Buying my first Jeep

[teancum]

OK so last week I kind of put the front of my truck into the back of someones car... Long story short... My truck is totaled and I am getting some insurance money to buy a new vehicle. I have always wanted to own a jeep and now is a good of time as any.

I found some Jeeps on KSL and just wanted to know what you guys thought:

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?sid=0&nid=443&tab=list/view&ad=2946294
http://www.ksl.com/index.php?sid=0&nid=443&tab=list/view&ad=2943156
http://www.ksl.com/index.php?sid=0&nid=443&tab=list/view&ad=2886522
http://www.ksl.com/index.php?sid=0&nid=443&tab=list/view&ad=2945318

I really like the first one... but was not sure on it.

[oldno7]

Nobody is ever happy with the 4 cyl. I'd holdout for a 6.
Nice to see your looking at YJ's

[snccoulter]

Get a 6 cylender you will hate the 4. I have had may jeeps and get ready to (J)ust (E)mpty (E)very (P)ocket they like to leak/wear out and rust in all sorts of fun places. But they are a lot of fun enjoy. lifting them and doing the work your self is a lot of fun.

[teancum]

Thanks for the update... I was looking almost extensively at 4 cyl to try to save on gas mileage. I will try my hardest to hold off until I can find a good 6 cyl Wrangler.

[fourtycal]

I have had 5 jeeps over the years and the 4.0 inline six is a good engine, strong, good power and fair fuel mileage. Now if they just could have built a decent truck around it :ne_nau: :mrgreen:

Really at that price point you can expect to do some work on it but that's half the fun eh:2thumbs:

post up what you end up with.

[teancum]

OK I just took my first my first test drive on a jeep wrangler... It was a 2002 that had a lift on it (don't know how big) and some bigger tires... 35x11.5R15 I think... Overall it was a nice Wrangler, but out of my price range.

I really loved being in it. It took me a few second to get adjusted to the unique layout, but all and all a good feel. I loved backing up in the thing because there is no truck and it is easy to tell where your bumper is and I was very impressed with how well it did on U turns.

The only problem I had with this Wrangler was that when I was driving it, it seemed like it was always swaying back and forth... Is this normal?

I felt like I was fighting to keep the wrangler in the lane and I kind of started to get car sick. Also there was a vibration around 50 mph.

Also do you guys prefer standard or automatic transmissions when you are 4x4ing?

[fourtycal]

The vibration is likely tires out of balance, it's hard to get that big a tire to balance. The swaying could be an alignment problem and/or tie rod ends, pitman arm, steering box, frame flex, ball joints or just a result of tall tires and flexy lift.

I am an automatic trans guy all the way but some call me old too :moses:

[moab mark]

I just typed a whole long post on this and accidently hit some key on my comp and lost it all.:angryfire: The vibration may be tires but probably the rear driveline. YJ's when lifted put a serious angle on the rear driveline. Spacing down the case helps but it still creates vibrations. You can buy a short shaft kit to help this but they are pricey. The steering can be anything that fourty cal listed. Jeep drivetrains in stock form are on the light side. Big tires etc really puts a beating on the steering etc. I would look for a bone stock one and then build it up to what you want over time. This will help stay away from the Just Empty Every Pocket problem that will nickel and dime you to death.

If possible move up to a TJ. They are just better all around jeeps.Get Auto if possible.But in the YJ's I think the auto does not have an overdrive. This can be a problem if driving alot on the freeway. Definitely 6 cyl. When looking at them lift up the carpet and see how bad the floor board is rusted. They are famous for rusting out there.

Jeeps are great fun. I own 2 of them and would never sell them. But just because they look great with those big tires and lift be careful that the drive train has not been rode hard and put to bed wet. LOOK FOR STOCK and then do your own thing.

Mark

[teancum]

Blasted computers!

Thanks for all of the input. I have been taking good notes and weeding through all of the classified listings. Luckily I have a motorcycle to drive so I don't have to find a wrangler right away so I can be more picky.

If I was going to put a lift on the jeep anyway why not buy it with one already installed? Wouldn't spending $200 to fix a suspension be cheaper than buying a new one? Or is it the fact that the people that put on these things also go 4x4ing and end up causing more/other problems?

[Wasatch Rebel]

I don't own any modern Jeeps because the ones I've owned, a '76 Cherokee and an '87 Cherokee, have both ended up being pieces of junk. Now for four-wheeling, I'd certainly recommend a standard trans. They are so helpful to save your brakes when coming down steep hills.

[IntrepidXJ]

If I was going to put a lift on the jeep anyway why not buy it with one already installed? Wouldn't spending $200 to fix a suspension be cheaper than buying a new one? Or is it the fact that the people that put on these things also go 4x4ing and end up causing more/other problems?

I, personally, would never buy a Jeep that was already lifted/modified. Most of the time you will be buying someone else's mess. I prefer to lift my Jeep myself and know everything is done correctly and up to my standards........

Auto tranny all the way :)

[moab mark]

I, personally, would never buy a Jeep that was already lifted/modified. Most of the time you will be buying someone else's mess. I prefer to lift my Jeep myself and know everything is done correctly and up to my standards........

Auto tranny all the way :)

Randy and I are on the same page. But if you can find one that drives straight looks like it hasn't been to hell and back and doesn't do everything the one you drove does then you may be ok.
As far as the motor. We all say get the 6 but a few years ago I bought my parents a yj with a 4. When I went looking there were so many nicer 4's out there then 6's and for what they wanted to do I went with a 4. I then lifted it for them and put on a set of 33's. Other then trying to pull mtn passes at 60 it has been a nice jeep. But it was an absolute stock cream puff when we bought it. It is a 95 and it drives like it just came off the showroom floor.
Around town the 4's really do ok. They are geared lower which helps make up for the difference in power. But when out on the open road, especially with big rubber the 6 is alot stronger. I do not think you can get a 4 with an auto. Even if you can I would not reccomend it. They just will not have the power to turn it.

YMMV
Mark

[oldno7]

Do some research on lifts. Buying one that is already lifted means nothing if the lift is sub standard. I'd also steer away from a jeep with a body lift.
Auto Trans here. I've had a stick in a jeep and they suffer miserably when wanting to "ease" through tough areas.
Be very careful!!!!Jeeps are a disease. Very spendy to cure, I'm still not done after many years.
The ONLY way I would go the route of a 4 cylinder is if I installed a 4/1 gear reduction first.(or similar)

[kkemp]

I've owned a YJ for 5 years and I agree with pretty much everything said here. I bought mine bone stock and did almost all the mods myself. I have to say though finding a YJ that isn't worn out is going to be a challenge. I'd recommend looking for a TJ if for not other reason than they are newer. You are not going to save money buying an older Jeep. Trust me!

If you're not a mechanically skilled, you will be if you buy a YJ. Think about it, the newest YJ is 15 years old.

Here's a short list of things you can plan on replacing right away...

Exhaust header (they all crack)
radiator (they all leak)
ball joints (expensive)
tie rod ends
unit bearings
u-joints, if not driveshafts too
body mounts (a bear to change!)
steering gear (these get real sloppy)
There is a good change the crappy vacuum actived 4wd gadget in the front axle is probably about to quit.

Also if you get a 6 cyl (recommended) YJ, get one with fuel injection. The earlier ones have a carb and they suck!

If you get one that's already lifted, find a very knowledgeable person to check out. You may want to consider taking it to someone like Rad Jeeper to get an opinion.

[Wasatch Rebel]

Hey I asked some other guys at rockmountainextreme.com, the question, manual or auto trans? Here's what they had to say: http://www.rockymountainextreme.com/showthread.php?t=77138

[teancum]

Thanks for the link. It sounds like the auto/manual thing is just what ever one you have is the best... I have driven manual transmissions most of my life and the only time that I didn't like it was when I was in California during rush hour... and I was thinking that 4x4ing might turn out to be the same type of thing where I would just always have my foot on the clutch.

****************Update****************

I test drove two more Wranglers today and my first 6 cylinder. I didn't think that the 4 cylinder Jeeps where that bad... Well until I got into a 6 cylinder and now I know why I would never be satisfied with anything less.

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?sid=733005&nid=443&tab=list/view&ad=2934828

This was the last one that I drove... It was really nice and it seemed like the guy took really good care of it. It is highly modded and kind of at the top end of what I want to spend.


P.S. Thanks to everyone for the advise given so far. It has and is very useful.

[teancum]

Oh ya another question. For winter use is a hard top a must or will a soft top do? I found a 97 wrangler with 98K miles and no mods to the body... but it only has a soft top for it.

Just so you know a little about me... I LOVE the cold weather. I went through two winters without trying to fix the heater to an old ford escort that I had because I just didn't care enough to try to fix it.

[snccoulter]

I have had both and i was more happy with the soft top than the hard top. Either way there is no insulation. The heater is fantastic and you will stay toasty with either. and the soft top is much nicer to take off and put on in the spring and summer.

[DOSS]

I have had both and i was more happy with the soft top than the hard top. Either way there is no insulation. The heater is fantastic and you will stay toasty with either. and the soft top is much nicer to take off and put on in the spring and summer.

That said driving a soft top with the window portion of the door missing in 15degree weather for 60+ miles at highway speeds is really freaking cold :)

[Cirrus2000]

That said driving a soft top with the window portion of the door missing in 15degree weather for 60+ miles at highway speeds is really freaking cold :)

I live where the weather is milder in winter (and cooler in summer). We get a lot of rain here, though. In winter I love my hard top - quieter, which is nice, and I'm not wanting to ride around topless anyway. It stays on from October through April. The soft top is noisy on the highway, so it's nice driving around without the top. If you'll do that a lot, consider a Windjammer and/or a Duster.

Good heater, all right - a friend refers to his as "Chernobyl" - as in, "It's cold, but I'll just put Chernobyl on." :haha:

[snccoulter]

That said driving a soft top with the window portion of the door missing in 15degree weather for 60+ miles at highway speeds is really freaking cold :)

I bet it does but I would not know. Oh and thank you for that favor.

[kkemp]

I have a hard top and soft top and like them both. But if I had to make a choice, I'd go with soft.

[nelsonccc]

I had a 2000 Jeep cherokee with the 4.0liter in line 6 and nothing ever went wrong with it. I had it for 5 years and never had to fix anything on it other than the normal wear and tear items. It had 30,000 miles on it when I bought it and 112,000 miles when I traded it in. Never had to do anything to it.

Anyways I looked into a lift kit quite a bit. I looked into ghetto cheap lifts and fancy custom lifts. I never did it, 'cause I found that i didn't need it. I was pretty much able to go wherever I wanted in southern utah, nevada, and arizona. I was constantly amazed at the stuff I could get through with just a basic stock set-up and normal All Terrain tires. I found that unless you're planning on doing Moab type rock crawling a big lift is uneccessary. So before you spend the dough you might want to truly evaluate the type of off roading you'll do because a lift kit is a hassle, cuts gas mileage, and expensive.

PS. Some time I'll have to explain how I know that a jeep floats and where the drain plugs are in the interior.

[teancum]

Is there a way to tell the difference between the different models of jeeps (SE vs sports utility vs Sahara)? I am going to go look at a Jeep tonight that I think was miss posted. It is a 99 Wrangler that is listed as having a 4 cyl. but it has those fog lights that I mostly see on Sahara's.

Here is the only picture that I have of it for right now.

36184

[teancum]

nelsonccc, I think that you are right. I was test driving a nicely modified Wrangler the other day and after I was done I just felt like it was a little overkill for me and a waste of a great crawler... Kind of like buying a Porsche to drive around town.

[kkemp]

I agree that a stock rig may be all you need. However, let me warn that a stock YJ is not as capable as a stock TJ. So, if you are going with stock, stick with the TJ. Stock YJ's have the worst clearance of any jeep ever made and are stiff as hell. Also, some TJ's, like the Canyonlands model, come with 31" tires. I think one of those would be great if you can find one. Problem is they seem to be pretty rare.

[teancum]

I just tested out the 99 wrangler and it was a 4 cyl... everything else was in good shape it looks to be stock and taken off road very little if at all. It has spent most of its life outside of Utah so there is less rust then expected which is a plus. The only bad thing about it is the 4 cyl engine, but I think that I can get it for less than the trade in value for the jeep.

I have not driven a 4wd vehicle that much... well more like never so I had a question about how the 4 wheel drive low felt. After about 1500 rmp (2 mph maybe) it left like the clutch disengaged and I didnt get any more speed out of the jeep... the rmps just went up like the jeep was in neutral. In 2nd gear the same thing happened only I could get to 7 mph... 3rd and 4th gear left fine, but where slow (expected I would assume). Is it normal for 1st and 2nd gear to do that?

[kkemp]

Low range shouldn't behave any different than high range. Just lower gears. I'm not sure what it is you're experiencing. If the clutch is working in high range, it will be fine in low range too. I think you are just not used to gears being so low.

Also, if you're driving it around on pavement of 4 low it's going to bind up and that will make it weird not to mention very difficult to steer.

[Cirrus2000]

Low range shouldn't behave any different than high range. Just lower gears. I'm not sure what it is you're experiencing. If the clutch is working in high range, it will be fine in low range too. I think you are just not used to gears being so low.

Also, if you're driving it around on pavement of 4 low it's going to bind up and that will make it weird not to mention very difficult to steer.

Totally agreed. 4 low gearing just feels weird when you first try it out.

[JP]

Wow Tea, you are a Jeep virgin :lol8:
For the Jeeps you're going to come across, CJ (CJ-5, CJ-7) Round headlights early 70's through mid 80's. YJ would be the square headlight Wranglers. TJ's were the round headlight ones that you have pictured and the last of the 4.0L engine (in my opinion, the best six cylinder they ever made for a Jeep) and the new "Wranglers" you see now are JK's.

The SUV style Jeeps, the Cherokee (XJ) and the Grand Cherokee (ZJ, WJ, WK) are the most popular "wheelin" SUV's. You'll still see the older style Wagoneer's, Cherokee Chief's, Grand Wagoneer's. My ultimate favorites are the Grand Cherokees 4.0L's. Then they have had newer other models and some still, Liberty (KJ), Commander, Patriot, Compass...

Stay away from the 4cycl models. You'll regret it highly later on. If you're looking for great fuel mileage, Jeep is not way up there in the mileage per gallon category. The 4.0L's will net you anywhere from 15 to 21. The 4 cylinders didn't fair much better.

What you felt in 4 low is the correct feeling. 4 low is just that, lower gears in the transfer case. So, your RPM's will spike a lot quicker and move a lot slower than in 2wd or 4wd high. 4 low would be the tortoise and 4 high or 2wd will be the hare. 4 low is for crawling over rough surfaces and helps with control and traction. It's working on a lower set of gears within the transfer case. That would be that lever you shifted to get it into low. 4 high and 2wd use the same gears in the transfer case. That's why your RPM's are "normal" and you're moving at normal speeds. 4 high will be a tad bit slower or lethargic than 2wd, because in 4 high you are now putting power to the front axle.

Buying lifted Jeeps is tricky. They could have been severely abused, had a cheap lift installed and or both. There are a ton of Jeep suspensions out there, everybody made them because Jeeps are and still continue to be the most popular. So, many company's just throw together a cheap lift to make money. The cheap lifts begin to squeak after some mileage is put on them, the cheap parts begin to wear and the "wandering" all over the road begins and the sway will be noticeable. Good aftermarket lifts will ride better than a stock Jeep and continue to do so over the years. Another thing that could have made your experience bad in that 35" tire Jeep (along with what I have already mentioned) is having some of the same stock suspension parts or same as stock length aftermarket parts. (Control arms: when looking under the Jeep, the bars that go from the axle back to the frame) When putting bigger tires on it like 35's, the angle that these are now on make for a bad ride. The springs maybe to soft and that will add to the sway along with taking the rear sway bar off. Some lifts don't compensate for losing that sway bar.

Here are some useful links for the Jeep virgin looking to take the next step to Jeep enthusiast :lol8:

http://www.800-923-jeep.com/techCorner/history/

Scroll all the way down to the bottom on this one. Pretty neat graphed time line and it allows you to click on the different models which, in turn, will give you a pic and brief description.
http://www.offroaders.com/tech/jeep/Jeep-FJ.htm

http://www.4-the-love-of-jeeps.com/jeep-models.html

History of the, as you would say, "Wrangler". You'll learn the difference :wink:
http://www.fourwheeler.com/thehistoryof/129_9709_jeepposter/index.html

http://4wheeldrive.about.com/cs/jeep/l/bljeepcodes.htm


This should get you going, any questions you have, feel free to fire away :cool2:

Oh yea, 2003-2006 TJ's (style you have pictured) had a package called the Rubicon. Direct from the factory, these were ready to go 4wheeling. Lowered geared transfer case than you drove, off road tires, lockers, better axles are just some of the things this model TJ had to offer. They also offered a longer wheel base version TJ, which is known as a LJ and it too was an option for the Rubicon package. This was in 2005 & 2006. The longer wheelbase netted you a lager cargo area. (They still make this package today) If you're looking to get into 4wheeling your daily driving Jeep, in my honest opinion, look for one of these. With a good lift and 33's you'll be able to tackle a hell of a lot more than just a standard lifted TJ on 33's. So, looking for a TJ or LJ style Rubicon will net you happiness out there for a long time to come. You will be able to find some stock ones for sale. They'll be a little more pricey than that of the "X", "Sport" or "Sahara", but well worth the little extra cash.

Soft Top vs Hard Top: Personal opinion, everybody wants the soft top when it's warm out and everybody wants the hard top in winter. But, you'll be fine with the soft top. It will still heat up fine inside. You'll always have a little more road noise and stuff with the soft top. Just turn up the radio a notch. The soft top is more versatile and will give you more options. The rear plastic window maybe susceptible to breakage if you try rolling it up in the winter. All kinds of aftermarket soft top add-ons. You'll be fine with the soft top.

[keith_b00ne]

I personally lean towards the Jeep XJ. They are a very solid and capable vehicle that still can be driven on the road. A good source of information on them is www.naxja.org.