Pine Creek

[MiCamp]

Last Thursday four of us went through Pine Creek, it was the first time through for one in the group, the first canyon ever for another and we all had a great time. The weather was perfect and while Zion was stupidly busy, we lucked out and didn’t see another person from when we dropped into Pine Creek until we reached the road.

The canyon was a lot of fun and got off to a cool start when we spotted a desert bighorn sheep on the ledge eight feet above the first pothole. The canyon had a good amount of very cold water in it, except at the beginning which was pretty dry. I wore a 4/3 with 2mm booties, while the others wore drysuits. They stayed warm and I was fine with the exception of one hallway where my feet froze solid.

All of the anchors looked good. The alternate final rappel looks really cool and next time I think I’ll have to try it.

Hope you enjoy the pics.

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[dougr]

Sounds like a May 12 descent won't be doable without suits.

The alternate final rap is the one accessed from the boulder trap door entry?

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[MiCamp]

Yes, the final rap is off the boulder right before the upclimb to the traditional rapell point.
And as far as suits go, dry would be optional by May 12 unless you run cold. Otherwise a wetsuit should suffice.

[oldno7]

Nice report and pics.

Desert Bighorn Sheep

[MiCamp]

Nice report and pics.

Desert Bighorn Sheep

Thanks oldno7, the pictures you post are always simply awesome, and so I really appreciate your thumbs up on my snapshots. And yeah, its a four legged desert something with horns.

[dougr]

Yes, the final rap is off the boulder right before the upclimb to the traditional rapell point.
And as far as suits go, dry would be optional by May 12 unless you run cold. Otherwise a wetsuit should suffice.

Wait, so it sounds like there are 3 final rappels. The one you're describing, one reached via the up climb you reference, and one that is up canyon a few yards. This third one is reached via a rabbit hole entry. The rap starts in a chamber and terminates above the pool that's at the bottom of the traditional final rap.

Aye?

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[ratagonia]

Wait, so it sounds like there are 3 final rappels. The one you're describing, one reached via the up climb you reference, and one that is up canyon a few yards. This third one is reached via a rabbit hole entry. The rap starts in a chamber and terminates above the pool that's at the bottom of the traditional final rap.

Aye?



Haven't seen a rabbit hole big enough for me to fit through there. The "one you're describing" raps into the chamber with the fun downclimb after.

Tom

[ratagonia]

And as far as suits go, dry would be optional by May 12 unless you run cold. Otherwise a wetsuit should suffice.

"past performance does not guarantee future results”

Conditions at some point in the future, like May 12, may or may not allow safe passage without a wetsuit. The canyon is HIGHLY variable. I have not done Pine Creek without a wetsuit (or in winter, a drysuit) in a very long time.

(Helps if I read the quote carefully. One can do Pine Creek in winter with wetsuits, if you wear enough rubber. Or wear a drysuit in warmer conditions, without much insulation underneath. There is not one set of conditions that a drysuit is 'required', and sufficiently thick wetsuits will not work.)

Went down Pine Creek last week. There was a guy and his 10 year old kid just ahead of us at the first rappel. We suited up at the car, and made quite a show of competence when we got there, you know, wearing helmets and all. Professional stuff like that! I meat-anchored the ladies down because the dude had the anchor occupied. Then the kid has a breakdown.

Well, that first rap is kinda awkward and exposed. But maybe it is that the kid was far brighter than his dad. Kid was dressed in a shortee wetsuit 2 sizes too big. Woulda froze, as in, most likely survived, but cold-challenged for sure. In those situations, people often make stupid mistakes. I am very happy they turned around there.

Not sayin' -- but I have seen some very unhappy people in Pine Creek. Nothing like jeans and flannel shirts for a couple cold swims. "Dad said it would be cold, so I wore TWO flannel shirts".

Tom :moses:

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[Brian in SLC]

Yeah, those folks showing up wearing just a shorty wetsuit...tsk tsk...(ha ha).

That glue in anchor we placed in use? With rapide/ring or straight off the bolt?

Amazing what folks do and get away with...

[Scott P]

..

[dougr]

Haven't seen a rabbit hole big enough for me to fit through there. The "one you're describing" raps into the chamber with the fun downclimb after.

Tom


So then how many final raps are there? The chamber one that terminates above the pool and requires a down climb to it, the 99% free hanger that terminates at the pool, and what, another that is reached by an upclimb to somewhere?

[ratagonia]

So then how many final raps are there? The chamber one that terminates above the pool and requires a down climb to it, the 99% free hanger that terminates at the pool, and what, another that is reached by an upclimb to somewhere?

Just the two.

T

[ratagonia]

Yeah, those folks showing up wearing just a shorty wetsuit...tsk tsk...(ha ha).

That glue in anchor we placed in use? With rapide/ring or straight off the bolt?

Amazing what folks do and get away with...

Yup. Useful again. I think there is a Rapide on it. Maybe two.

T

[Cameron7]

The only time I have done Pine...we used the anchor at the final rappel that you step over some flash flooded sand cover material...and if the canyon is behind you its on the front of the boulder on the right side.

It doesn't look like the one above which looks better/prettier and more fun....is it sketchy to get rigged into?

[Iceaxe]

The rope pull on the alternative final rappel can stick ropes if not properly rigged. We often use the alternative rappel when the final rappel is backed up with a long queue of canyoneers waiting their turn for the standard rappel. Often you can just tie off your rope to a big rock and ask someone standing at the back of the standard queue to drop your rope. That makes rigging fast and eliminates any problems.

It's fun to do both final rappels, they are both good and both have their unique charms.

[Cameron7]

So which h is considered the main and which is alternative?

[ratagonia]

So which h is considered the main and which is alternative?

The one described in the book Zion: Canyoneering is the standard rappel. Someone installed bolts for the rappel off the boulder, into the chamber only a couple years ago.

:moses:

[Taylor]

We did the alternate rappel today and I still prefer it. Fun to see the upper chamber and do the down slide in to the pool at the end. Water throughout is still brutally cold (45 deg +/_). I was comfy in 5mm including socks. Wife and friend were ok in 3/4. A couple others were not happy with their shorties. Had one of our party get her hair stuck in her rap device 30' down on the final rap. Tense moments there as she cut her hair free. We are now decompressing at Oscar's as I type.

[Cameron7]

The one described in the book Zion: Canyoneering is the standard rappel. Someone installed bolts for the rappel off the boulder, into the chamber only a couple years ago.

:moses:

just so happens I have this so called Zion: Canyoneering book right here beside me.....

[MiCamp]

Helps if I read the quote carefully.
Tom :moses:


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