Advice needed: Powell Canyons

[Erik B]

If one was to rent a houseboat on Lake Powell in Spring with the intent of nailing some less accessible canyons what canyons should one visit?

Depart Bullfrog? Depart Page Area?

Would reservoir height become an issue when considering going ashore?

[Slot Machine]

If one was to rent a houseboat on Lake Powell in Spring with the intent of nailing some less accessible canyons what canyons should one visit?

Tricky question. Admittedly, I don't know much about the lake. However, what I know might help you.

Problem #1: Many of the canyons on the lake are very dangerous. An unusually high percentage of them are X-rated.

Problem #2: For those that want free beta (like me), quality information is very sparse and not very specific, which of course, increases your risk.

Ram knows more about the canyons on the lake than anyone. For free, he will probably tell you if your canyon selection will kill you or not. If you swear yourself (and your team) to secrecy, then I'd bet more is possible.

What canyons on the lake are catching your eye? Can I tag along? :mrgreen:

[Erik B]

What canyons on the lake are catching your eye? Can I tag along? :mrgreen:

Come to think of it...we do need an anchor bounce tester. :bandit:

Thanks for the advice. I'm admittedly naive about the Glen Canyon Area and this is part of my preliminary research.

[Iceaxe]

Some good info here... mostly for the southern end.

Lake Powell Beta
http://www.bogley.com/forum/showthread.php?36896

[Iceaxe]

Problem #1: Many of the canyons on the lake are very dangerous. An unusually high percentage of them are X-rated.

:lol8: I can't believe you bought into the male bovine excrement... I thought you knew this is a scare tactic to keep the unwashed out of the canyons belonging to "The Great Ones (tm)". Yes there are some difficult canyons, but no more then many other places. I mean really how difficult can some of these canyons be when they are regularly descended by senior citizens with mediocre climbing skills? I used to buy into this until I realized the guys doing the canyons were even older than me and most can't climb near my abilities (and I'm mediocre at best). The only thing you really need is a large helping of commonsense.



Ram knows more about the canyons on the lake than anyone.

More then Steve Allen? Dave Black? Joe Wrona? and a few others from the senior canyoneering community? I don't know... just asking.... because I know some of those guys know really a lot....

One of the problems with Powell is it is really dependant on water level, a couple of the popular current canyons don't even exist at full pool. One of our favorite slots at full pool can't be reached from the lake when the level drops 50' below full pool (3650'). Lake level is one of the big reasons I have been reluctant to add many Lake Powell Canyons to the Climb-Utah.com website.

Also a houseboat doesn't work well for Powell without small boat support.

:popcorn:

[Slot Machine]

:lol8: I can't believe you bought into the male bovine excrement... I thought you knew this is a scare tactic to keep the unwashed out of the canyons belonging to "The Great Ones (tm)". Yes there are some difficult canyons, but no more then many other places. I mean really how difficult can some of these canyons be when they are regularly descended by senior citizens with mediocre climbing skills? I used to buy into this until I realized the guys doing the canyons were even older than me and most can't climb near my abilities (and I'm mediocre at best). The only thing you really need is a large helping of commonsense.

More then Steve Allen? Dave Black? Joe Wrona? and a few others from the senior canyoneering community? I don't know... just asking.... because I know some of those guys know really a lot....

One of the problems with Powell is it is really dependant on water level, a couple of the popular current canyons don't even exist at full pool. One of our favorite slots at full pool can't be reached from the lake when the level drops 50' below full pool (3650'). Lake level is one of the big reasons I have been reluctant to add many Lake Powell Canyons to the Climb-Utah.com website.

Also a houseboat doesn't work well for Powell without small boat support.

:popcorn:

:haha:

The X-rated frequency I'll define as 8% -which I still consider to be quite high. I do not know who has been through those canyons, old or young, but I trust that their rating is factual. I'm just as nosy offline as I am online...

Perhaps Allen, Black or Wrona know more. I would be surprised if I were wrong. A higher level of tenacity than Ram's would kill most folks... or at least have them committed. :haha: :crazycobasa:

[jman]

I'll bet Byron would know a thing or too about the area


-Brett

[Byron]

Yeah...I'm pretty familiar with that lake. I've spent months cruising around in my little "canyon access water taxi".

Bullfrog and Wahweap bring totally different experiences...ya gotta pick one or the other. It would be awesome if you could board the boat at Bullfrog and drop it off at Wahweap, as you would be able to see it all, but I don't think they allow that.

First time? I'd say Wahweap and hit the ones that Iceaxe put up that are between the marina and West Canyon, with West being the crown jewel.

My favorite part of the lake is where the San Juan arm comes in...if you have the time to get that far up, let me know and I'll give you some info about the good stuff there. I may be able to buzz down on my Zodiac and show you around.

[Byron]

What's with the picture sizing thing here? Before the upgrade occurred, any attached image would size itself properly. A bit annoying...

[Slot Machine]

Whoa! Nice boat!

Crazy, I was just looking at the Zodiac website a couple of days ago. They seem ideal for Powell canyoneering.

What do you think of your Zodiac? How many horses? If you were to purchase another, would you get a different one?

[Byron]

My boat is the 12' cadet with a 9.9 Honda 4 stroke. I bought it because I live in a condo, and have no place to store a trailer and boat...I wanted something that would fit in the back of my pickup.

Zodiacs are awesome, as they handle the rough water much better than a rigid boat. I've been in water with "teepees" that were 3 feet high, and although it's a wild ride, waves like that would swamp an aluminum boat. The narrows between Bullfrog and Icebox canyon can be pretty dangerous when the wind really kicks up, let me tell ya.

Anyway, the setup is PERFECT for one person. However, if I were to do it again, I'd buy the 15 HP engine. The one I have is great, but with 2 people and all the gear it can kinda dog if you don't pack light.

If you have a place for the trailer, and you don't mind towing it around, then buy an aluminum boat with the most powerful motor you can afford. Otherwise, having it in the back of the truck while you're out doing other things sure is convenient, and the Zodiac is the way to go. Not to say you can't have a bigger inflatable on a trailer, you can.

Below is a pic of Kelsey's setup, along with my boat at the end of Lehi...indeed, water levels can change how you get into or out of a lot of canyons. It's fun being on the lake when it's hot out...hiking, canyoneering and swimming with a "car camping" setup to go to each night. Unlike a speedboat, which requires maintenance and somewhat considerable expense, the Zodiac and engine just sit in a corner of the garage, waiting. Just change the oil every so often and you're good to go.

If your wife isn't into the lake thing (I can't imagine she wouldn't be) then a setup like mine is perfect for solo trips. If you're going to do it together, maybe get my sized boat or a bit longer with the 15 HP motor. That'll do it. You can't put a 25 HP motor on those small Zodiacs, they're just too heavy.

[moab mark]

You better have a lot of time if traveling Powell with a 9 horse motor.:)

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[Byron]

It actually does well...you get the boat up to plane and it moves along at about 25 mph...faster than that when the water is like glass, mornings mostly.

[Iceaxe]

I'm not getting on the lake without 500 cubic inches of blown Chevrolet. It's fun to run from Wahweap to Bullfrog in under an hour :-)

But that's just the way I roll..... no such thing as to much horsepower....



Tap'n on my Galaxy G3

[moab mark]

It actually does well...you get the boat up to plane and it moves along at about 25 mph...faster than that when the water is like glass, mornings mostly.

That's not to bad. Our 12' fishing boat with a 10 horse doesn't do that well. From my experience the best bet is 2 boats or a boat and a jet ski.

[moab mark]

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/lufNOppprleNBcb8VIoAcz1luVixe3zEJpmT-p6gselX=w317-h237-p-no
I've got a trip report on here somewhere from a Powell trip a few years ago. May give you some ideas. Oh and no I do not remember where we went.:haha:

[oldno7]

yep--you'll need a smaller boat if you go on a houseboat trip.

Here's one of mine, it does not go as fast as Byron's and doesn't need to.:mrgreen:

[Byron]

Ahhh...look at you, Kurt! Got a little put put going there, huh? I know what you mean by not needing to be in a hurry.

Time is something to consider with boat choice. If you're only able to hit it on the weekends, then certainly a setup that will cruise at least 40 MPH would be essential. Every time I go to Powell, it's for at least a week, so I'm in no hurry at all.

That said, Zodiacs move along quite quickly when it's on plane with only the ass end of the boat touching the water and that prop spinning. The trick is not to overload it.

[Erik B]

First time? I'd say Wahweap and hit the ones that Iceaxe put up that are between the marina and West Canyon, with West being the crown jewel.

My favorite part of the lake is where the San Juan arm comes in...if you have the time to get that far up, let me know and I'll give you some info about the good stuff there. I may be able to buzz down on my Zodiac and show you around.

Byron:
First off, thank you for the response. You have a series of excellent posts. I love the photos! Our group might have to rent some sort of skiff, raft, or something to transition from the houseboat for the sake of access. ORRRR....I suppose we could rent a speedboat and just camp. This is the annual co-ed trip (not the men's-rough it trip) and I think the ladies of the group were pretty smitten with the idea of luxuries of houseboating. :haha: Unfortunately I'm not a local so all the toys are back in Washington State. Utah vacation home? Yes please...

Question:

What canyons are you referring to when you say "between the marina and West Canyon" and where do you recommend getting Beta on these?

Do you think that Spring water levels would be suitable (albeit cold) for these places?

-Erik B.

[Erik B]

Some good info here... mostly for the southern end.

Lake Powell Beta
http://www.bogley.com/forum/showthread.php?36896

Shane,

Good Stuff! Definitely not quite as meaty as your other beta, but beggars cant be choosers. Thank you!

I'm going to have nightmares tonight of you guys in your 20's using waterski rope in those canyons!!!!!

-Erik B.

[oldno7]

Keep in mind, while you make your decisions.

http://www.nps.gov/glca/planyourvisit/campgrounds.htm

All campsites are required to have a portable toilet unless toilets are available on the vessel or are within 200 yards of the campsite.

[oldno7]

Ahhh...look at you, Kurt! Got a little put put going there, huh? I know what you mean by not needing to be in a hurry.

Time is something to consider with boat choice. If you're only able to hit it on the weekends, then certainly a setup that will cruise at least 40 MPH would be essential. Every time I go to Powell, it's for at least a week, so I'm in no hurry at all.

That said, Zodiacs move along quite quickly when it's on plane with only the ass end of the boat touching the water and that prop spinning. The trick is not to overload it.

We have another boat that we camp out of. We set up camp in a canyon with the larger boat, then use the inflatable to access points in the canyon's. I can't stay put in any area for long, so we usually move camp every day or two.

[Byron]

Eric, in regards to beta...buy Mike Kelseys book "Boaters Guide To Lake Powell". It has all the canyons that would be good for your group. Once you zero in on the ones that you might like to visit, come back in here and between myself and some other guys in here we can give you more details.

I suggest leaving from Wahweap and making West Canyon you destination, you'll probably have time to visit one or two between the marina and West as well...you may want to visit Rainbow Bridge. It's all going to depend on how much TIME you have, as houseboats are quite slow.

I was there with a bunch of friends last year on two houseboats. They rented kayaks to access the canyons. This is essential...in most cases the boat won't get you close enough to start the hikes. If you have more than 5 people, rent two kayaks...get them at the same time you book the boat. Water levels? I wouldn't worry so much about that, as it'll be what it is and you'll just have to deal with it.

Beta on the canyons in that area? Earlier in this thread Iceaxe covered a whole bunch of them. Once you have that book in hand, everything will become much clearer...Byron.

[Scott P]

Yes there are some difficult canyons, but no more then many other places.

There are many easy canyons on Powell, but out of all the regions on the Colorado Plateau, the Powell and Escalante regions do seem to have the highest concentration of difficult canyons.