Coronavirus

stefan*

05:27 PM

Modifying Post

:roflol:

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Originally Posted by stefan

masks have nothing to do with politics unless you choose to politicize it. i don't.

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ROFLMAO... Dude... what color is the sky in your world. Masks are nothing but political.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...e6161bed44.jpg

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Originally Posted by Byron

Of course we weren't "ready" for the virus invasion...we're not "ready" for and alien invasion, either...or how about a big asteroid strike? Ain't ready for that. Expecting the government to be truly prepared for any large scale event is hopeless...the government is like cops, they show up after the shit's hit the fan.

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i get your cynicism but i disagree. pandemics have occurred historically. the emergence of SARS and MERS raised a serious awareness that a very contagious virus may emerge and lead to a pandemic. much has been learned from the measures other countries have taken to manage the spread of these coronaviruses. it's not an alien invasion.

stefan, you should go back to taggin' gubermint buildings, throwing bricks through windows and shittin' on police cars.

repeating communist lies just seems so--fascist...

stefan...your responses to my questions/queries are reasonable, rational, considerable and calm. I can't argue with a thing you said and wouldn't want to. You are obviously a very even keeled person, which is an attribute, IMO...kinda like when I hang out with Mormon guys...I knock off the foul language (mostly) and generally get on with my best behavior. However...

Your responses are also stoic, robotic and completely lack emotion. Are you human? I say that jokingly, of course...but damn, dude...a little tight there.

If you haven't noticed, I tend to get a bit wild with heavy type subjects but not completely out of control. I think I try to drag that kind of thing out of people I engage with my questions...I want them to go deep. That's where the meat of the bones is, IMO...where you really can get a look into the soul.

Years ago you seemed a little more loose...but we all change a bit as we get older, eh? Anyway...thanks for answering my questions even though it's full on "boring college professor".

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Originally Posted by stefan

i get your cynicism but i disagree. pandemics have occurred historically. the emergence of SARS and MERS raised a serious awareness that a very contagious virus may emerge and lead to a pandemic. much has been learned from the measures other countries have taken to manage the spread of these coronaviruses. it's not an alien invasion.

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OK...now there ya go! Venturing outside the robot zone with this one...and I knew this is what you were going to say.

My point is that to "learn" we have to start somewhere...yes, we should have been better prepared, but with this experience the next one may be more tolerable.

But then again, maybe it won't! A majority of people, weary of going thru this again may just reject the shutdown/lockdown/mask up thing altogether?

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Originally Posted by oldno7

stefan*

05:27 PM

Modifying Post

:roflol:

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It was probably like this..."Oh, that sounds too emotional, I'd better fix it".

Sorry stefan, can't help it!

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Originally Posted by Byron

It was probably like this..."Oh, that sounds too emotional, I'd better fix it".

Sorry stefan, can't help it!

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It was more like--I posted the party line talking lies and oldno7 just blew them up, complete with citations.

I look really stoopid, I better fix that.

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Originally Posted by Iceaxe

ROFLMAO... Dude... what color is the sky in your world. Masks are nothing but political.

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"nothing but political" says a lot ... masks and distancing are simply a blunt tool to manage the spread of the virus given that it is difficult to detect when someone is most contagious and who are capable of spreading it most. they've been made political.

given the lack of a vaccine, its highly contagious nature and ability to affect the economy and public health, i'd contend it's not simply a question of freedom but also a question of the harm principle. one could twist the phrase "your freedom to swing your fists ends when another's nose begins" to "your freedom to freely spew your respiratory bubbles ends when another's nose begins" .

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Originally Posted by oldno7

stefan*

05:27 PM

Modifying Post

:roflol:

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stefan*

06:31 PM

Modifying Post

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Byron

It was probably like this..."Oh, that sounds too emotional, I'd better fix it".

Sorry stefan, can't help it!

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nah, just typos and syntax.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stefan

one could twist the phrase "your freedom to swing your fists ends when another's nose begins" to "your freedom to freely spew your respiratory bubbles ends when another's nose begins" .

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OK...good luck with that, stefan. Check out Grandma in the middle of this picture. She's gonna mess up your junk wether you like it or not.

Best to order from the menu.

Attachment 95243

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Originally Posted by oldno7

Just to add to your great post--heres a factual timeline.

February 6, 2017 - DARPA launched the Pandemic Prevention Platform, an effort to create a standardized process to create medical countermeasures to a viral outbreak within 60 days, preventing the outbreak from becoming a pandemic; https://www.darpa.mil/news-events/2017-02-06a

February 22, 2018 - DARPA names the research institutions that will be participating in DARPA's Pandemic Prevention Platform, launched in 2017; https://globalbiodefense.com/2018/02...alt-outbreaks/

December 31, 2019 - WHO found a translation of a Chinese news report on ProMED about the outbreak in Wuhan; WHO's China office found a Wuhan Municipal Health Commission media statement about the outbreak in Wuhan; https://www.who.int/news-room/detail...-covidtimeline

December 31, 2019 - Taiwanese health officials alerted WHO of the infectivity of coronavirus; https://dailycaller.com/2020/03/20/w...virus-warning/ , https://www.ft.com/content/2a70a02a-...d-df28cc3c6a68

December 31, 2019 - Taiwan started boarding planes arriving from Wuhan, China to screen passengers for symptoms; https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jam...rticle/2762689

January 4, 2020 - CDC Director Robert Redfield offers to send technical experts to China: https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...g-coronavirus/ (behind paywall)

January 6, 2020 - CDC issued a Level 1 travel notice for Wuhan, China; https://afludiary.blogspot.com/2020/...el-notice.html

January 6, 2020 - CDC renewed the offer to send team to China; https://www.forbes.com/sites/lisette.../#5b15af734ee4

January 7, 2020 - CDC established a coronavirus incident management system; https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/videos/...19-webinar.pdf

January 8, 2020 - CDC alert to clinicians to ask patients with "severe respiratory illness" whether they had traveled to Wuhan; https://emergency.cdc.gov/han/han00424.asp

January 10, 2020 - WHO recommends against international travel restrictions; https://www.who.int/news-room/articl...irus-in-china/

January 11 and 12, 2020 - Covid-19 coronavirus DNA sequence communicated to WHO; https://www.who.int/csr/don/12-janua...irus-china/en/

January 12, 2020 - WHO claimed, "At this stage, there is no infection among healthcare workers, and no clear evidence of human to human transmission"; https://www.who.int/csr/don/12-janua...irus-china/en/

January 13, 2020 - WHO claimed "there has been no suggestion of human to human transmission of this new coronavirus"; https://www.who.int/thailand/news/de...el-coronavirus

January 14, 2020 - WHO claimed "there is no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission"; https://www.who.int/csr/don/14-janua...d-ex-china/en/

January 14, 2020 - China/WHO claimed no evidence of human to human transmission of corona virus; https://twitter.com/WHO/status/1217043229427761152 , "World Health Organization (WHO) @Who
Jan 14
Preliminary investigations conducted by the Chinese authorities have found no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel #coronavirus (2019-nCoV) identified in #Wuhan, #China."

January 15, 2020 - Nancy Pelosi signed impeachment articles and doled out impeachment pens; https://apnews.com/3cd46ae3f694b21c0cf83af3f0c4f1c7

January 17, 2020 - The US started screening arriving passengers from China; JFK, SFO, LAX https://www.businessinsider.com/new-...ing-cdc-2020-1 ; O'Hare and Hartsfield-Jackson
January 22, 2020 - https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...lanta-chicago/

January 20, 2020 - Dr. Fauci announces the National Institutes of Health working developing a vaccine for coronavirus; https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/20/healt...ent/index.html

January 20, 2020 - CDC activated its emergency operations center; https://emergency.cdc.gov/recentinci...d=EPR-homepage

January 20, 2020 - First acknowledgement by China and WHO of human-human transmission of coronavirus; https://abcnews.go.com/Health/human-...ry?id=68403105

January 20, 2020 - First confirmed coronavirus case in the US announced; https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2...avel-case.html

January 22, 2020 - US CDC issues a “(Travel) Watch Level 2 Alert (Practice Enhanced Precautions)” for the pneumonia caused by the novel coronavirus; https://china.usembassy-china.org.cn...us-in-china-3/

January 22, 2020 - Pharmaceuticals company Moderna working with US government to develop vaccine; https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/22/mode...ronavirus.html , https://investors.modernatx.com/news...te-development

January 23, 2020 - CDC sought “special emergency authorization” from FDA to allow states to use its coronavirus test; https://www.reuters.com/article/us-c...-idUSKBN1ZM2XS

January 26, 2020 - While warning that the coronavirus would come to NYC, New York City Health Commisioner Dr. Oxiris Barbot advised people, "We are encouraging New Yorkers to go about their everyday lives and suggest practicing everyday precautions that we do through the flu season," and, "We are very clear: We wish New Yorkers a Happy Lunar New Year and we encourage people to spend time with their families and go about their celebration"; https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/27/n...ronavirus.html

January 23, 2020 - Wuhan and other cities in Hubei Province shut down travel; http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/202..._138728067.htm , https://news.cgtn.com/news/2020-01-2...ItW/index.html

January 27, 2020 - US CDC issues highest-level travel health notice, Level 3, recommending that travelers avoid all nonessential travel to China; State Department raises its own travel advisory for all of China to Level 3 of 4, urging U.S. citizens to “reconsider travel”, while retaining its Level 4 travel advisory for Hubei Province; https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2...oid-china.html , https://china.usembassy-china.org.cn...avel-to-hubei/

January 28, 2020 - CDC renewed offer to send team to China; https://thehill.com/changing-america...-to-china-amid , https://www.hhs.gov/about/leadership...-briefing.html

January 28, 2020 - AbCellera is mobilizing its pandemic response platform against the outbreak of Covid-19; Since 2018, under the DARPA Pandemic Prevention Platform (P3) program, AbCellera has been leading a team of partners to establish a platform for pandemic response capable of developing field-ready medical countermeasures within 60 days of isolation of an unknown viral pathogen; https://www.abcellera.com/news/2020-...el-coronavirus

January 28, 2020 - Clover Biopharmaceuticals announced that it has initiated development of a vaccine for Covid-19; http://www.cloverbiopharma.com/index...catid=11&id=40

January 29, 2020 - White House announced the formation of the Coronavirus Task Force; https://thehill.com/policy/healthcar...or-coronavirus

January 29, 2020 - US personnel evacuated from Wuhan; https://abcnews.go.com/US/us-charter...ry?id=68571310

January 30, 2020 - World Health Organization declared coronavirus a public health emergency of international concern; https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/30/healt...ion/index.html

January 31, 2020 - In reference to Lunar New Year celebration activities, Barbara Ferrer, Los Angeles County Department of Public Health Director, said, "There is no need to panic and there is no need for people to cancel their activities."; https://mynewsla.com/hollywood/2020/...ngeles-county/

January 31, 2020 - Vaxart Announces start of development of Covid-19 oral vaccine; https://investors.vaxart.com/news-re...accine-program

January 31, 2020 - Trump declared a public health emergency; https://abcnews.go.com/Health/delta-...ry?id=68666037

January 31, 2020 - State Department raised the travel advisory for China to Level 4, do not travel; https://www.usatoday.com/story/trave...se/4620989002/

January 31, 2020 - State Department ordered the departure of all under-age-21 family members of US personnel in China; https://travel.state.gov/content/tra...-advisory.html

January 31, 2020 - People entering the US from China forbidden; Announced January 31, effective February 2; https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/02/us/co...ons/index.html This effectively ended flights from and to China, for obvious reasons.

January 31, 2020 - Biden referred to "Donald Trump’s record of hysteria and xenophobia - hysterical xenophobia - and fearmongering" while criticizing Trump's China travel restrictions; https://thehill.com/homenews/campaig...virus-outbreak

February 2, 2020 - NYC Health Commissioner Dave A. Chokshi encouraged New Yorkers, "As we gear up to celebrate the #LunarNewYear in NYC,... there is no reason for anyone to change their holiday plans, avoid the subway, or certain parts of the city because of #coronavirus; https://twitter.com/NYCHealthCommr/s...43155852537863

February 3, 2020 - WHO Director-General states that a travel ban is not needed; https://www.reuters.com/article/us-c...-idUSKBN1ZX1H3 , https://www.who.int/dg/speeches/deta...el-coronavirus

February 3, 2020 - CDC had a team ready to travel to China; https://www.reuters.com/article/us-c...-idUSKBN1ZX2BV

February 4, 2020 - HHS, Regeneron Collaborate to Develop 2019-nCoV Treatment; https://www.hhs.gov/about/news/2020/...treatment.html

February 4, 2020 - Rep. Ami Bera claimed Trump's China travel restrictions would "create prejudices" and cause people to "harbor anxieties toward" Chinese people; https://www.politico.com/states/cali...s-fear-1258757

February 5, 2020 - First House of Representatives hearing about Covid-19; https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/05/watc...-outbreak.html

February 5, 2020 - Rep. Eliot Engel claimed Trump's China travel restrictions would "stoke" "discriminatory" and "racist" responses; https://foreignaffairs.house.gov/202...mittee-hearing

February 6, 2020 - Shipping of CDC 2019 coronavirus test kits begins; https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2...test-kits.html

February 7, 2020 - NYC Health Commisioner Dr. Oxiris Barbot advised people, "So we’re telling New Yorkers, go about your lives, take the subway, go out, enjoy life, but practice everyday precautions"; https://news.grabien.com/story-flash...rkers-gather-p (the link includes context of her advice and video of her comments)

February 9, 2020 - NYC Health Commissioner Oxiris Barbot encouraged New Yorkers, "I want to remind everyone to enjoy the (Lunar New Year) parade and not change any plans due to misinformation spreading about #coronavirus."; https://twitter.com/NYCHealthCommr/s...08570646269954

February 10, 2020 - Clover Biopharmaceuticals announced that it has produced a vaccine candidate that has produced an immune system response in patients who have recovered from Covid-19; http://www.cloverbiopharma.com/index...catid=11&id=41

February 11, 2020 - HHS expands partnership with Janssen Research & Development for vaccine development; https://www.hhs.gov/about/news/2020/...s-vaccine.html

February 16, 2020 - Medigen Vaccine Biologics (Taiwan) and US NIH entered a collaboration agreement to develop a Covid-19 vaccine; http://www.medigenvac.com/public/en/...52?from_sort=2

February 18, 2020 - HHS to work with Sanofi Pasteur to develop coronavirus vaccine and treatment; https://www.statnews.com/2020/02/18/...virus-vaccine/

February 24, 2020 - Nancy Pelosi invited Californians to "come to Chinatown"; https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/20...cos-chinatown/

February 24, 2020 - Clover Biopharmaceuticals announced an agreement with GlaxoSmithKline to test its vaccine with GSK's adjuvant; http://www.cloverbiopharma.com/index...catid=11&id=42

February 25, 2020 - An NIH clinical trial of Remdesivir begun; at University of Nebraska Medical Center, https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news...ovid-19-begins

February 26, 2020 - Experimental vaccine submitted for testing; Moderna, https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/25/busin...ine/index.html

February 26, 2020 - Nancy Pelosi referred to Trump's China travel shut down as, "scare tactics about people coming back to our country"; https://twitter.com/ABCPolitics/stat...17882020245504

February 29, 2020 - Testing labs allowed to use tests whose FDA Emergency Use Authorization requests are still pending; https://www.fda.gov/news-events/pres...ty-diagnostics

February 29, 2020 - Level 4 travel advisory to Italy, South Korea; https://www.usatoday.com/story/trave...ea/4914822002/

February 29, 2020 - Iran travel ban announced; https://www.statnews.com/2020/02/29/...-include-iran/

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This is great stuff @oldno7... seriously. I have wanted to find a time-line of sorts. Did you collect this or pull it from another site? If from another site may I have that link?

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Originally Posted by stefan

"nothing but political" says a lot ... masks and distancing are simply a blunt tool to manage the spread of the virus given that it is difficult to detect when someone is most contagious and who are capable of spreading it most.

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I think I see our differences... you're a save every life and who gives a shit what it does to the economy and quality of life type of guy.

I believe we need to sacrifice the lives of a few of the weak, aged and feeble to reach herd immunity. Wars are not won without sacrifice.... I think that we're lucky in that the virus for the most part avoids the young and healthy, unlike what was required for victory in retaking fortress Europe.

Not my compilation but another poster's from a forum I frequent.

He said share, so, I shared and theres the facts.

Have been some never Trumpers try to find flaw but none succeeded.

The TRUTH is what democrats/communist fear.

Thats why the likes of stefan somehow feel a need to regurgitate unsubstantiated, partyline, democrat, blather, bullshit.

It's all they have.

And I've run out of patience for liars. Folks like him would jump off a cliff if obama,pelosi,et al. told him to.

Their "truth" is 180 deg. from reality but they've been spoonfed the communist line so long it's what they have become and who they are.

And the divide deepens......And right is right and left is wrong.

I'm sorry I'm holding back:kicknuts:

I've been on a few canyoneering adventures with Stefan. He is a good egg. He and I may not agree on some politics, but his responses to this thread were measured and articulate. Jeeze Louise, lighten up Odno7 with the ad hominem attacks! It seriously takes away from YOUR credibility in my humble opinion. You state the "divide deepens". Yes, and the way to accelerate that divide is to attack the person, not the issue. Ad hominem attacks are quite simply the lowest form of attempted persuasion.

New models suggest COVID-19 herd immunity might be achieved with far fewer people infected

https://www.yahoo.com/news/models-su...130126904.html

So if true, that is very good news!

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Originally Posted by Scott Card

I've been on a few canyoneering adventures with Stefan. He is a good egg. He and I may not agree on some politics, but his responses to this thread were measured and articulate. Jeeze Louise, lighten up Odno7 with the ad hominem attacks! It seriously takes away from YOUR credibility in my humble opinion. You state the "divide deepens". Yes, and the way to accelerate that divide is to attack the person, not the issue. Ad hominem attacks are quite simply the lowest form of attempted persuasion.

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At this point--it is useless to "lighten up" or try to find common ground, there is none.

I'm not looking for yours or anyone elses approval, just pointing out facts to someone who is so indoctrinated with lies, the truth has escaped reality.

I did respond to the issue but you obviously skimmed past it.(little 3 post ditty, loaded with real timeline facts) thought maybe you might enjoy facts rather than attack the fact poster.

stefan posted about lack of preparedness(true no country can be prepared for every contingency, it's not practical or even possible)

then he dove down the rabbit hole of blaming it all on Trump's lack of leadership and delayed reaction.(democrat talking lies)

So I enlightened the ignorant with facts disputing his lies.

And so he goes back and edits his posts to not appear so idiotic.

So enlighten me Mr. Card--what did you judge "ad hominem", did I post an untruth?, or did you just not appreciate my delivery of facts?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by oldno7

At this point--it is useless to "lighten up" or try to find common ground, there is none.

I'm not looking for yours or anyone elses approval, just pointing out facts to someone who is so indoctrinated with lies, the truth has escaped reality.

I did respond to the issue but you obviously skimmed past it.(little 3 post ditty, loaded with real timeline facts) thought maybe you might enjoy facts rather than attack the fact poster.

stefan posted about lack of preparedness(true no country can be prepared for every contingency, it's not practical or even possible)

then he dove down the rabbit hole of blaming it all on Trump's lack of leadership and delayed reaction.(democrat talking lies)

So I enlightened the ignorant with facts disputing his lies.

And so he goes back and edits his posts to not appear so idiotic.

So enlighten me Mr. Card--what did you judge "ad hominem", did I post an untruth?, or did you just not appreciate my delivery of facts?

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Delivery. It is kind of "in your face". However at this point I doubt Stefan let's it bother him.

The virus is not Trumps fault. The spread is not Trumps fault. However on many occasions he made light of the virus, continues to make light of the virus. Several democrats made light of the virus. Media made light of the virus and now have sensationalized the virus. In that respect it has set a tone for people to mistrust one or the other or both sides and the media and deepened a divide that was already there. And has spawned more conspiracies than I have ever seen. That in itself is a most interesting phenomenon.

As I have said before this pandemic has exposed all of America's weaknesses. And it continues to.

I love the time-line you posted. I really do. It will be very helpful this year with school and presenting facts.

Hindsight is 20/20. The way America and Americans have handled this has been less than stellar. This virus has health consequences we don't fully comprehend. It feels like at this point we have been dealing with this for an eternity but it has only been 8 months of really trying to get a grasp. This virus is going no where, it is here to stay just like H1N1. The current state of things probably will continue for a couple years if history repeats itself. The Spanish Flu lasted 2 years.



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Personally, I think stefan is pretty badass because he's one of the few that actually has a thick skin...he's stuck around while so many others have bailed. He's like that dude around the campfire that doesn't say much but when he does I'll turn my ear to him...I'm interested in what he has to say. The gut feeling I have is that there's some deep wisdom there...but to me, it's like he walks a careful edge...I'd like to push him over and hear him raise his voice a bit but he's pretty damn solid.

I wouldn't want to get on Oldno's shitlist, that's for sure...but in this case, he truly laid down some heavy meat. The good stuff...undeniable.

Facts and opinions...to me stefan was going on (mostly) about the way things should ​have happened. Sometimes it may take a few post to realize you're dealing with retrospective wishful thinking.