Personal Rescues and Near Misses! What would you do?

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10-01-2014, 01:05 PM
Kuya

Personal Rescues and Near Misses! What would you do?
I have been thinking a lot lately about the rescues and near misses that I have personally been involved in, or have been the cause of. What would you do to help someone in these circumstances? pick one or answer all. I am very curious to learn from all you pros!
1. Person is started rappelling and realizes that their Autoblock, rigged under the ATC, is on a sling that is too long and will jam in the rappel device?
2. Girl rappels of and is free hanging about 10' from the ground (2' from a lip that can be stood upon) and her hair gets stuck in the ATC? Anchor was not rigged with a contingency.
3. Person rappels down and is free hanging about 15' from the ground and gets a glove stuck in the ATC. (Anchor was rigged with a Jester)
4. Person slides over a tricky start where you medalye are free hanging, in the process they jam their left hand under the rope and are stuck hanging there.
5. A guy is rappelling with his gopro in one hand down a swiftwater, ankle biting waterfall, and slips into a crack and ends up hanging upside down with water pounding on his face! He is the last one down and his group members can't see him as he has slipped into a mini cave with water pouring over the top of it. luckily this guys (STUPID GUY!!! haha) was able dive into the cave and reorient himself and put the gopro away. but in the process he bruised a rib. anyway, what if this duface hadn't been able to slip into a cave and get out of the water fall. what would you do as a team member from the bottom to help him?
6. A friends rigs a anchor with a stone knot and rappels down a 300' cliff. when they get to the big wall drop, they realize that they passed some rebelay anchors and now the rope is too short (the drop is usually done in 2 or 3 stages). He does have extra rope dangling from his pack, but it is kind of difficult to communicate with him about the situation. What do you do to help this guy?
7. You are with a new team, never have met them before but the leader seems really confident and has a lot of experience. YOu are running a canyon with some keeper potholes. one of the team members rappels into the keeper (with out his wetsuit on), excited to see it and try and escape, but doesn't realize how hard it is and ends up needing help. The team leader goes into help him, but it takes a long time for him to figure it out too. in the end we all make it out ok, but the first guy is really really cold. what would you do differently?
8. LAMAR backs up everyone on a low angle rappel with a 8 foot drop at the end. The experienced trip leader suggests to LAMAR that low angle slide is doable in a controlled fashion and that he can be safely captured at the 8' drop. WELL.... the less experience LAMAR does a great job as meat anchor for the team, but when it comes to going slow down the low angle slab, he doesn't do so hot and comes sliding down pretty quickly! what do you do to help him survive the 8' drop?
10-01-2014, 01:46 PM
Scott P
Quote:
Girl rappels of and is free hanging about 10' from the ground (2' from a lip that can be stood upon) and her hair gets stuck in the ATC? Anchor was not rigged with a contingency.
I've seen that happen a few times. Are you assuming another rope is available? If so, someone rappels down or is lowered next to her and cuts the hair off, assuming she can't do it herself.
10-01-2014, 02:08 PM
Kuya

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott P

I've seen that happen a few times. Are you assuming another rope is available? If so, someone rappels down or is lowered next to her and cuts the hair off, assuming she can't do it herself.

yes, in my case, I went down on a second rope, and was able to get below her enough that she could stand on my knee. Then we were able to unweight the device and free her hair. If I were to do it again, i would go down on a second rope and rig a foot loop for her to stand up in. OR prepare ahead and rig the drop with a contingency setup so I could just lower her to the ground.
10-01-2014, 03:35 PM
oldno7

Ran into similar on the last rap in pine cr.

As we come up to the last rap, we see a calm gal, hanging about 40' down in mid air.(hair stuck in device)

I secure myself at the last rap, anchor, with my tether, tie a figure eight on a bite and clip a carabiner into it.

I can lean out over the abyss and talk with this gal, who was as calm and alert as can be.

We drop end of rope to her with instructions to clip and lock the biner in her belay loop, she does so.

I run the lowered rope through my short tether and her dad and my friend are able to pull her up a short distance and secure her.

I merely served as a re-direct and the 2 guys were lifting 100% of her weight(which wasn't much)

She removes hair, gets back on rappel, removes the biner, rappels to ground.

All this took place in I'd say less than 2 minutes(minus her rappeling down)

Quick, fast and everyone went on as if nothing happened.
10-02-2014, 10:46 AM
ConcreteCanyons

1. Cut the rope.
2. Cut the rope.
3. Cut the rope.
4. Cut the rope.
5. Cut the rope.
6. Cut the rope.
7. Cut the rope.
8. Cut the rope.

Annie will die if you don't do this. You're gonna kill your sister. Cut the damn rope!
10-02-2014, 11:16 AM
deagol

I might get flamed for this, but considering how often stuff like this happens...

seems like people should get their skills up to speed before being taken through canyons.
10-02-2014, 01:16 PM
Kuya

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldno7

Ran into similar on the last rap in pine cr.

As we come up to the last rap, we see a calm gal, hanging about 40' down in mid air.(hair stuck in device)

I secure myself at the last rap, anchor, with my tether, tie a figure eight on a bite and clip a carabiner into it.

I can lean out over the abyss and talk with this gal, who was as calm and alert as can be.

We drop end of rope to her with instructions to clip and lock the biner in her belay loop, she does so.

I run the lowered rope through my short tether and her dad and my friend are able to pull her up a short distance and secure her.

I merely served as a re-direct and the 2 guys were lifting 100% of her weight(which wasn't much)

She removes hair, gets back on rappel, removes the biner, rappels to ground.

All this took place in I'd say less than 2 minutes(minus her rappeling down)

Quick, fast and everyone went on as if nothing happened.

Sweet! that is pretty slick. Tucking that away for future use
10-02-2014, 02:21 PM
qedcook

Quote:

Originally Posted by ConcreteCanyons

8. Cut the rope.

Annie will die if you don't do this. You're gonna kill your sister. Cut the damn rope!

Dang, that's hilarious!!!
10-02-2014, 02:51 PM
oldno7

1 Attachment(s)

There are only 2 basic rules of canyon rescue...

Rule #1. Always take a picture of those in peril:mrgreen:

Rule #2. If you rig contingency, there is no need to worry about someone taking advantage of rule #1

o.k. just so no one thinks I was heartless in this situation...

I went to this vantage point for the specific purpose of photographing the last rap,

I didn't know until after I snapped the shot that her hair was stuck.
10-02-2014, 06:29 PM
Bootboy

Quote:

Originally Posted by deagol

I might get flamed for this, but considering how often stuff like this happens...

seems like people should get their skills up to speed before being taken through canyons.

+1
10-03-2014, 02:37 PM
dlofting

The question is, "How would you help?" in each situation.

I prefer to look at it a little differently. I make sure that each person in the party has ascending equipment or at least can use a prussik and leg loop to unweight their belay device. They also know how to tie off the rappel, if necessary, while they rig the ascender/prussik and leg loop. (we don't live in canyon country so practice these skills on a local crag). In cases 1, 2 & 3 they can rescue themselves.

Case 4 is a bit different but still requires unweighting the rope by attaching a leg loop above the point where the hand is jammed.....this probably requires help from someone at the anchor.

In Case 5, the person needs to recognize the possibility of turning upside down before he starts the rappel, and take precautions. He can rig a sling around his shoulders and clip it to the rope above the belay device, suspend his pack from a sling attached to his belay loop, or both. If he does flip over I'm not sure what you can do from below other than to ascend the rope and try to help get him upright.....might take too long though.

Case 6 is where I would make sure I had the canyon beta "down pat" before I started the trip. This would include asking questions of people on a board like Bogley so I KNEW how I was going to do the big wall and was SURE the ropes I had were sufficient.

Case 7 is probably a bit beyond my skills as I've never been in a keeper pothole, or a least only when they were full of water. I think you have to decide how you're going to get out of the pothole before you get in, allow for spending more time getting out than you might first think i.e. put on your wetsuit, and decide how you're going to help someone if they can't get out unassisted.

In Case 8 I'd suggest that the guy who is confident he can downclimb the 8 feet go last.....LAMAR may be a great anchor but it doesn't sound like he's got the downclimbing skills needed.

I guess these replies sum up my whole approach to canyoneering and any other backcountry travel, which is to anticipate problems before they occur and take measures to minimize the possibility.
10-06-2014, 09:22 AM
Kuya

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldno7

Ran into similar on the last rap in pine cr.

As we come up to the last rap, we see a calm gal, hanging about 40' down in mid air.(hair stuck in device)

I secure myself at the last rap, anchor, with my tether, tie a figure eight on a bite and clip a carabiner into it.

I can lean out over the abyss and talk with this gal, who was as calm and alert as can be.

We drop end of rope to her with instructions to clip and lock the biner in her belay loop, she does so.

I run the lowered rope through my short tether and her dad and my friend are able to pull her up a short distance and secure her.

I merely served as a re-direct and the 2 guys were lifting 100% of her weight(which wasn't much)

She removes hair, gets back on rappel, removes the biner, rappels to ground.

All this took place in I'd say less than 2 minutes(minus her rappeling down)

Quick, fast and everyone went on as if nothing happened.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlofting

The question is, "How would you help?" in each situation.

I prefer to look at it a little differently. I make sure that each person in the party has ascending equipment or at least can use a prussik and leg loop to unweight their belay device. They also know how to tie off the rappel, if necessary, while they rig the ascender/prussik and leg loop. (we don't live in canyon country so practice these skills on a local crag). In cases 1, 2 & 3 they can rescue themselves.

Case 4 is a bit different but still requires unweighting the rope by attaching a leg loop above the point where the hand is jammed.....this probably requires help from someone at the anchor.

In Case 5, the person needs to recognize the possibility of turning upside down before he starts the rappel, and take precautions. He can rig a sling around his shoulders and clip it to the rope above the belay device, suspend his pack from a sling attached to his belay loop, or both. If he does flip over I'm not sure what you can do from below other than to ascend the rope and try to help get him upright.....might take too long though.

Case 6 is where I would make sure I had the canyon beta "down pat" before I started the trip. This would include asking questions of people on a board like Bogley so I KNEW how I was going to do the big wall and was SURE the ropes I had were sufficient.

Case 7 is probably a bit beyond my skills as I've never been in a keeper pothole, or a least only when they were full of water. I think you have to decide how you're going to get out of the pothole before you get in, allow for spending more time getting out than you might first think i.e. put on your wetsuit, and decide how you're going to help someone if they can't get out unassisted.

In Case 8 I'd suggest that the guy who is confident he can downclimb the 8 feet go last.....LAMAR may be a great anchor but it doesn't sound like he's got the downclimbing skills needed.

I guess these replies sum up my whole approach to canyoneering and any other backcountry travel, which is to anticipate problems before they occur and take measures to minimize the possibility.

Of course all of these situations can be prevented haha! I'm more interested in learning what you would do if these had happened to you.
10-06-2014, 11:49 PM
Bootboy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kuya

Of course all of these situations can be prevented haha! I'm more interested in learning what you would do if these had happened to you.

Get a new hobby :p
10-07-2014, 08:05 AM
Kuya

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bootboy

Get a new hobby :p

Yeah.... better for us all to just stay home. No one is as perfect as Bootboy :hail2thechief:
10-07-2014, 08:59 PM
SRG

Like the thread idea Kuya! I'm certainly not a pro but I'll answer anyway.

1) "Autoblock under the ATC, is on a sling that is too long"- The person on rappel recognized it as a problem. Presumably this means that he/she understands that it may not function as intended and will rappel cautiously, making sure not to allow the autoblock to engage.

2) " free hanging about 10' from the ground"- Try and talk her through applying a step-up from the ground. If that doesn't work, convert to lower.

3) "free hanging about 15' from the ground"- Convert to lower.

4) "hand under the rope"- Someone up top fixes the pull strand to the anchor and puts a shoulder sling under the tensioned rappel rope. Then she/he rappels down on the fixed pull strand(assuming the anchor situation allows) bringing the pinned should sling along. When the rescuer gets to the stuck person on rappel he/she straddles the rappel strand and pulls up on the shoulder sling, lifting the tensioned rappel strand away from the rock and freeing the hand.

5) "hadn't been able to slip into a cave and get out of the water fall." If the top anchor was bomber, maybe I'd grab the end of the rap strand that touches the ground and set up a Z-rig off of an anchor far back from the waterfall in an attempt to tension the rap strand and pull the stuck person out of the water?

6) "passed some rebelay anchors and now the rope is too short "- Hope to god the stuck party can fix it themselves so I don't have to haul them up 300'.

7) "the first guy is really really cold. what would you do differently"- Get dry clothes on the cold guy and maybe a break to warm up w/ an emergency blanket. For the rest of the canyon offer my input on pothole escape technique.

8) "what do you do to help him survive the 8' drop?"- spot the fall and try to keep LAMAR's head and neck upright and out of harms way. For the rest of the canyon LAMAR does his own risk management.