't be difficult to explain your accusation of me. Why do I hate the outdoors environment?

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Originally Posted by Sombeech

Could you guys help me understand why I am anti environment? I mean, name calling is fun and all, but I'd like to know why you think I am against the environment and that I hate nature. It's not some oddball accusation either, it's been repeated in this thread by multiple people.

If you can't answer this question without an internet search and a long ass boring article, don't bother. It shouldn't be difficult to explain your accusation of me. Why do I hate the outdoors environment?

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Because of your rhetoric. You either play the poor conservative victim card or rail against the "liberals". You seem to have a stance very against people who are trying to protect your public land and access to same. And you couch your rhetoric in terms that are "anti". Very "us versus them".

That's what I don't get...we (all of us) have a LOT more in common with regard to public land that we don't. Its politics that drive a wedge between us. I could totally get behind a conservative republican politician who supported federal land here in Utah for public use. But...there aren't any. In fact, they lobby against it.

"Conservative" politics sure doesn't have anything to do with "conservation". What's being "conserved"? Not public access.

You hate the outdoors because you hate the people trying to preserve your access to it and trying to preserve your quality of life with regard to it.

Hard to get my head around.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94bdMSCdw20

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Originally Posted by Brian in SLC

You hate the outdoors because you hate the people trying to preserve your access to it and trying to preserve your quality of life with regard to it.

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Do I?

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Originally Posted by Sombeech

Could you guys help me understand why I am anti environment? I mean, name calling is fun and all, but I'd like to know why you think I am against the environment and that I hate nature. It's not some oddball accusation either, it's been repeated in this thread by multiple people.

If you can't answer this question without an internet search and a long ass boring article, don't bother. It shouldn't be difficult to explain your accusation of me. Why do I hate the outdoors environment?

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Hard to say really. Maybe you weren't exposed to nature much as a child???? :haha:

But in all seriousness what Brian said.

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I said nothing about the GOP with regards to private land.

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That's the problem. You seem to be ignoring the issue and only bringing up the left. We should be on the same side on this topic.

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Both parties have things I really like and things I strongly oppose.

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I agree and feel the same way, even if we disagree on several issues. For the record, I never thought that you always sided 100% with one political party or another. I have heard you side with both political parties. Correct me if wrong, but you seem to side with the left on most social issues and with the right on fiscal issues and gun control.

That said though, conservatives (I'm not referring to anyone specifically, but in general) who don't fully side the GOP stance on public lands or the environment (even if it is just a minority of the issues disagreed on) need to start speaking out more, rather than just siding with their party 100% of the time.

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Unfortunately the two party system really forces us to pick the lesser of two evils with regards to our personal values.

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I agree with you 100%. I hate the two party issues and only getting to choose between on extremist on either side in the elections.

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Why do I hate the outdoors environment?

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Excellent question 'Beech. Do tell us. Why you you hate the outdoors environment? :haha:

It looks like some of you guys are getting really angry, I would suggest stepping away from the keyboard for a bit, take a walk, come back and have a conversation without calling anybody names. It would help if you don't jump to conclusions, by assuming I agree with the GOP, and also assuming that I hate liberals, or that I actually hate anybody at all. I'm asking objective questions in response to accusations, and that pisses some people off.

Try some breathing exercises.

Maybe you're all correct, I don't get outdoors much. Only twice a week.

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Originally Posted by Scott P

I agree and feel the same way, even if we disagree on several issues. For the record, I never thought that you always sided 100% with one political party or another. I have heard you side with both political parties. Correct me if wrong, but you seem to side with the left on most social issues and with the right on fiscal issues and gun control.

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You have my political view's figured out. I consider myself slightly right of center. I have always believed Democrats understand people and Republicans understand money. As for gun control I consider myself a Constitutionalist, which means I believe your rights are guaranteed in the Constitution and Bill of Rights as written. That means the complete Constitution and Bill of Rights, not just the parts you agree with, which is something I find odd about the left.

If Democrats would stop their attack on the 2nd amendment they would be way ahead, while Republicans need to stay out of our bedrooms and let women decide health issues for themselves.

FWIW - I really feel that Democrats lost the last election on gun control. "PA, WI, MI" are all big hunting and firearm states. Yes, there were lots of other issues, but the 2nd Amendment cost Hillary the election. The interesting part is Bill warned Hillary to steer clear of the gun control issue as it cost Bill both houses during his 2nd term. That was the first time Republican's had controlled both houses since the 1950's.

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It looks like some of you guys are getting really angry, I would suggest stepping away from the keyboard for a bit, take a walk, come back and have a conversation without calling anybody names.

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For the record, I was just messing with you with my last comment. I don't think that you hate the outdoor environment.

As far as calling names, when you look through the threads (especially the presidential one), it is the Trump supporters who have done most of the name calling (by a huge margin).

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(Lest anyone misunderstand, the below is all written with a very friendly tone):

Anyway, what I really want to know is where Accadacca stands in all this? I actually don't know where he stands on most of these issues, but he is the one that starts these threads. After starting them though, he participates very little in them. He just kicks back and watches the carnage. I know he is the (partial?) owner of this website, but he is also by far and away the most successful troll that I know of.

It is actually Accadacca who should be on the very top of this pyramid. Well played sir; well played.

http://i.imgur.com/0EetHAM.png

Do either of you even know my opinion of the Public Land issue? I was making a point of how stupid it is for the retailers to threaten boycott if the GOP didn't change their tactics. Whether the Utah politicians are right or wrong, it is still a stupid reason to boycott the Outdoor Retailer show.

If you want to get more people involved in the Outdoors, and to recruit folks to your side of things, then this is actually the most important time to attend the Outdoor Retailer show, so you can make more contacts, get them more involved with the outdoors / environment, and then those masses of people can help sway the politics your way.

Hence, boycotting the show because you don't like the local politics, is absolutely asinine and childish. It's a missed opportunity. If they want to have a chance of success, they need to put on their big boy pants, dry their Election Night tears, and try to increase the local interest in outdoor recreation by showing the new and exciting outdoor gear they have to offer.

And yet, do you know my opinion of the Public Lands policies? Nah, but jumping to conclusions can be fun. Just keep up the name calling and accusations because that will make me agree with your opinion.


@Scott P I know you're joking, we're good, I don't take these things that hard. Just a note about the President Election thread though, when the Hillary voters started explaining how they don't feel safe anymore, that they were scared and feared for their safety, I thought it was "Opposite Day" when it was the Trump voters who had to protect themselves from physical violence. We were all led to believe that all of the women were going to get fired from their jobs so they could stay home and cook dinner, and the Oil Refineries were going to start dumping their hazardous waste into the street gutters like Cousin Eddy. The media coverage on these items, showing how the country has just gone back in time 50 years, has been very sparse. Maybe it's all been on Cable networks that aren't in my home package.

Anyways, I'm not counter attacking anybody, I just need it to be known that nobody knows where I stand on this, but it is still a childish decision to boycott an opportunity to increase their potential customer base, and also political opinion persuasion.

I might have to increase my outdoor recreation schedule from 2 days a week to 3, as it sounds like I am out of touch with the outdoors.

The term "hate" is a very strong term, laden with implications. In my mind, to accuse someone of hating something you need to bring a mountain of very compelling evidence. In Beech's case, I have not seen hard, damning evidence that would persuade me to think that he hates the outdoors. Pretty close to the opposite in my eyes. He's partial owner of this site, gets out and mountain bikes a ton, hikes a lot, flies his drone around, etc, etc.

So we're gonna crucify him because of some flippant comments he may have made on this site? Where do these personal attacks come from?

In the real world, almost everybody's opinions are varying shades of grey. Why the need to polarize everyone by claiming they have to either love or hate?

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I just need it to be known that nobody knows where I stand on this

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You could tell us. Seriously, where do you stand on the issues concerning the GOP and public lands?

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it is still a childish decision to boycott an opportunity to increase their potential customer base, and also political opinion persuasion.

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Wasn't it Shane who once said that the Outdoor Retailer Show and threat of boycott has done more for environmental causes than any environmental group? They did get an audience with the governor. How sad that they couldn't get one before the threat of boycott.

Concerning the retail show, a lot of people who advocate protection of public lands would like to see the show follow through and just leave Utah. If they did though, they would lose any leverage that they have in the State. I find it extremely sad that money always talks and all other issues be damned.

While the Retail Show does bring millions to the State of Utah, it won't compete with other higher dollar industries.

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Just a note about the President Election thread though, when the Hillary voters started explaining how...

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Both sides (sadly) use the same fear tactics. Remember when Obama was going to be the anti Christ who will take away everyone's guns? How Obama was a Muslim who will force Sharia Law on the United States; and whom would destroy America? Or how about Obama was going to instigate martial law so he could overturn the Constitution? I'm sure similar things would have been said if Hillary were elected. There is no difference.

I was speaking of Bogley specifically. There was definitely a lot more name calling coming from the Trump supporters than the other side. One only needs to look through the threads.

I agree with you Sombeech; the name calling should stop. I don't think that it will though.

Still, you can't say that it is only one side doing it, especially on Bogley. If you really want to we can separate the names called on Bogley on a spread sheet and keep score from the Trump supporters and non-Trump supporters. I am already willing to bet which ones have done the most name-calling.

Anyway, I put "libtard" in the Bogley search. Here are a few results that came up:

Get back to your side of the pond. Didn't we whoop your ass once already? That being stated, I find it humorous how many Non-US Citizens feel inclined to chime in on our system, regardless of how screwed up it is.

#Brexit, anyone? I don't recall any US folks chiming in for that, so STFU!

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I am hopeful this ends it for all these libtard snow flakes.

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Effing libtards.

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That's what I mean...fantasy. Libtards is an excellent adjective.

Using the word "liberal" in the search box for the presidential thread:

If it makes the libs feel better that Trump didn't fill the Mall, then let them have it. Suck on that pacifier and any other little victory they want to claim...

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Perhaps the lightbulb moment will occur with the liberals when they finally punch themselves out?

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What's the end goal of all of the liberal whiners?

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Of course after the liberal side all dies off in hunting accidents in West Texas

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I'm so happy to see that we're not outnumbered by the dried up hags or the look in the mirror and see a problem crowd.

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Of course, that's all peanuts compared to the results you get when you put "environmentalist" into the Bogley search box.:eek2:

In my personal opinion, liberals are hypersensitive sissies. Just my personal opinion, of course.

I Bogley searched "Rockgremlin" and it brought up the following result:


Attachment 85910



Then I Bogley searched "AccaDacca" and the following popped up:


Attachment 85913


...I have so many questions...