Bogley

[Richard Barron]

For many years now I have been a day hiker, but I am finding that many of the destinations on my A-list are deep in the back there. I haven't been backpacking since 1990, and I want to get back into it. So I need some advice and recommendations about getting re-started. I don't currently have any of the following: backpack, lightweight tent, lightweight sleeping bag, or portable camp stove. I do have day-hike stuff like a med kit, compass, maps, water bottles, hiking shoes, etc.

Keep in mind that I am not ready to spend a lot of money. So... word?

Thanks in advance. -Richard

[DiscGo]

I would say start with the backpack. You can use full size sleeping bags, & tents (weight pending) but the backpack is a good place to start.

[Richard Barron]

That might be the area in which I am least knowledgeable. I am 6' 1" and weight about 170 pounds. I am in pretty good condition. Do you have some idea of the size and capacity of a backpack for me? Thanks. -R

[Richard Barron]

Also, who can tell me about bivvy sacks/tents?

[Summit]

I hate Bivy sacks, I feel like I am stuck in a ziplock bag. If you are going solo it will deffinetely be your best bet for saving weight.

Do you check http://www.steepandcheap.com/
My brother set up the instant alerts and picked up an arcteryx Pack, Big Angus Bag w/ Pad, and a sick 2man tent for dirt cheep over the course of a few weeks.... altogether he saved almost 400 bucks from the sticker price.

Steep and Cheap FTW!

[RedMan]

Richard,

Alone I like a Bivy. Packing in pairs we take a tent and share the load.
I have a Cabelas XPG Bivy, $99 and weighs 15oz, beats 3-4lbs for a tent.

[denaliguide]

for a pack the first thing to decide is how much you plan to carry. then you need to decide on internal or external frame. internal carry better but external allow you to strap on akward loads. many of the large packs have compression straps on the sides so they will carry many different size loads comfortably. also the weight of the empty pack must be considered. some will weigh over 6lbs empty. i would suggest that you go to a store which carries packs and try on the different packs with a knowledgeable clerk. then go look on ebay for something that is close to what you are looking for. if you are on a budget that is the way to go. i have picked up plenty of quality gear on ebay over the years. most of the packs i have were made by lowe alpine systems. pick a recognizeable brand and it should last for years.

tent, again how much do you want to carry and where are you going to use it. snow camping will require a heavier tent than trips into the canyons. i personally don't carry a tent in the canyons. i have a silicone impregnated tarp which only weighs 1.5lb for 10'x12'. bivy sacks are to tight for me to sleep comfortably, but i do use one for solo winter trips. again there are lots of models of tents to chose from. just have to decide what it's primary use will be. don't go cheap on your tent. get a name brand and it will last years. i am still using a north face ve-24 that i bought in 1982 on my hunting trips in alaska. but its one of 4 tents that i have.

stove, you can hardly go wrong with msr stoves. most are multi-fuel and will boil a pot of water quickly. you will need to decide on whether you want to carry liquid fuel in a fuel bottle or the gas canister type of fuel. each has its advantages and disadvantages. for an ultralight-weight stove you can make one using a couple of pop cans and burn alcohol (heet).
just google pepsi can stove and you will see numerous designs. i use a pepsi can stove on desert solo trips where the only thing i need to heat is water for is a cup of tea or soup. (most of my food for solo trips is non-cook) takes longer to boil water so not real good for the long simmer type cooking in my opinion. msr whisperlite is very popular.

sleeping bag, down is king for warmth and lightweight as long as you keep it dry. otherwise a synthetic bag is the better option. some of the synthetics out there today are almost as light as down and compress just as well. decide what the lowest temps you plan on sleeping in and go from there. if you sleep cold you will want a warmer bag. i use a lighter bag and sleep in my clothes if i need to. i dont think that one sleeping bag is all you need in the closet. i have several and can chose accordingly depending on the trip. my north face cats meow gets the most use.

so like i said before go to a shop in your area and talk to the staff there and get sized up. then look on ebay. won't take long and you will be well outfitted with what you need. good luck.

[Richard Barron]

This is all exactly the kind of info I need. Thanks everyone, and keep it coming. FYI, I imagine my most common destinations will be in canyons and wilderness areas in Utah, Arizona and New Mexico. I don't think I'll be doing much alpine backpacking. -R

[RedRoxx]

Get some good quality stuff---sleeping bag and shelter and pad. It can make a tough trip bearable--storms, colder than normal, etc. So far the suggestions of ebay and steep and cheap are good, as well as online sales of sites such as Sierra Design, backcountry.com, Moosejaw, etc.

IMO a pack with around 2800-3200 cubic inches can do for a long weekend or longer if in summer and no need for extras in clothing et al. If I am out for near a week or longer I have a 4200cu bag I use. I like Osprey packs myself. I just got a Golite pack that looks good but I haven't used yet.


Tents--I have a Black Diamond Hilight I think it is about 3 lbs and large enough for two people, it's a single wall and a pain with condensation in wet conditions, but in minimal rain or light wind is very good and roomy. In winter I usually use a bivy, it is warmer and I use a piece of sil tarp to make a cooking shelter. If I am in canyon country such as southern utah I usually just carry a small tarp/poncho, as I use natural shelters to camp in.

Many good sleeping bags. I have a couple of WM bags, these are expensive and rarely on sale, but they are very accurate for temp ratings.

Just carry one pot and stove and heat water and eat out of the bag to save weight. I usually repack my dehydrated food into freezer ziplocks.

I don't carry a water filter and use Aqua Mira and pick my water sources with care.

Most new backpackers carry too much weight and therefore get turned off by the experience. Get the basics, try a short trip out, and see what does and doesn't work. Get rid of the excess on ebay or Craigs list.

Have fun --- can't wait to see the photo results---

[Cirrus2000]

Cool, Richard! Great advice on this thread.

Steep & Cheap - absolutely; I live in a whole other country, but I love this place.

MSR stove - love my Whisperlite, but for 1 or 2 nights, I just carry cold-eatin' foods (except in very cold weather - then hot food is essential. And yes to eating out of the bag!)

Pack - I use a basic 65 liter (4000 ci?) internal frame pack I've had for 12 years, but considering a new one. Help with testing and fitting is crucial.

Sleeping bag - Get a 20° (F) down bag - mmm, down. Light and warm in a dry place. My North Face Blue Kazoo is great. If you claustrophobic, avoid the mummy style and go for a barrel bag. If you get cold feet, add a pair of down hut booties. I love mine.

Pad - I've got a Big Agnes Insulated Air Core sleeping pad: 20" x 72" x 2.5". Love it way more than my old thermarest. Comfort, comfort, comfort. And the lightheadedness after inflating it (orally) helps you sleep.

Shelter - I'm with denaliguide. I borrowed a corner of his tarp a couple of years ago, and I was sold. That's what I use now when I'm solo in the canyons. (I got a smaller one, only suitable for 1 person. That, a set of trekking poles, a couple of pegs & a bit of line, and I'm set)

The tarp thing is great, but you may wish to start with a tent. Lightweight, light duty (single wall) should do for the adventures you're after - you don't need all the mountaineering doodads and the like. Consider the tarp idea after a few trips, maybe. Not sure I would have gone for it right from the start.

Water - I use Pristine drops for clear water, and have an MSR MiniWorks filter for nastier water. Had one nasty spring in Wrather Canyon (off the Paria) where I needed both - but it was mighty tasty after that!

[stefan]

whatever pack you decide on, make sure it fits and fits well, it makes a world of difference carrying weight all day.

i've really enjoyed my osprey silhouette i bought in '97. i guess the latest incarnation of the pack is the Aether series. i was in alaska the summer before i bought it and did a long trip and borrowed a friend's Osprey Motherload which was their biggest pack at the time. i was really impressed by how well the pack fit my body and how well it carried the weight and moved with my body. beyond being a well-made pack with nice features and locally made, this was the the predominant reason i selected osprey. i've really enjoyed this pack also for ski touring on multiday trips. i also really liked the feature it had at the time that i could attach a variety of small backpacks (that they made as accessories) onto their vector system. this maintained a good center of mass and i found this invaluable for short day/evening hikes from camp.

about 5 years ago, a section of material that holds the aluminum tubing frame had torn through at the base of the pack (darn sandstone). i called osprey up and they told me to mail it to them. within 2-3 weeks i had the pack returned to me fixed beautifully (no charge) and just in time for another trip.

i can't really speak directly to the differences and improvements of their current set of packs, but if they are anything like the packs during the late 90s then i would recommend testing them out in a store with weight. they seem to be getting a little busier looking, personally i like toned-down looking packs, and theirs used to be that way.

recently i had a friend give up his dana designs pack in favor of an osprey which fit him much better. he's been happy with it. on the other hand, other friends of mine love dana designs.



but i think of a backpack like a pair of shoes ... you're feeling them all day long, and they better feel damn good so you can enjoy the wonderful space you're wandering in.

[MajorHavoK]

I too backpacked a lot in my early years and just got back into it a couple of years ago.. One thing I remembered however was that weight is everything and I like to be comfortable after carring 30-40 pounds up a mountain all day.. But some things have changed a lot in the last 10-15 years.. Others haven't but the most important thing is that you need to figure out what you'll be happy with. It's pointless to kill yourself to carry gear you don't need and won't use, and equally pointless to have an easy hike just to be hungry/thirsty/wet/cold and uncomfortable when you aren't hiking.

To put it simply, I don't think you should cheap out on your gear. Your needs and requirements will change significantly after your first trip. If you are like me, you'll try to save money and make shortcuts and wish you hadn't later. Usually I buy the cheaper option, hate it and end up buying the nicer option later and end up spending more than if I'd just bought the good gear to begin with. If possible, I'd rent or use a friends gear to start with until you have a really good idea of what you need. Below are some of my experiences with backpacking gear and hopefully you can get something out of it.

For pack I'd say wait for a good sale at an outdoor store like REI.. There are employees there that are exceedingly helpful.. They will fit/adjust just about any pack to you and make very good suggestions.. I bought an rei ridgeline pack for aboutt 175.. Saw them a lot cheaper later on sale.. Its my first internal frame and I won't go to external. I don't get snagged on trees/brush and save weight on all the bungees and straps I had to use to (usually) keep everything stable on the pack.. Also protects my stuff from from getting wet, dirty, and torn.. (or lost if it falls off the pack!)

I have a few sleeping bags for different uses.. But my favorite is big agnes lost ranger (long) 15 degree down bag.. For one it's made for people larger than 5'5 and 140lbs and allows me to stretch out and even turn over in my sleep. If I'm going somewhere extremely cold I can even fit my REI sahara 30 degree down bag inside of it and still be very comfortable. It fits the Big Agnes(or other brands) sleeping pads (20x78x1.5 or 2.5) in a sleeve on the bottom so you don't slip/roll off of it at night which I love. They don't put down fill on the bottom half of the bag which is ok because it saves weight and the compressed down you are laying on does nothing to keep you warm anyway.. Its all in the pad.. I also have two pads.. I started with the Big agnes air core but never really liked sleeping on the "ribs".. I picked up a big agnes "hinman" pad. These are very hard to find and I had to order it off the internet. Its warmer and flat so I'm more comfortable with it.. I also is self-filling because it has foam in it, but it doesn't fold up as small as the air core. It may be a little too warm unless it gets chilly at night where you plan on camping.. But you can always unzip it if needed..

For tent I say the lightest smallest that you can live with..and keeps you dry.. I'm about to get a silnyl tarptent that's less than 2 lbs and sleeps 2 plus gear..

I never know when or where I'm going to find water so I pack 6-7 liters.. 3 in a dromedary bladder with the tube and bite valve to drink while walking.. And the rest in nalgene bottles.. Water is most of the weight I carry but I find that being well hydrated offsets the extra weight.. I use water for everything when packing.. Coffee.. Re-hydrating my food and washing my cookware.. So any decent source of water that's clear and running even a trickle.. I filter and refill my bottles.. I also get sick from the purification tablets.. So I recommend getting a high end water filter.. Nothing worse than hiking 20 miles with a sick stomach.. (Or worse..) Get something from MSR or another with high rated filtration AND that filters quickly.. They all have hand pumps but it shouldn't take 5 mins to fill a liter bottle.

I like the earlier suggestion of the heet/denatured alchohol stoves.. But the soda can types I've tried weren't that reliable and sometimes "burst" in half from internal pressure.. There are some nice heavy duty titanium ones on the market for about 20 bucks that won't explode in your face and barely weigh a couple ounces plus fuel.. I also have a msr pocket rocket that's tiny and doesn't way much.. But you can't use the iso-butane in below freezing temps and the cans for it seem to always run out on me so I carry two cans all the time. The large size snow peak brand of fuel seems to work well for me on a 2 night trip.. Plus their cans seem to last longer than the other brands I've used..

Don't forget the little things though like a nice headlamp. I had great luck with the cheapo energizer brand ones that had spotlights, area lights, even red light to keep your night vision when stretching the last few miles of trail in the dark... BUT in a slight rain the damned thing got wet and ruined. Ever since then I have used the Princeton EOS. It has a true 1watt spot and is regulated so it's always the same brightness until the battery is dead. It's also is waterproof.

Walmart has these great biodegradable baby-wipes that dissolve in 10 days. These are great for cleaning dishes/hands and even their designed purpose and I can not feel bad about burying those under some light soil off the trail. MUCH better than bringing toilet paper!!

Hope this helps!

[jimflint1]

For a sleeping bag, you can get away with a 2-3 pound bag for the desert canyon areas. I slept in a 3 lb up on the King's Peak trail and didn't get cold--even though there was ice on the nearby stream in the morning. It just depends on the fill. The temp ratings are only a guideline--there are no regulations regarding them---each manufacturer places their own ratings on the bags.

I got a great lightweight tent at REI for about $100. I love it. Easy to put up and take down and roomy. Before that I was using my old orange pup tent that I bought in the 1970s.

I also need to someday replace my 1970s Jansport backpack. It doesn't even have a strap going across the chest.

Some of this stuff you might be able to pick up on Ebay or even at garage sales for cheap if you're trying to save money. You can research Ebay items easily enough by Googling them.

[TooeleCherokee]

There are some good sites out there with a ton of strictly backpacking info.. check out http://practicalbackpacking.com (one of my faves).

I am very fond of Gregory backpacks and the adjust-ability of them. Whatever one you get go to a store with a bunch of different backpacks and try them on.. you will probobly average 35lbs for pack weight so grab gear and stick it in there while you are at the store and walk around with it in there. if they won't let you do that or something similar go somewhere else as a empty pack and a weighted pack will sit differently on you :)

I second going with a GOOD tent, I have had a Mountain hardwear "room with a view" since 96(?) with more than 50 nights a year average ranging from blizzards to desert and I just recently (this year) had to put a new coat of waterproofing on it for the first time. - Solo I do like a good Bivy I currently am using a Mil spec bivy and bag and while it is a bit short for my 6'4" self I am OK in it and it keeps the weight down :) then again I have used my Mil spec poncho as a Tarp tent (with or without my hammock ) and had no problems with it.

Sleeping bags. what everyone else has said is good

Stoves I have are the MSR pocket rocket for 8-10 thousand feet, a packafeather alky or my cat eye stove for below 8 thousand feet and a old peak 1 Colman liquid fuel stove for over 10 thousand feet. I don't mind taking a little longer for a meal as I usually have some time to relax at night and in the morning - Im in the woods not rushing :)

the short of it is you have to have enough gear for you to be comfortable but stay light so that you don't feel like you are dragging an elk up the mountain the whole time. I know some people that have a base weight of 10lbs before food and I am not comfortable with the gear they take and they say I take too much.. its all about you man

[cachehiker]

There's not much I can add to what's been said. I only do about 4-5 legitimate nights per year in the backcountry but IMHO the best place to start is with the sleeping bag. Having the right one gets you a better night's sleep and leaves an extra 100 or so cubic inches available in the pack. If your pack still leaves a little something to be desired, go synthetic. If you've got a good pack that will keep the bag dry no matter what, go with down.

#2 would be the tent and #3 (goes against most of the opinions here) would be a solid breathable rain shell. You obviously need a pack but I think actually borrowing a suitable one would be easier that borrowing a sleeping bag (ick!) You can do an overnighter or two without a stove and progress to a trip or two where carrying all your water is no problem but setting up camp totally soaked or after dark because your shell isn't waterproof or doesn't breathe well enough to make good time in a light rain sucks. There's nothing wrong with picking up a stove and the rest a piece at a time as you go. It also makes it more likely that you'll get what will work best for you.

Most of my backcountry nights are done with an old, slightly heavy 3200 in³ pack which is actually plenty of space for two nights here in the Cache Valley. I with it were a hair larger when the 20º bag is called for since it makes more than one night kind of tight. I rarely wish it were smaller but I'm sure I would if I lived 400 miles further south.