Rescue in Chambers

[rockgremlin]

Did this occur in Chambers? Perhaps at the crux nearing the end of the slot?


http://www.ksl.com/index.php?sid=28756711&nid=148&title=woman-rescued-after-8-hours-trapped-in-canyon


[LEFT][COLOR=#000000]
PROVO

[Bootboy]

:facepalm:

[qedcook]

Of course bootboy is going to be the first here to condemn the group to hell as being the biggest idiots ever, without knowing any of the details! And I'm going to be the first to tell everyone to reserve judgement and be kind to the group, without knowing any of the details! Oh, bogley, how I've missed you.

[oldno7]

Was Rick T. there again?:lol8:

[moab mark]

Now that there was funny.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[Bootboy]

Of course bootboy is going to be the first here to condemn the group to hell as being the biggest idiots ever, without knowing any of the details! And I'm going to be the first to tell everyone to reserve judgement and be kind to the group, without knowing any of the details! Oh, bogley, how I've missed you.

Nope.

[Slot Machine]

An easy place to break an ankle and an understandable need to be rescued.

We can only make fun if she was wearing a wedding dress through the canyon.

[tallsteve]

Rebecca is my niece. She is out of surgery and resting comfortably. She had two bad breaks along with some torn tendons. I just saw the post-surgery x-rays. I counted 16 screws. She was with a small group, of which two of the men had done this slot canyon dozens of times and were experienced. Stuff happens. Rebecca is athletic and strong. She just miscalculated the gap and her footing. The weird thing is I first heard of the incident as I was driving in to the office at 7am this morning. I didn't really think anything of it because they didn't say her married name, only her maiden, and I thought surely they would have said her married name if it was the same Rebecca I know.

[Iceaxe]

Steve, thanks for the update and insight.

Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[Iceaxe]

:facepalm:

Yo bootboy.... I hope you realize that sooner or later it's going to be your turn in the barrel.




Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[Bootboy]

I haven't said a word.

You guys act like I'm the only one who is disappointed when these things happen.

[Bootboy]

Am I wrong to be concerned about the potential ramifications that the increasing frequency of these events has for the future of the sport?

[jman]

Am I wrong to be concerned about the potential ramifications that the increasing frequency of these events has for the future of the sport?

I think most people are concerned, yes.

However, in this case, it wasn't a rap accident, knot failure or anchor blowout (and thankfully too), etc. It was a "miscalculation" of a jump and ended up in a bad break.

Many thanks go to the rescue team for doing a great rescue in a remote area!

You ski, right? I think I recall you saying you were on Snow Basin's ski patrol or something like that...Anyway, the point is, people will miscalculate jumps all the time, catch a edge of their snowboard and break or sprain something. So, do we "hide" Skiing from the world and let them figure it out on their own? Or do we rather, tell people to take Ski classes, and to go with experienced people, etc.? I want to believe the latter is the better course of action.

Call me crazy, but I like to believe that MOST people want to avoid getting hurt. And like Shane was indirectly saying, accidents will happen at one time or another. Heck, you might even be the perfect person and never trip in your life, but you may have a buddy who isn't as perfect and trip into you - and make YOU trip over some rocks and bash in your head on a sandstone wall. That's called an accident.

I remember a buddy slipping once in Birch Hollow on a muddy rock and fell backwards and hit his helmet on a rock pretty hard. There could be a few lessons in that I suppose, but he did something which was smart - he wore a helmet that day. He wasn't sure he would of need it, but that slip on that muddy rock would of gave him a good concussion and us a good worry as medical attention would of been at least 4-6 hours away.

I believe the best way to prevent accidents is through education. Not through secrecy (such as trying to "hide" canyoneering from the world) or avoiding the subject altogether. And with education comes repetition. Seeing a correct way to setup a natural anchor numerous times, or changing the way we view bottom-belays as a community (instead of a ego, chest-thumping mentality of "yes, I did it all by myself" to "yea, just like helmets, they can and will save lives") are among MANY things we can do to improve the sport.

While I'm on the subject, another good community change is being objective in beta spraying. I have a few friends, along with hearing people in line at the Zion Backcountry Desk that say things like "oh yeah, sure, the subway is EASY - you don't need any ropes at all," for example. And they explain this to a dad and family who are all neophytes! Crazy! And I'm sure ALL of us, one time or another, have come across this said group in the Subway (as a prime example) who do not have wetsuits, who do not have ANY ropes, and who are all wearing cotton and shivering uncontrollably as their party of 12 tries to downclimb the last rappel!! :crazy: Sure, my friends and I can do the Subway with no ropes - with much potential risk if we "miscalculate" a jump, etc. But that's NOT the way I explain it to others who are going to do it.

But I digress...as I'm preachin to the choir, I'm sure.

[Iceaxe]

Am I wrong to be concerned about the potential ramifications that the increasing frequency of these events has for the future of the sport?

I've been around the sport a while and I don't see an increase in frequency. I'd say the sport has been holding steady per number of canyon days / accidents.

Not saying the accident rate couldn't be improved but I certainly don't see any noticeable increase.

I tend to worry more about the ramifications of accidents in national parks but not so much on BLM or forest service land.




Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[qedcook]

I haven't said a word.

You guys act like I'm the only one who is disappointed when these things happen.

Even though you hadn't said a word, the icon you posted immediately after the thread was started definitely wasn't kind, nor was it neutral or impartial. It was condescending and potentially rude. You can't pretend like you weren't already taking a side on the matter. That simply isn't the case.

[rockgremlin]

Yo tallsteve ---- did the incident occur at the upclimb at the end, or in the middle where the slot opens up into a silo that requires either a short rope, a partner assist......or a dicey jump?


Just curious. I was thinking I could help out the sport if I knew where the incident occurred and go install some bolts there.

[ratagonia]

Yo @tallsteve (http://www.bogley.com/forum/member.php?u=170) ---- did the incident occur at the upclimb at the end, or in the middle where the slot opens up into a silo that requires either a short rope, a partner assist......or a dicey jump?

Just curious. I was thinking I could help out the sport if I knew where the incident occurred and go install some bolts there.

Yeah, as in NOT.

Where would one use a rope in Chambers? I don't know of any spicy downclimbs in there, that some would want to rappel. Any difficult places would be upclimbs and/or across-climbs. Where is there a dicey jump?

Besides, if you put bolts in, I would just have to go take them out.















Yeah, and I know you just trolling. It is my job to take the bait and run with it, as you are surely aware.

My guess is, from above, someone gave her a rope for a handline assist, at the "tough upclimb", and she got partway up, then let go of the rope and dropped back down, landing poorly on the uneven surface. There are two places where there are tough upclimbs.

Tom :moses:

[ratagonia]

Even though you hadn't said a word, the icon you posted immediately after the thread was started definitely wasn't kind, nor was it neutral or impartial. It was condescending and potentially rude. You can't pretend like you weren't already taking a side on the matter. That simply isn't the case.


Hmmmm.

Seems like a lot of that is in the listening, rather than in the speaking.

Tom

[ratagonia]

I think most people are concerned, yes.

However, in this case, it wasn't a rap accident, knot failure or anchor blowout (and thankfully too), etc. It was a "miscalculation" of a jump and ended up in a bad break.

...



Very well said, Jman.

T

[tallsteve]

I don't know the exact spot and I have never been there so I'm not familiar with descriptions. I have not spoken with my niece directly other than some brief correspondence on facebook last night, but in talking with my brother yesterday, she was holding on to a rope trying to get across a gap and, for whatever reason, couldn't hold on and fell 6-8'. She may actually stay with us for a couple of weeks while recovering as she and her husband live in a really small basement apt. in Provo (both BYU students) and she won't be able to manage any stairs for awhile. Her family (my brother) lives in the Atlanta area. When I see her I'll try to get more details.

[rockgremlin]

Yeah, and I know you just trolling. It is my job to take the bait and run with it, as you are surely aware.

My guess is, from above, someone gave her a rope for a handline assist, at the "tough upclimb", and she got partway up, then let go of the rope and dropped back down, landing poorly on the uneven surface. There are two places where there are tough upclimbs.

Tom :moses:


Yup, was just being facetious there with the bolt comment.....and I think you're right about the possible location of the incident.

[SRG]

I was thinking I could help out the sport if I knew where the incident occurred and go install some bolts there.
:roflol:



Steve,
We wish Rebecca a speedy and complete recovery!
Also, she would be doing a great service to the sport if she would post her account of the accident and rescue.

[qedcook]

Hmmmm.

Seems like a lot of that is in the listening, rather than in the speaking.

A picture is worth a thousand words. Do you disagree with any conclusions I arrived at? Do you really think that Bootboy was trying to be understanding and impartial by his post?

[ratagonia]

A picture is worth a thousand words.

not much of a picture. Maybe that one was worth two words: "face palm". :facepalm:


Do you disagree with any conclusions I arrived at?

I disagree with all your conclusions.


Do you really think that Bootboy was trying to be understanding and impartial by his post?

I do not believe that Bootboy provided enough material to draw any conclusions about what he was saying, other than EXACTLY what he said: :facepalm:

:moses:

[qedcook]

I disagree with all your conclusions.


What do you think, Bootboy? Do you think ALL my conclusions were wrong?

[Bootboy]

What do you think, Bootboy? Do you think ALL my conclusions were wrong?

I do not intend to dignify with comment.

[qedcook]

I do not intend to dignify with comment.

Lol, quite the conundrum you've created by replying!

[Jolly Green]

Lol, quite the conundrum you've created by replying!

Seems like you're trying way too hard to make Bootboy look bad and are accomplishing the exact opposite. Why do I feel like I've read this thread before? Anyone wanna camp at Sandthrax?

[Bootboy]

Let's do it! I'm putting my tent next to Christina's.

[Bootboy]

Lol, quite the conundrum you've created by replying!

71973

[Skeeter]

An unfortunate incident. Even more unfortunate is how quickly these threads loose focus...
While we are on the topic, has anyone used the SqWurrl yet?

[Bootboy]

For the record, I was not the one who derailed the thread.

[Slot Machine]

Rebecca is my niece. She is out of surgery and resting comfortably. She had two bad breaks along with some torn tendons. I just saw the post-surgery x-rays. I counted 16 screws. She was with a small group, of which two of the men had done this slot canyon dozens of times and were experienced. Stuff happens.

16 screws? Whoa that is bad! I hope she heals quickly. Most of us have taken some sort of a fall in a canyon and feel lucky to have emerged unscathed.

It is interesting that two experienced canyoneers would bring a rope through Chambers. There isn't really a place where you would assist anyone with a rope.

It would be nice to hear the complete story. Mr. tallsteve gets 1,000 bonus points if he can get Rebecca to post her story on Bogley while she is sitting around healing. :mrgreen:

:popcorn:

[ratagonia]

gets 1,000 bonus points if he can get Rebecca to post her story on Bogley while she is sitting around healing. :mrgreen:



Let's give those bonus points to Rebecca - she might need them...

If you read this Rebecca - start a new thread. This one kinda got spoiled!

:moses:

[Iceaxe]

It is interesting that two experienced canyoneers would bring a rope through Chambers. There isn't really a place where you would assist anyone with a rope.

I always carry a rope when doing anything in the outdoors, including hiking. I've found having a rope a long to be invaluable numerous times.

Alright... I don't actually carry rope but I always have at least 30' of webbing in my possibles bag, which I consider the same thing as a rope.

It's better to have and not need then to need and not have.

YMMV



Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[Slot Machine]

I always carry a rope when doing anything in the outdoors, including hiking. I've found having a rope a long to be invaluable numerous times.

Alright... I don't actually carry rope but I always have at least 30' of webbing in my possibles bag, which I consider the same thing as a rope.

It's better to have and not need then to need and not have.

Normally I'd agree, but the extra baggage fees add up quickly in Chambers, not being a typical 'outdoor destination'. 30 feet of webbing takes up less space than 30 feet of rope. In Chambers every cubic inch of luggage is noticeable. Minimizing the usual possibilities bag beforehand is a must.

More important than space conservation, I don't recall any place in Chambers where a real rope would be useful to protect/assist a partner. I don't bring gear that I'm certain we won't need, so people repeating the canyon, I'd assume, wouldn't bring extra junk either.

However we still don't know the full story... so rope might mean cordage or even webbing, perhaps lost in translation.

[tallsteve]

I took ratagonia's advice and posted Rebecca's account in a separate thread. 1,000 points for me?

[Slot Machine]

I took ratagonia's advice and posted Rebecca's account in a separate thread. 1,000 points for me?

1,000 bonus points, plus a high five! WELL DONE TALLSTEVE! :cool2: :2thumbs:

http://www.maniacworld.com/internet-high-five.jpg

[josiem85]

The man clayton mentioned in your post that has Rebecca's story is my husband. So glad she is ok! We often wonder whathappens to people once they are outta his hands