Retrievable Rappel Anchors

[trackrunner]

I know different ways to set up an anchor. But I've always wanted to learn some retrievable rappel anchors but I have no idea where to find them. I don't know it might come in handy and I could minimize my trace in some canyons. Anyone know some retrievable rappel anchors?

[Iceaxe]

If I was a fan of retrievable rappel anchors.... which I'm not.... this is the one I would use, it's really sweet...

The instructions kind of suck but it's the best I have right now. It was originally put together by Aaron Smith after he was introduced to the macrame knot. The macrame by it's self is kind of worthless, but this method shows how to use it with a sling and retrieve both rope and sling..... best part is if the sling hangs for some reason the rope still pulls.

I believe this system has since had some use with the "Omi-Sling" but the concept is still the same. I prefer the cheapo don't really care if I lose it sling....

Good luck, don't kill yourself....

:cool2:

[Iceaxe]

Here is info on "the Slick".... which is really cool but will probably never see production because of liability issues.

The Slick! - Retrievable Anchor
http://www.deserthighlights.com/the-slick/the-slick.htm

http://www.deserthighlights.com/the-slick/DSC00001.jpg

http://www.deserthighlights.com/the-slick/oe1.jpg

By the way.... Nice topic :2thumbs:

[Iceaxe]

Here is the easiest and safest retrievable anchor I know of. We always use this method when doing Lomation, otherwise you have to leave about 70' of webbing. This is a safe technique as the anchor will not release with the rappel line in it. If the sling snags on retrieval, you only lose the webbing and retrieval rope.

1. Tie two rapides into a loop of webbing.

2. Wrap both sides of the webbing around tree, arch, whatever.

3. Run the rope through the two rapides.

4. Attach a pull line above one of the rapides.

5. Rappel off double-rope fashion and pull the rappel rope.

6. pull down the sling with the retrieval rope.

One BIG word of caution.... when you pull this system down watch out for the falling rapides on the sling!!! They can be deadly.

If you want to be really slick you can block the rappel line to the rapides and rappel two at a time single strand. Last guy down cleans up the mess and rappels double strand.

[oldno7]

I may have missed it but if not--

all retrievable anchors with toggles should be used as a LAMAR system.

ie. only the last person down uses the retrievable system(unsecured), there are many ways to secure all of these systems so they don't prematurely release such as clipping a biner in the last bight of the macrame. Last person takes biner off and rappels. :popcorn:

[Iceaxe]

all retrievable anchors with toggles should be used as a LAMAR system.

Yeah... what he said...

I'll even take it a step further. I don't let the group rappel on a macrame even if it has a biner safety pin. The problem is after several folks rap on the macrame it tightens up and can create problems when it's time to release the knot.

.

[oldno7]

I prefer omni sling type settups. They can be done with or without an omni sling. An overhand knot on the ends of a runner that we all carry anyway, producing a bight on each end works
I've had 3 people in a group rappel on this settup and it still released very easily and 2 of us were not "petite"
A biner is used to secure the releasable until LAMAR.
Seems more efficient than a macrame to me.
In the pics the rappel strand is on the left
I've only used this method once so I'm obviously no expert but it did work good.
I would guess releasable systems are used very little, just a tool for a particular situation.

[trackrunner]

Thanks all. No I'm not planning on killing myself. :roll: I was just interested in this subject in case I ever do consider a canyon that might require the need of retrievable anchor.

[johnvi]

The Slick is pretty cool. While you can't buy one, you can tie a Janus (http://canyonwiki.com/wiki/index.php/Janus_Anchor), which is functionally pretty similar. I worked up a sewn version of the Janus, which I like a lot. It has even less snag potential and allows independent rope retrieval should there be an anchor retrieval problem, but again, liability issues preclude production right now.

There is also this recent thread (http://canyoneering.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1795) at the ACA forum.

My new favorite goofy technique is this French get-up called the fife

[Iceaxe]

but really... only as a party trick.

Here, hold my beer and watch this. :lol8:

[rrv]

I prefer omni sling type settups. They can be done with or without an omni sling. An overhand knot on the ends of a runner that we all carry anyway, producing a bight on each end works
I've had 3 people in a group rappel on this settup and it still released very easily and 2 of us were not "petite"
A biner is used to secure the releasable until LAMAR.
Seems more efficient than a macrame to me.
In the pics the rappel strand is on the left
I've only used this method once so I'm obviously no expert but it did work good.
I would guess releasable systems are used very little, just a tool for a particular situation.

So, in this picture, you rappel on the left side. Testing this, it seems that if the right side gets pulled through the left loop, it would be very difficult to release. What keeps the right side from being pulled through the left loop?

[tcmault]

Why not do the Omni Sling as shown, but with Rapides in webbing? You could figure 8 on a bite the one rapide, put the rope through the other rapide and do a double line rappel.

[Bootboy]

Has anyone tried to use a system similar to the quick-release buckle on a swiftwater rescue PFD? Maybe I'll play with it sometime and see what I come up with.

[pikan]

OR, here, hold my sign...don't want to lose it! :haha:

[ilipichicuma]

No one here has mentioned the fiddlestick yet. I know it has some protractors on the forum here, but I've used it many times and loved it. I don't have one of the fancy ones you buy. I just cut a foot-long piece of 1/4 inch pvc, drilled a hole in the end, and tied a piece of paracord to it. Works awesome. I've never seen it budge at all, when the rope was weighted or not, and once you pull the fiddlestick, it only takes a tug on the rope and it comes falling right down. This link shows how it works well. We generally put a biner in the stone knot, and then just add the fiddlestick for the last person. http://www.canyoneeringusa.com/techtips/fiddlestick/

[kiwi_outdoors]

Looks "idiot proof" - any idiots in the audience?

[edsbay]

I use this set up quite often. http://dyeclan.com/outdoors101/canyoneering101/?page=2-ring-retrievable-sling

I have two slings with quick links already set up so I don't have to adjust the length each time and makes it very quick to deploy. You just gotta make sure you do a test pull to make sure it does not hang up. If it does your out some webbing and an extra quick link (2 opposed to leaving 1 in a normal set up).

I like it and feel very safe on it.

[Mojave Silence]

A variation on the above (Edsbay):
Replace one of the QL's w/ a full sized biner. To retrieve, tie a small knot on the end of the rope, small enough to fit through the biner, but big enough to be stopped by the QL, as the rope is pulled through and reaches the QL it brings the slings/webbing down with it.

[Sandstone Addiction]

If it does your out some webbing and an extra quick link

If it gets hung up, how do you retrieve the pull cord so it only leaves the webbing and links?

[Slot Machine]

If it gets hung up, how do you retrieve the pull cord so it only leaves the webbing and links?

Ascend the pull cord. :haha:

Really, one must be choosy about where this type of anchor is placed, because you can't get it back once it gets hung up. Somtimes we do a test pull, and catch it before it falls to be certain that it will work.

But most of the time, placing a retrievable anchor should be a no-gamble situation, because that much gear (pull + anchor) might be needed down canyon.