Done deal: BYU to go independent in football

[accadacca]

Thoughts? How is this better then being with TCU and BSU. I guess they don't want to get owned by BSU every year? :haha:

--

sltrib.com - Brigham Young University will leave the Mountain West Conference, go independent in football and rejoin the Western Athletic Conference in all non-football sports beginning in the fall of 2011, The Salt Lake Tribune confirmed Wednesday morning.

According to a source in the WAC office, BYU will seek final approval for the moves from its owner, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, either today or Thursday. Pending approval, a press conference is planned for early next week. But because of media reports that broke late Tuesday night, that timetable may change.

“In light of the media leaks, it may be expedited a bit,” the source told The Tribune.

BYU’s move to leave the MWC, become a football independent and rejoin the WAC — which it belonged to for nearly four decades before departing with Utah and six other schools to joint the Mountain West — has been in the works for the past month, according to the source.

BYU declined to confirm reports of the pending move. School officials are aware of “the ton of rumors flying around out there,” BYU associate athletic director Duff Tittle said Wednesday morning, but that doesn’t mean the reports have validity regarding the school’s future in the Mountain West Conference.

However, BYU athletic director Tom Holmoe, in a July meeting with reporters, acknowledged that BYU going independent was “an option” the school had been looking at the past six months, along with several other possibilities.

Why?

BYU has repeatedly expressed unhappiness with its paltry television revenue take from the Mountain West Conference. Member schools netted less than $2 million per team in football television money last year from the MWC’s television network.

The pressure on BYU increased when Utah accepted an invitation to join the Pac-10 last month, beginning next year. The Utes could make more than $15 million annually in football television revenue when it achieves full member status in that league.

Not only were the Cougars not invited to join the Pac-10; the Big 12 announced soon after that it had no plans to expand again after losing Nebraska to the Big Ten and Colorado to the Pac-10.

BYU already has its own television network in place and now has a broadcast center to go with it.

According to an espn.com (http://espn.com/) report, the Cougars will play four WAC teams per year in football, presumably including Utah State. The school will also now be free to cut its own television deals with networks like ESPN, and perhaps agreements with bowl games. Football independence could also make it easier to schedule the yearly rivalry game with Utah, given BYU’s increased schedule flexibility.

The Cougars’ pending move could also put the Mountain West’s future in some doubt.

The loss of Utah and BYU, combined with the pending arrival of Boise State next year, leaves the MWC with eight teams. The espn.com (http://espn.com/) report indicated that the Mountain West approached both Fresno State and Nevada about leaving the WAC and joining the MWC. But such a move could be tricky: the remaining WAC schools last week signed a five-year agreement that requires a $5 million buyout for any school seeking to leave the WAC during that span.

Potentially more troubling for the Mountain West: a change-of-mind by Boise State that could return the Broncos to the WAC. The WAC office source confirmed that scenario as a possibility. Boise State would face no penalty if it did wish to return, the source said.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/cougars/50131959-88/byu-football-wac-mountain.html.csp

[Scott Card]

Done Deal? I thought this was only in the rumor phase still. This would certainly be a big surprise. I am not sure how to think on this on. :hmm2:

[live2ride]

HMMMM! Getting interesting around here. Cant wait to see how this pans out.

[Iceaxe]

I don't see this as a "positive" move for the Cougars. I'm thinking the Coug's would be better served to sit tight for a year or two and see how things shake out in College Football .... here are a couple of my thoughts...

The MWC is in pretty good shape to receive an automatic BCS bid if things keep rolling....

I don't see the Big 12 standing pat and the Cougs would be a logical choice.

How is replacing four bottom tier MWC schools with 4 WAC schools an improvement in scheduling?

I don't see this independent move creating anymore excitement for me in the way of watching BYU football. I currently watch all their "big" games.... UTAH, TCU, Air Force, and the one or two big name programs they schedule each year. I was looking forward to watching Boise and BYU each year.

The only independent that is making big money in Notre Dame, and that program is a shadow of its former self and with the NCAA rules put down a few years ago I don't see it ever getting back to one of the elite 5 or 6 schools without joining a conference.

The one big positive is BYU would get their games off that crappy, looks like you are watching the game on a black and white TV in a snow storm television network.

I'm curious to hear what the true blue cougar fans think of the move.

[Kent K25]

I'm neutral on the move until it actually happens and actual details are given.

Anything to get their games off of the Mountain channel is a plus though.

[Iceaxe]

I was just talking with some Hawaii fans.... they are drooling over the thought of BYU's slow corners trying to defend their Run & Shoot offense. :haha:

If BYU wants to make use of their new high dollar HD broadcast capabilities it seems like they should cut a deal with the MTN to produce their own games.

It looks like this is a done deal.... only problem is the news leaked out before BYU was ready for an announcement.

This could be a disaster for the MWC.

And a little FYI... ESPN.com's Andy Katz says this deal hinges on BYU getting an access agreement from the BCS similar to Notre Dame's. Notre Dame gets automatic BCS access with a Top 8 ranking.

[DiscGo]

I once again agree with IceAxe. I am starting to question myself lately because of how frequently I find myself agreeing with Shane and finding him to be logical :)

[accadacca]

I see this as a lateral move at best and I am leaning on them staying in the MWC. I just don't see how this is a good move. There have certainly been some decent factors listed here, but they don't seem significant to me. Its all over the news... :popcorn:

IMO...they wont get BCS access. :nono:

[Iceaxe]

Here is the 2011 schedule they are talking about.... Notre Dame, Navy, Army and Utah..... this will be combined with 4 WAC schools, one of them being Utah State..... with 4 more schools to fill in the holes, two of which you know will be small schools looking for a pay day.....

How is this better then BYU's 2010 schedule that looks like this.... Washington, Air Force, Florida State, Nevada, Utah State, San Diego State, TCU, Wyoming, UNLV, Colorado State, New Mexico, Utah.....

They will also lose any automatic bowl ties and be hunting for an At Large bid every year.

I just get the feeling that BYU should stop the whining and put together a BCS Buster season and the rest of the issues will take care of themselves....

[Iceaxe]

I once again agree with IceAxe. I am starting to question myself lately because of how frequently I find myself agreeing with Shane and finding him to be logical :)

36463

[Rau_Dawg33]

Im a huge BYU fan and I see this as a step up from the MWC.
As far as money is concerned, Their earning potential as an independent will be much greater than the measly 2 million they are currently making.
Also The Mountain just plain sucks. Its been around for four years and never made a profit. This way BYU can put on their their own HD network or work a deal with someone else.
Either way it means more money which leads better recruiting and better football. Can't wait to see this one play out.

I wish september was here already. I need me some football.

[Scott Card]

SOMETHING IS A BREWIN'

MWC just announced invites to Nevada and Fresno.

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=498

:popcorn:

[accadacca]

36487

[Scott Card]

SOMETHING IS A BREWIN'

MWC just announced invites to Nevada and Fresno.

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=498

:popcorn:

Apparentyl they (Nevada and Fresno) have declined.

[trackrunner]

Apparentyl they (Nevada and Fresno) have declined.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a177/schwartzo/blakckid.gif





You left out why. with the WAC concerned more teams my leave and trying to make itself look attractive for the BYU move courtship they forced member schools to sign $5million buy out agreements if a school left within X years (5 I think).
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=5474774

I too agree with both of iceaxe's posts

someone needs to talk them off the ledge. everything is going to be alright. many analyst think the big conferences still haven't settled yet and there may be more adjusting in the coming years.

[Iceaxe]

Apparentyl they (Nevada and Fresno) have declined.

I don't think so..... the official Nevada school website says they will accept..... and FYI... Nevada refused to sign the 5 million buy-out agreement that the WAC sent to their schools. Nevada can move next year with Boise State.

Nevada and Fresno are gone from the WAC.

[Iceaxe]

BYU has just totally screwed all their other sports!

BYU plans to play everything but football in the WAC.... but the WAC now consists of a bunch of schools that are barely a step above high school. I hope BYU's other teams enjoy playing in empty high school gyms.

I just don't see BYU as the national draw that Notre Dame is. Just how big of a TV deal does BYU think they will get from ESPN? I think BYU just shot themselves in the foot. To me BYU is more of a SMU or TCU...

[trackrunner]

I don't think so..... the official Nevada school website says they will accept

I get to use this gif againts myself :wink:

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a177/schwartzo/blakckid.gif

where are you seeing it. here is what I found off their website
http://www.nevadawolfpack.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&DB_OEM_ID=10000&ATCLID=204979537



RENO, Nev. - Regarding the announcement issued this afternoon by the Mountain West Conference, University of Nevada, Reno President Milt Glick offers this statement:

"We are honored to have received the invitation to join the Mountain West Conference. We are seriously considering the invitation, and do so with the best interests of our athletics program, University, community and Wolf Pack fans as our priority."

[Iceaxe]

Fresno St. accepts MWC invitation; Nevada mulling offer

For a minute there, it appeared the Mountain West Conference might be on its death bed.
Not anymore.

Hours after news broke that the Brigham Young Cougars were joining the Utah Utes in abandoning the league they helped create a decade ago, the Mountain West moved swiftly Wednesday to assure its survival by inviting Fresno State and Nevada to join from the Western Athletic Conference.

Fresno State will accept, according to the Fresno Bee, suggesting that Nevada will, as well — though the university president so far has said only that the school is considering the invitation.

While Fresno State will have to pay a $5 million buyout to the WAC if it leaves, under the teams of a deal reached after Boise State announced its plans to depart for the Mountain West next year, the Reno Gazette-Journal is reporting that Nevada never signed the agreement, leaving it free to leave without penalty.

The rest is here: http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/cougars/50134064-88/west-mountain-state-league.html.csp

[accadacca]

I don't see why these two schools wouldn't accept. No brainer if you ask me. I also don't think the MWC would make it public unless they knew the offers were going to be accepted.

BYU might have to walk back to the MWC with their tail between their legs.

[accadacca]

I told a buddy at work this morning that it seemed like desperation. They were desperate to do something, but this isn't the answer.

[accadacca]

Done deal: http://www.themwc.com/genrel/081810aac.html

Mountain West Conference Adds Fresno State and Nevada

Aug. 18, 2010

COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. -

The Mountain West Conference announced tonight that California State University, Fresno and the University of Nevada, Reno have accepted invitations to join the MWC.
"Fresno State is honored to accept the invitation to join the Mountain West Conference," said Fresno State President John Welty. "We look forward to competition against some universities we have not faced previously and to renewing rivalries with San Diego State, Colorado State and several other schools that we enjoyed previously."

"We have had a great experience in the WAC. We have appreciated the strong competition and the wonderful colleagues" said Nevada President Milt Glick. "The offer to join the Mountain West Conference is an opportunity we cannot turn down. The Mountain West is a strong conference and this will enhance our natural rivalry with UNLV and continue our rivalry with Boise State. We believe joining this conference is in the best, long-term interests of our fans and program, and also view this invitation as acknowledgement of our work to build a strong, competitive program."

"The Air Force Academy is pleased to hear that Fresno State and Nevada have accepted our invitation to join the Mountain West Conference," said Lt. General Mike Gould, Superintendent of the United States Air Force Academy and Chair of the MWC Board of Directors. "Both of these schools are great additions to the academic and athletic excellence of the Conference, and we look forward to working with them both on and off the field."

"The addition of Fresno State and Nevada further enhances the Mountain West Conference," said Commissioner Craig Thompson. "Our Board of Directors has continued to be diligent and aggressive in executing our strategy for positioning the MWC in the national landscape. We are excited to welcome these two institutions into the Mountain West. Both fit geographically and create new Conference rivalries."

The Mountain West Conference was founded with eight members in 1998. TCU joined the Conference in 2005 and Boise State University accepted an invitation to the league on June 11, 2010.

[trackrunner]

on the comment boards byu fans are claiming this was the plan all along and that utah wanted to go independent too but had to settle for the pac 10. they also claim tcu & bsu are following to the wac

[elkshadow]

[demotivational poster]
College. It's not about learning anymore.
[/demotivational poster]

Actually, come to think of it, was it ever?

[accadacca]

on the comment boards byu fans are claiming this was the plan all along and that utah wanted to go independent was too but had to settle for the pac 10. they also claim tcu & bsu are following to the wac

Yeah right...sounds like zoobie comments. :lol8:

[Ryebrye]

If TCU and BSU go to the WAC, Fresno and Nevada would stay in the MWC?

Yeah, the other sports will play crap teams, but none of those other sports make money - ever. Football is the big daddy, and pays for every other athletic program. When daddy gets a new job out of state, the kids gotta go move too and make friends in a new school... (Although yeah, most of the time the daddy's do consider their kids when they make career moves, but in this case I can't imagine that the other sports got any consideration at all)

Maybe BYU saw Boise's strategy the past few years: Play a bunch of weak teams and easily go undefeated for several years, prepare a lot to beat the one tough team you face in a bowl game - and watch as the nation kisses your rear end and moves you up in the ranks. If BYU goes independent and schedules a Boise-strength schedule and goes undefeated for a few years, maybe they too can be overhyped and overranked!

[accadacca]

As a fan this doesn't excite me. Money is money, but I don't see this making BYU better. For me it's about what's on the field and what chance my team has to be national champs or play in big games...not play in high school stadiums on ESPN.

[Iceaxe]

And its yet to be seen if this move is better financially for BYU..... it depends on what type of TV deal they can work out with ESPN....

Right now BYU reminds me of the girl that thinks she is a 10, but is really only a 6....

[Scott Card]

Craig Thompson made a heady move by quickly bringing in Nevada and Fresno and effectively gutting the WAC. I can't see BYU being particularly happy with that treatmente but, it is what it is. Your move BYU......:popcorn:

[Iceaxe]

Craig Thompson made a heady move by quickly bringing in Nevada and Fresno and effectively gutting the WAC.

It was the move he had to make.... but I don't think it as the move he wanted to make.... Nevada and Fresno bring little to the table...... I think the MWC was planning on sitting back for a year or two, enjoying what is/was a descent conference and seeing what played out elsewhere... something was going to give..... qualifying for an automatic BCS berth or something changing in the Big 12. I don't see the Big 12 standing pat, that conference will either blow up or expand to 12 teams. The Big 12 is leaving too much money on the table without a conference championship game.

As an independent your season is totalled with your first loss.... no conference Championship to play for... Army and Navy are independents but they are always playing for the Commander in Chief trophy along with Air Force, which is almost a small conference among the military.

[Scott Card]

My other thought was that BYU leaked this mess to the media to force the MWC to get Nevada and Fresno and also to bust up the mess that is the TV contract. So many theories floating out there. Again....:popcorn:

[Iceaxe]

My other thought was that BYU leaked this mess to the media to force the MWC to get Nevada and Fresno and also to bust up the mess that is the TV contract. So many theories floating out there. Again....:popcorn:

How is adding Nevada and Fresno a plus for BYU if they stay in the MWC?

And BYU was the 800-pound gorrilla in the MWC room.... they could have probably demanded the right to produce their own TV and got it..... one other interesting note. BYU was the biggest proponent of the MWC establishing its own TV network. If it were not for BYU leading the charge, the crappy MTN would probably not exist.

[moab mark]

Aug. 18, 2010

COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. -

The Mountain West Conference announced tonight that California State University,

Who?

Edit I just went back and looked at it again. Is thats Fresno's official name?

[Iceaxe]

I'll tell you who I feel sorry for.... Utah State!

They are just starting to get their program back on track and now this.... New Mexico St, Idaho, La Tech, San Jose St, and Hawaii. That has to be THE WORST football conference in history!

Now.... if the MWC can only figure out a way to get San Diego St to jump to the WAC.

[Iceaxe]

Who?

Edit I just went back and looked at it again. Is thats Fresno's official name?

Yes... both Fresno State and San Diego State are California State University... along with a bunch of others....

California State University Bakersfield
California State University Channel Islands
California State University Chico
California State University Dominguez Hills
California State University East Bay
California State University Fresno
California State University Fullerton
Humboldt State University
California State University Long Beach
California State University Los Angeles
California Maritime Academy
California State University Monterey Bay
California State University Northridge
California State Polytechnic University, Pomona
California State University Sacramento
California State University San Bernardino
San Diego State University
San Francisco State University
San Jose State University
California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo
California State University San Marcos
Sonoma State University
California State University Stanislaus

[moab mark]

How about the BYU basketball program. Let's see I could go to Utah and play, say Stanford or sign with the Cougars and play La Tech. I would think Rose is spitting bullets.

[moab mark]

Yes... both Fresno State and San Diego State are California State University... along with a bunch of others....

California State University Bakersfield
California State University Channel Islands
California State University Chico
California State University Dominguez Hills
California State University East Bay
California State University Fresno
California State University Fullerton
Humboldt State University
California State University Long Beach
California State University Los Angeles
California Maritime Academy
California State University Monterey Bay
California State University Northridge
California State Polytechnic University, Pomona
California State University Sacramento
California State University San Bernardino
San Diego State University
San Francisco State University
San Jose State University
California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo
California State University San Marcos
Sonoma State University
California State University Stanislaus

Hey the COUGS could play all of them.:lol8:

[moab mark]

ESPN is talking about it right now

[trackrunner]

poor utah state. their loyalty missed the boat

http://www.utahstateaggies.com/genrel/081910aab.html





Recently, Utah State, under President Stan Albrecht's strong leadership, played a major role in exploring the possibility of bringing BYU into the WAC. As of Tuesday, BYU was on the verge of joining the WAC in all sports but football. . .

[snip]

WAC members signed a letter of commitment that included a $5M membership buyout. When the possibility of BYU leaving became known, MWC leadership contacted three WAC members inquiring about their interest in joining the MWC. Utah State was the first of these three contacts.

At the point in time when Utah State was contacted by the MWC we had a binding agreement with the WAC and were well positioned with nine members, which included BYU. We were simply committed to uphold our agreement with fellow WAC members. We respectfully declined MWC interest and believed all WAC members would remain committed to our agreement.



wow

[Iceaxe]

So Utah State was insturmental in brokering a deal to bring BYU to the WAC?????

Sounds like Utah State is getting what they deserve.... we reap what we sow.

[Scott Card]

It would have made sense particularly in Basketball. Stew Morell (sp?) has a great program. BYU wouldn't have been in the league for football.

[Iceaxe]

Dang.... Utah State is doing some major whining because they made a BAD choice.... bitching about the others being "unethical" is bullshit.... you do what's best for you and your school..... Fresno will end up paying big money to leave the WAC, I fail to see how that is unethical, they signed an agreement with a buy-out clause, and now they have decided to exercise the buy-out clause. I see nothing wrong with that. And the WAC threatening to sue NV for 5 mil, even though they never signed is laughable. If it's not written down, it didn't happen....

I don't see the MWC bitching about it being unethical that the WAC was courting BYU. Of course the MWC just pounded the snot out of the WAC for what they attempted to do....

Utah State is just pissed because they had big visions of going to the dance with BYU on their arm, but now end up at the dance with their fat ugly redneck cousin.

[accadacca]

Couple new articles if you haven't read them: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=5479730

BYU's schedule for 2011 was...

• BYU at Texas
• BYU at Oregon State
• BYU at Fresno State
• BYU at Hawaii
• Utah State at BYU
• Nevada at BYU
• San Jose State at BYU
• New Mexico State at BYU
• Utah at BYU?




Another... http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=5479944

[CarpeyBiggs]

here are some of my thoughts, though admittedly i'm distant from the college football scene nowadays. i'll simply echo the thoughts of the honorable bucko from cougarboard.


1) BYU has not said or done anything, everything is still rumor and speculation.

2) If all the Rumor & Speculation happens to be true, only ONE team in the MWC has the right to be ticked off at BYU, that's TCU. They have held their own, and honestly would be able to go it on their own if they did not live in the shadows of Texas, TAMU & TT.

3) The teams that have the least to complain about .. UNLV, WYO, SDSU, CSU. You guys have not been carrying your weight for a long time, and hairball constantly caters to you. You have been riding this gravy train long enough, and time to put out or get out.

4) USU got jobbed by their loyalty. They should be ticked at Fresno & UNR because thats who jobbed them, not BYU.

5) Something tells me that BYU will be going to bat for USU whenever and as often as that opportunity presents itself. USU probably just secured themselves a long run of home & homes with BYU, and I imagine BYU will be helping out in anyway possible.

6) I dont want to hear BYU fans complain about playing USU anymore. They stuck up for us, time to stick up for them.

7) I HATE UNR, and hope they get demolished on a regular basis. The sooner that program folds up and disappears the better. They have screwed us over more than once. I am still ticked off about the canceled game on short notice, and the recent events are only icing on the cake.

8) Boise State, I still have no love for you. You have no right to complain one way or another. I do credit you for taking charge of your own destiny. Now pick up the pace of your other programs.

9) BYU should still do whats best for BYU. The only 3 MWC/WAC teams I believe deserve some loyalty from BYU. Those are TCU for carrying their own weight, USU out of the principle of KARMA, and AFA for being a class act regardless and making an honest effort at contributing.

10) Utah, I have no disrespect either. You carried your weight in the MWC, and you got your reward. Good job. To the Ute fans, your team just got bumped up a level in the BCS social class, try and do the same for yourselves. You have a great team, time for some of the trailer trash fans you have to change their game. You say your elite . . start acting like it.

[Iceaxe]

I'll take exception to is this...


1) BYU has not said or done anything, everything is still rumor and speculation.

That should read BYU has not done anything "officially".... because BYU did do something, they did a lot, and its well documented.... they tried to work out a better deal for themselves and it fell apart, and it could cost them in the end.

Now I have no problem with BYU trying to work out a better deal for themselves, but they certianly can't stand innocently on the sideline and say they didn't do anything....

[Kent K25]

I'll take exception to is this...



That should read BYU has not done anything "officially".... because BYU did do something, they did a lot, and its well documented.... they tried to work out a better deal for themselves and it fell apart, and it could cost them in the end.

Now I have no problem with BYU trying to work out a better deal for themselves, but they certianly can't stand innocently on the sideline and say they didn't do anything....

I agree with the addition of "officially" but think you're nitpicking here...pretty sure that "officially" is what he/she intended in the first place.

[Iceaxe]

I agree with the addition of "officially" but think you're nitpicking here...pretty sure that "officially" is what he/she intended in the first place.

I don't see it as nit-picking.... BYU did a lot.... what BYU did is why the WAC is now on its death bed and why the MWC has added two more teams they really didn't want.... I just finished watching the interview on KSL with Utah States AD.... and BYU was into everything up to their elbows..... the only thing BYU didn't do was issue any public statements or sign any agreements.... they did agree in principle to join the WAC....

[CarpeyBiggs]

keep dreaming iceaxe. byu did nothing wrong to the WAC. if we used your same logic, we could blame this on the U, since they screwed over the MWC, hence leading to the domino effect in the conferences. (which of course, is ludicrous.)

byu was trying to STRENGTHEN the wac. take off your anti-byu goggles for two seconds. they wanted the WAC, had no intention of destroying it. the fact UNR and FSU broke their word is why the WAC is on the death bed, it is not because of BYU....

[Iceaxe]

keep dreaming iceaxe. byu did nothing wrong to the WAC.

:roll: I never said BYU did anything wrong to anyone.... In fact I said the exact oppiste.... BYU tried to improve their lot in life, which I have no problem with.

But to say BYU did "nothing" is a miss-statement because they did do something.... they did a lot of somethings...


and FWIW: Utah State is now asking to join the MWC.

[trackrunner]

reports that Fresno was very involved in BYU's football scheduling and wanted assurances to play BYU regularly before jumping ship

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogs/byusports/50152838-65/byu-interesting-independence-conference.html.csp

[Iceaxe]

So... lets see how smart you guys really are when it comes to college football..... As of noon today the news is currently split about even..... 50% is reporting BYU stays in the MWC while 50% is reporting that BYU goes independant....

My money is on BYU staying in the MWC.

Lets hear your best guess....

:cool2:

[Scott Card]

My money is on BYU staying in the MWC.

:cool2: Not knowing what phone calls are being made, what deals have or have not been made, I would agree that they stay put.... for now.

[accadacca]

Staying where they belong... :lol8:

[Iceaxe]

Staying where they belong... :lol8:

:roflol: :roflol: :roflol:

FYI: There is a really good story in todays SL Trib about everything that went on behind the scene. A bunch of wheeling and dealing....

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/sports/50175456-77/wac-byu-albrecht-benson.html.csp

Honestly I wish BYU would get an invite to the Big 12, but I don't see that happening. Too many philosophical differences. They will be skipped for the same reason the PAC 10 skipped them. And this is the one time you can say it isn't/wasn’t all about money, because from a purely money aspect BYU would bring in more then Utah. Bigger stadium, larger fan base, more history, yada, yada

[CarpeyBiggs]

i see no way that byu stays in the mwc now. hair has screwed them one too many times. and byu, sans utah, has nothing to stay for. the conference is now weaker than ever. and byu will be subsidizing everyone else.

i am confident byu goes indy. probably to the detriment of their other sports. probably still go to the wac with other sports, and try to get a few defectors to go with them.

if they stay in the mwc, it will be the darkest day as a byu fan ever. even worse than the crowton years. it disgusts me just thinking about it.

[CarpeyBiggs]

Too many philosophical differences. They will be skipped for the same reason the PAC 10 skipped them.

philosophical differences? nah, my personal opinion is there are few. sunday play? that's an easy workaround, always has been.

imo, the biggest reason the pac 10 skipped over BYU is because mormons feel an urge to meddle in the political affairs of the state of california. can you imagine the firestorm that adding BYU would bring? it would be ugly. that, combined with the fact they only needed two teams, and they wanted to hurt the big 12 in the process (hence colorado), and byu was never even considered.

however, those scenarios don't exist in the big 12. if anything, BYU is a much better fit in the big 12 than they would've been in the pac10, simply because of the desire for independent tv production. still, doesn't mean they will ever get an invite.

[Reedus]

Hmmm, gonna have to disagree. Highly doubt the Pac 10 gives a mouse fart about what the LDS thinks about gay marriage

philosophical differences? nah, my personal opinion is there are few. sunday play? that's an easy workaround, always has been.

imo, the biggest reason the pac 10 skipped over BYU is because mormons feel an urge to meddle in the political affairs of the state of california. can you imagine the firestorm that adding BYU would bring? it would be ugly. that, combined with the fact they only needed two teams, and they wanted to hurt the big 12 in the process (hence colorado), and byu was never even considered.

however, those scenarios don't exist in the big 12. if anything, BYU is a much better fit in the big 12 than they would've been in the pac10, simply because of the desire for independent tv production. still, doesn't mean they will ever get an invite.

[CarpeyBiggs]

reedus, you are my favorite. always so eloquent. :hail2thechief:

but i'm not going to debate it with you. you are mormon, of course you won't believe it.

shane is right though about the pac 10. too many philosophical differences. the power players for the conference are in california. draw your own conclusions. hence, why they should go independent and flip everyone else the metaphorical bird. :lol8:

however, in the big 12, i think it's less of an issue. but it still doesn't mean they'll get an invite.

[Iceaxe]

After reading todays news I'm changing my best guess to "the Cougs are going independant".

The LDS chruch has given BYU the green light to "do what they think is best" for the program and the chruch.

[Scott Card]

After reading todays news I'm changing my best guess to "the Cougs are going independant".

I agree but the question is when. Seems they are running out of time with the Sept 1 deadline fast approaching.

[Iceaxe]

I expect a BYU news conference Wenesday morning.....

But I'm still not seeing this as a great move.... half of BYU's games will still be against crappy WAC teams.... and to me, crappy MWC teams are a better show then crappy WAC teams..... One positive is I can see a home/home series with Notre Dame late in the season becoming a regular deal. Maybe same with Navy which would offset the loss of Air Force.

[accadacca]

This has to be a huge distraction during game week. I really expected an announcement by last week at the latest.

[CarpeyBiggs]

they are going to wait until the last second, for the same reason that it fell apart last time. byu is gonna keep their mouths shut...

[Iceaxe]

This has to be a huge distraction during game week.

I doubt the BYU players or coaches give it a second thought.... they are busy preparing for UW. To a player or coach next year is forever...



they are going to wait until the last second, for the same reason that it fell apart last time. byu is gonna keep their mouths shut...

Have you been following the emails between the presidents? I find it very interesting. Word is it was Conference USA that tipped off the MWC to what was about to happen and scuttled the last deal.

[CarpeyBiggs]

yeah, i read that. sounded like a courtesy call from the wac to cusa or some such.

interestingly enough, it doesn't appear to be BYU who started the mess. the WAC approached them... i guarantee BYU is doing the approaching now though. probably doing everything they can to get 12 teams on the football schedule for next year, is my bet.

[CarpeyBiggs]

well, they did it. BYU to go football INDY, and WCC for all other sports...

[accadacca]

Done deal.

IMO its desperation and a HUGE risk...

[accadacca]

The Notre Dame of the West... :haha:

[Iceaxe]

All I can say is over 50 teams have taken the independent path at one time or anther and only 3 (now 4) are still at it. There is a reason for that.... I don't begrudge BYU for wanting to improve their program.... I just don't think this is the ticket....

So.... who are the powerhouse teams in the WCC.... Salt Lake Community College, Steven Henager, and Utah College of Massage?

[CarpeyBiggs]

desparation? how do you figure? certainly not desperation for the football team, or really even basketball.

also, who knows how it will play out. guaranteed, it's better than the mtn deal they've been under. they stand to make much more money. the real question is, when they schedule the big time teams, can they win? that's debatable. i expect we'll hear next years schedule details at the press conference tomorrow. i wouldn't be surprised if notre dame is on there. texas, notre dame, utah, USU, perhaps hawaii, and even if you fill it in with some pansies, that still a very respectable schedule.

i think, however, it's safe to say this is a temporary move. maybe only a few years. there's a lot that can change in the whole college football scene. and while it's not even close to getting a big 12 or pac 10 invite, it puts BYU in the position for BYU. now all they have to do is win.

[accadacca]

I believe they were desperate to do something after Utah decided to leave the MWC. IMO, they are in jeopardy of becoming the little brother in the state...give it 10 years.

Explain this (I would really like to know others opinions): How does this makes BYU Football a better product on the field and position them to play in BCS bowls and have a shot at a National Championship? Money is great don't get me wrong, but as a fan I care about what my team puts on the field. It is nice to know Utah will get more money in the Pac-12 and they can throw that around. Yet, as a fan I am clearly the most excited about Utah Football becoming a better product and attending games where the full package (both teams) are a better product collectively. Lets not forget that Utah will be in a BCS conference, so they can actually win a National Championship (even with a loss). This will probably never happen, but it is now possible. :popcorn:

[CarpeyBiggs]

no doubt, they had to leave the MWC for obvious reasons. they aren't "desperate" because anything the U did. but in the past, both those teams were committed to resolving these situations together, as they both succeeded with each other. the U did what was in their best interest, so now BYU is doing what's in theirs. in no way did it leave BYU "desperate," even though it must give you the warm fuzzies to think the U somehow dealt BYU a knockout punch. definitely not the case.

BYU is an entirely different animal than the U. In no way do they resemble the U, or vice versa, except the fact they both play in the state of Utah and have long been rivals. but, ultimately, the church decides what BYU's course is. and the money is not the primary motivation. nor is a national championship or BCS berth. those are possible byproducts of what the church ultimately wants, and that is EXPOSURE. they want to control their own product.

as for actual BCS appearances, I don't think it is really even on BYU's radar right now, to be honest. i imagine, though i am without facts to support me today, that they will be scheduling some very big teams in the next few years. teams with home and home's like Texas, ND, and a handful of other big 12 teams who now have schedule vacancies because of nebraska and colorado leaving. there is plenty of room for them to find a big schedule. and those products, when BYU controls them, are worth more money than a BCS berth is. especially when you consider, in a non-AQ conference, you essentially have to go undefeated in order to get those berths.

so, while a berth would be great exposure, nationally televised games on ESPN with teams like Texas, or ND, or Texas Tech, or Clemson, or whoever will be more worthwhile, overall.

remember, BYU is about furthering the church's agenda. that is their sole reason for even existing.

so while i know utah fans will want to think it's all about being second fiddle now, it really has little to do with them. two totally different institutions, two totally different styles of student athletes, two totally different end-games. no one will argue that utah has made a solid move up. it's a given. byu's is not a given. there's a lot that has to be learned on the fly. but the difference is, BYU has the resources that no other indy football team has ever had, and they think they can make it work. (remember, these are the same people making this decision as those who lead the LDS church, the board of trustees is not run by an AD or college president, it is run by the 12 in salt lake)

you can sit there and make predictions now about who is going to be the best, or whatever, but the bottom line is you really don't know at this point.

[accadacca]

More money, exposure, yadda, yadda...

Everyone is guessing at this point and giving their opinion. You have only named one school that BYU currently has scheduled.


remember, BYU is about furthering the church's agenda. that is their sole reason for even existing.
I don't buy it, at least not yet. I understand that the LDS church has a different strategy and you made some good points about that. Yet, it has never seemed to me that they have focused on the strategy (in sports) that you described. It has been about winning conference championships, BCS bowls and another National Championship. Those words have come out of Broncos mouth over the years and have been team goals as well. Maybe they are working toward a new strategy?

Again, nobody knows everything...that's what these damned message boards are for. :lol8:

[Iceaxe]

so, while a berth would be great exposure, nationally televised games on ESPN with teams like Texas, or ND, or Texas Tech, or Clemson, or whoever will be more worthwhile, overall.

My biggest thought is what big schools will want to schedule BYU if they have a strong program? The newest trend is to schedule cupcakes for your out of conference schedule to not mess up your rankings and ruin your chance at big bucks.

The first indication of what this move does for the program will be National Letter of Intent day.... you have to have the players, it will be interesting to see if the kids buy into the new product. It appears most the BYU fans are jumping on the bandwagon, which is a good sign.

So far the big loser in all this is Utah State....

[CarpeyBiggs]

I don't buy it, at least not yet. I understand that the LDS church has a different strategy and you made some good points about that. Yet, it has never seemed to me that they have focused on the strategy (in sports) that you described.

please explain how it is any different than what i have suggested? hey, this isn't what i believe, this is what the church says it is. and like i said, the 12 make the calls on it, not the atheist fans like me...


It has been about winning conference championships, BCS bowls and another National Championship. Those words have come out of Broncos mouth over the years and have been team goals as well. Maybe they are working toward a new strategy?

BYU has scheduled texas and utah will definitely be on there. the rest is a guess, until we find out tomorrow. but like i said, BYU wouldn't do this if they didn't know they had an ESPN partnership, and if they didn't have some significant ways to get exposure.

you are wrong, however, about bronco claiming it's about winning. in fact, he rarely speaks like that. i wish he would. he has implied it, but even his quirky sayings like "quest for perfection" and "band of brothers" and "fully invested" are not about winning, according to him. it's about recruiting the right kind of student athlete, and helping them develop into something "bigger than football." which is why they will always field a different type of team than the U. winning is a byproduct. you may or may not believe it, but that is definitely the case. that is why byu has strict academic and moral codes that have to be adhered to. otherwise we'd have unga playing running back this year... :haha:

case in point - ricks college sports. they were consistent winners, even national champs, and always popular on campus. they were done away with because why? they didn't further the mission of the church. that is the bottom line.

i will make a prediction though. when we find out what the 2011 schedule is, it will be a huge upgrade from the mwc schedule. there will be some big names in there, but you are right, until we have confirmation, no one knows the schedule.

[CarpeyBiggs]

My biggest thought is what big schools will want to schedule BYU if they have a strong program? The newest trend is to schedule cupcakes for your out of conference schedule to not mess up your rankings and ruin your chance at big bucks.

big bucks? they can come from other games besides the BCS. why did oklahoma play BYU last year? because both teams made almost as much as they would've by playing in a BCS game. and teams will play games they might lose for a couple reasons. one - it's OOC, so if you lose, you can still win your league and get a BCS berth. two - those teams who are confident enough to win national championships don't care who they schedule. they believe they will win every game.

the only teams scheduling cupcakes are those who are not AQ conferences. teams like BSU, even though they occasionally get a "big" game. teams who are in big boy conferences already play plenty of tough games. and they will likely play even more when there is exposure (national audience on ESPN?) and good money on the line. because guess what, if you win, your stock skyrockets... (look at what happened to BYU last year after they beat oklahoma.)

[Iceaxe]

Ouch.... this is going to hurt.....

Some great arenas for BYU's basketball program:

Capacity:

Pepperdine: 3,100

Portland: 4,852

Loyola: 4,156

San Diego: 5,100

Santa Clara: 4,500

Gonzaga: 6,000

St. Mary's: 3,500

San Fran: 5,300

My High School had a larger capacity then two of those. Of course its hard to say much.... Utah's basketball program belongs in the Big Sky, or maybe 5A.

[CarpeyBiggs]

evidence again that BYU doesn't look at this in any other terms than getting the most exposure out of it's most visible program. playing in the wcc will hurt.

however, playing the wcc on ESPN will be nice! (wcc already has a deal with ESPN)

[accadacca]

They better find a way to light up those gyms. I have seen a few USU games in these high school bleacher gyms and it is so dark on TV. You can't see a thing.

[Iceaxe]

I'm curious to hear the details, which should come out tomorrow at the news conference.

Without a doubt.... The best part of this deal is every game in HD! :2thumbs:

[Iceaxe]

They better find a way to light up those gyms. I have seen a few USU games in these high school bleacher gyms and it is so dark on TV. You can't see a thing.

The seating might be small but the gym's are not dumps.

Heck, have you ever seen Pepperdine's campus? It might be the nicest campus in the country, and the other schools are not dogs...

Pepperdine
36967


Santa Clara
http://www.devcon-const.com/Images/Sports/SCU%20Leavey%20TI%203%20copy2.jpg

[Scott Card]

ESPN to televise all home games, 6 game series in the next 9 years with Notre Dame..... this is starting to shape up nicely. And all the other sports teams get to travel to the coast for all conference games.... 2 hour flight at the most. Oh and no more Laramie...

[CarpeyBiggs]

not ALL home games will be broadcast. they have the right to pick them up, but they are only guaranteed 4 games, one of which is on ESPNU, the others will depend on the caliber of game...

the real kicker though is all the BYUtv concessions, and the fact that ESPN never has to bring a truck to Provo. I'm sure BYU makes plenty of cash because of that arrangement as well.

[accadacca]

not ALL home games will be broadcast. they have the right to pick them up, but they are only guaranteed 4 games, one of which is on ESPNU, the others will depend on the caliber of game...
Also the caliber of BYU that year. If they suck or are playing suck dog state... In this case it'll be ESPNU...not even sure if I have that channel, need to check.

[accadacca]

It looks like I don't have ESPNU on my package (Comcast) and if I did it wouldn't be in HD. Hmmm. Does anyone else have this channel in HD?

[ibenick]

It looks like I don't have ESPNU on my package (Comcast) and if I did it wouldn't be in HD. Hmmm. Does anyone else have this channel in HD?

DirecTV has it in HD, channel 208.

[accadacca]

Hell, I need to look around and compare prices. I've been on crapcast for years...just can't be bothered to investigate. I should resurrect a Bogley post and ask what everyone has and what they pay.

[Iceaxe]

Hell, I need to look around and compare prices. I've been on crapcast for years...just can't be bothered to investigate. I should resurrect a Bogley post and ask what everyone has and what they pay.

No comparision.... Direct TV is much better then Comcast.... my brother just made the switch and then spent 15 minutes bitching at me for not making him switch before now.

Basically he said his costs dropped $30 per month for roughly the same package ($130 down to $100 approximately) and his picture is better (something about Comcast compresses their signal to jam more stations over the line and it hurts quality, particularly in HD).

Also.... if you (or anyone else) is going to switch hit me up sideband and there is a way we can BOTH make $100 off the deal through an incentive program.

:cool2:

[trackrunner]

so I was thinking about this. with a high profile opponent with Notre Dame game do you think there is a chance they play at a nuteral site and sell the TV rights. some place with a lot of mormons and cathlolics. perhaps phoneix or s.cali?

[Iceaxe]

so I was thinking about this. with a high profile opponent with Notre Dame game do you think there is a chance they play at a nuteral site and sell the TV rights. some place with a lot of mormons and cathlolics. perhaps phoneix or s.cali?

Why would you want to do that?

Home and Home is a much better deal, they both have large stadiums that will sale out and you get two sold out games instead of one.

Heck, University of Phoenix Stadium only seats 63,000. Both ND (81,000) and BYU (64,000) are bigger stadiums.

Both teams are also already tied into TV contracts, I doubt their current TV partners would be happy about losing a game or having to pay a second time for something they already own. I don't see this ever happening.

[CarpeyBiggs]

the teams don't pay for it. the neutral site owner does, in exchange for the gate. the tv deals makes up the rest. see byu-oklahoma last year. byu made something like 3 million in that game.

word is miami is going to play a big name team in yankee stadium soon, or some such like that. i think neutral site games can be interesting.

however, i don't see it happening all that often.

[CarpeyBiggs]

but, the ND deal is 4 south bend, 2 in provo. so, byu didn't get THAT sweet of a deal. it's just playing ND.

[Iceaxe]

but, the ND deal is 4 south bend, 2 in provo.

Ouch! I hate two for ones. If you consider yourself a top tier program I don't think you should make that deal.

I've been really busy this past week and still haven't found the time to read exactly what the BYU going indy deal contains. All I really know is what the idiots on Sports Talk jabber about.

[CarpeyBiggs]

i don't think byu pretends to think it is "top tier" at this point. they are scheduling 5 wac teams next year, afterall. they just intend to make money off of the deals is all.

so, i think there is an element of BYU knowing they will have to make concessions if they want to schedule a long series with a team like ND. bottom line still stands though, they have to WIN. or else it's all a failed experiment.

[trackrunner]

this process got me thinking. perhaps a promotion/relegation pyramid system is needed in college football and basketball. bottom two teams from a big conference are relegated to a mid major conference top two mid major teams promoted to big conference. all other olympic sports stay in their conference.