"The Rules" Female Passivity VS Timid Men?

[tanya]

No way! :roll: It's the MAN's :popcorn: job to initiate first contact! Right!?!?!?! :ne_nau:

Why Proactive Dating Works

Here's what doing your own picking and emailing first will do for you

If you are like most of my romance clients, you wish that love would "just happen." Men as well as women cringe at the mere thought of taking action that might make finding love more likely.
It's understandable that women are reluctant to make the first move. After all, most of us over 40 were taught to sit and wait. We kind of like being pursued. It's safe. And then there are books like "The Rules" that dictate old-fashioned female passivity for new-age women.
But men? That's right, ladies, they are as scared as we are. Maybe more.
Perhaps love will "just happen" for some of these people who are "just waiting." After all, each of them has indeed done SOMETHING: They have posted a profile. They've made a semi-public statement that they are single and looking.
Maybe, just maybe, Mr. or Ms. Right will see it, be in the 65-75 percent who will actually make the first move, and decide to get in touch.
Maybe, just maybe, Mr. or Ms. Right will see it, be in the 65-75 percent who will actually make the first move, and decide to get in touch.
But what happens if both parties are in the percentages who never make the first move? Nothing! Talk about two ships that pass in the night...
Why proactive is better than waiting
Here's what proactive dating -- doing your own picking and emailing first -- will do for you:
You'll get clearer about what you are looking for, and better able to recognize it when you find it.
Once you get over the shock of making the first move, you'll feel so much better.

Action is empowering. Sitting and waiting is hard.
Action is empowering. Sitting and waiting is hard.
Ask any wallflower at a junior high school dance.

Since you are doing the looking and picking, the chances are much better that you will find just what you want, rather than having to make do with whoever gets in touch with you.

Women: Men LIKE it if you contact them first. I have never had one of my male clients not feel touched and appreciative when a woman emails them first. "The Rules" be darned. (I emailed my now-husband first. He liked it.)

Men: Women like you to get in touch first, too, of course. But we know how hard that can be. No one likes to hear "no."
Internet dating has revolutionized how we think about rejection
Internet dating has revolutionized how we think about rejection, though. You can read more of what I have to say about rejection in my Yahoo! Personals article "Your Recipe for Rejection Prevention."

How to make the first move
Pick a list of favorites, at least 5 or 6, and contact them all at once.
Do not let yourself get too focused on any one person before you hear back and get some sense of their interest and availability.
Be prepared for a high non-response rate. No response is very common. If 30 percent of your contacts reply, you are doing very well.
While you are waiting for the first group you contacted to respond, look around again and get five or six more prospects ready to go. Do not wait more than a week -- start sending out more first emails to your new list.
Remember that "no" or "no response" is not about you. It can't be. These folks don't know you at all. A "no" is about their non-availability. Do not let your imagination run wild and make a "no" harder than it needs to be.

Got the message?
Do something! Get ready.

My book "Find a Sweetheart Soon! Your Love Trip Planner for Women" will help you take more steps. Your first step is to post a great profile -- I can help. Then, start looking and sending those first emails.
What have you got to lose? For that matter, think what you might lose if you don't.

Yahoo.com article with LONG url. :eek2:

[sparker1]

The man was the one required to make a move in our old world. I don't think this is right any longer, and definitely not desirable. Either party who has an interest shout initiate contact. Otherwise, a perfectly good relationship might never happen. (I also think the woman should pay for dinner, etc.) :nod:

[stefan]

arrr ... the pirate in me says to fight over the woman ... even if there is no one to fight!

[tanya]

:five:

I love Pirates!!!!!!!!

My kind of man! :2thumbs:


I could not do that Stan....

Either I would go after none or all. :roll:

[hank moon]

all depends on what you want...a string of iffy dates or a few well-considered ones. I have a woman friend on match.com who has wasted many months of her time waiting for the "right guy" to come along. If reliance on chance is your bag, go for it. The process can be speedier with a little work on the woman's part.

[tanya]

all depends on what you want...a string of iffy dates or a few well-considered ones. I have a woman friend on match.com who has wasted many months of her time waiting for the "right guy" to come along. If reliance on chance is your bag, go for it. The process can be speedier with a little work on the woman's part.


Fun iffy ones of course........

Until you are in the mood for the "right guy"....... which should be something you just wait for, but ......

Sometimes you are in that nesting mood and want the "right guy" now...

Or sometimes you have the "right guy" but he is lacking so you start looking for the iffy guys that have the right moves.

Bottom line... women really don't know what they want. :mrgreen: They just want it all! Men too .... I think?

[cachehiker]

They just want it all!

+1

That what my most recent relationship was all about. It must really suck having a boyfriend who actually has to WORK 3 months out of the year. It's not like I disappeared or was the least bit abusive, just stressed. If you're on a pedestal the other 9 months, then what is the problem?

[tanya]

They just want it all!

+1

That what my most recent relationship was all about. It must really suck having a boyfriend who actually has to WORK 3 months out of the year. It's not like I disappeared or was the least bit abusive, just stressed. If you're on a pedestal the other 9 months, then what is the problem?

The problem is that SHE is insecure and needed stuff from someone else because she does not have it inside. Just be glad she is gone now. HER problem would do nothing but grow over time.

Find a woman that does not have such problems and you will be a far happier man the rest of your life!

[cachehiker]

Find a woman that does not have such problems and you will be a far happier man the rest of your life!

After 29 years of dating, I can comfortably assert that it is easier said than done.

[hank moon]

Bottom line... women really don't know what they want. :mrgreen: They just want it all! Men too .... I think?

Most people want the impossible from relationships (e.g. security) but are unable to see or admit it to themselves and others. One reason for the high failure rate...

[tanya]

Bottom line... women really don't know what they want. :mrgreen: They just want it all! Men too .... I think?

Most people want the impossible from relationships (e.g. security) but are unable to see or admit it to themselves and others. One reason for the high failure rate...


I have to admit that you interest me Hank.... you are quite attractive and have skills that are attractive... yet you have managed to remain single...

Why are you single?

Most people, although they do want the impossible, have learned to deal with not having it and enjoy who they are with and their lives. Not everyone though --- as we all know from the divorce stats.

I admit I want more..... but appreciate what I have.

[hank moon]

Why are you single?

Good question, and one with a long shaggy tail of an answer that won't go on this forum. :mrgreen:

Short answer: marriage not desired.

[tanya]

Why are you single?

Good question, and one with a long shaggy tail of an answer that won't go on this forum. :mrgreen:

Short answer: marriage not desired.


So...... digging deeper into Hank's life....


Do you just have short term relationships or do you enjoy living with a woman?

[hank moon]

Do you just have short term relationships or do you enjoy living with a woman?

Good question, and one with a long shaggy tail of an answer that won't go on this forum. :mrgreen:

[tanya]

Do you just have short term relationships or do you enjoy living with a woman?

Good question, and one with a long shaggy tail of an answer that won't go on this forum. :mrgreen:


I suppose I will just have to catch you off the forum one of these days. :nod:

[CarpeyBiggs]

Good question, and one with a long shaggy tail of an answer that won't go on this forum. :mrgreen:

Really? Seems like a couple of yes or no questions... :haha:

Seriously though, what I think Tanya is getting at... are you addicted to porn? :lol8:

[tanya]

Good question, and one with a long shaggy tail of an answer that won't go on this forum. :mrgreen:

Really? Seems like a couple of yes or no questions... :haha:

Seriously though, what I think Tanya is getting at... are you addicted to porn? :lol8:


:roflol:

[hank moon]

Seriously though, what I think Tanya is getting at... are you addicted to porn? :lol8:

Not any more than the other forum junkies! :mrgreen:

[Randi]

No way! :roll: It's the MAN's :popcorn: job to initiate first contact! Right!?!?!?! :ne_nau:

Why Proactive Dating Works

Here's what doing your own picking and emailing first will do for you

If you are like most of my romance clients, you wish that love would "just happen." Men as well as women cringe at the mere thought of taking action that might make finding love more likely.
It's understandable that women are reluctant to make the first move. After all, most of us over 40 were taught to sit and wait. We kind of like being pursued. It's safe. And then there are books like "The Rules" that dictate old-fashioned female passivity for new-age women.

Ugh. I

[Shan]

I am definitely more on the pro-active side. I don't wait for the guy to make the first move. Call it my work ethic or my "fix it" attitude or desire not to idle - I don't know. I don't think I'm a control freak either by any means. I remember the whole dating scene in college (hmm, dating may not be the right term here). I had no qualms about calling up a guy asking him to go do something like disc golf or kayaking. I got a few "nos" and a few "who are you, and how do I know you?" (OK, maybe I came off a desperate now that I've typed it out. HA!) But rejection didn't take over as I still gave it a shot.

Anyway, my point is I think people overall have very out of touch expectations of how love happens or how Mr/Ms. Right comes along. They rely on this "in love" feeling, when in fact you cannot sustain an entire life's relationship on just a feeling. Love is a conscientious act. It requires action.

Loving someone else is realizing what it takes for that person to feel loved (even if it has nothing to do with the way you like to be loved) and acting accordingly. So if someone's work takes over for X month, reassure them they are still loved by doing what you need to do to show them. That doesn't mean drop the other pertinent thing in your life, but let them know they haven't slide down the scale to #2 or #10 in priorities.

I am going through some difficult times right now, and have read countless marriage and relationship books. TONS. We aren't born with this knowledge and I can see why most marriages end in the first 7 years now.

[tanya]

Seriously though, what I think Tanya is getting at... are you addicted to porn? :lol8:

Not any more than the other forum junkies! :mrgreen:

So ....

If we don't want a man that is addicted to porn, we must avoid the 'forum junkies"!!!! hmmm..... :ne_nau:

[tanya]

[quote=Randi]I think that the number one destroyer of relationships is dishonesty.
If you can

[tanya]

Anyway, my point is I think people overall have very out of touch expectations of how love happens or how Mr/Ms. Right comes along. They rely on this "in love" feeling, when in fact you cannot sustain an entire life's relationship on just a feeling. Love is a conscientious act. It requires action.

So true! But THAT 'feeling' feels so good we want to keep it --- rather than trade in those first emotions for a stable relationship. I have been very addicted to being in love before.

[Shan]

Anyway, my point is I think people overall have very out of touch expectations of how love happens or how Mr/Ms. Right comes along. They rely on this "in love" feeling, when in fact you cannot sustain an entire life's relationship on just a feeling. Love is a conscientious act. It requires action.

So true! But THAT 'feeling' feels so good we want to keep it --- rather than trade in those first emotions for a stable relationship. I have been very addicted to being in love before.

No doubt that feeling is a good feeling. Though when that feeling goes away or subsides, too many people think it must be the end to the relationship. "I love you but I'm not in love with you." Yet they do not understand that love takes work, and you can't just rely solely on a feeling.

[tanya]

Anyway, my point is I think people overall have very out of touch expectations of how love happens or how Mr/Ms. Right comes along. They rely on this "in love" feeling, when in fact you cannot sustain an entire life's relationship on just a feeling. Love is a conscientious act. It requires action.

So true! But THAT 'feeling' feels so good we want to keep it --- rather than trade in those first emotions for a stable relationship. I have been very addicted to being in love before.

No doubt that feeling is a good feeling. Though when that feeling goes away or subsides, too many people think it must be the end to the relationship. "I love you but I'm not in love with you." Yet they do not understand that love takes work, and you can't just rely solely on a feeling.

Exactly!

[Randi]

[quote=tanya][quote=Randi]I think that the number one destroyer of relationships is dishonesty.
If you can

[cachehiker]

[quote=Randi]Now that I

[tanya]

I have had those types.... and it's great if you have kids and just want a comfortable relationship.


But I also like the kinds of relationships... where the man is not a friend. We don't talk about stuff. He is simply a lover. Life is romantic. It's hard to have this sort of thing if you have kids with him, but it's my favorite kind of relationship! No talk of bills, kids, or stuff. It's just like dating.

[tanya]

She promptly picks up my cell phone, programs in her number, and asks me to call about giving her "cooking lessons". I gotta admire such spunk and regardless of whether I should have run for the hills or not, I called her back the next night. Dinner has yet to happen though. We work incompatible shifts during the week and she has custody of a 3 year old every other weekend.

Just curious... would you have asked her out?




As far as internet dating goes, this is good old traditional Utah and it probably works a little worse here than elsewhere.

I have been head over heels in love :twisted: with a man or two on the net.... where we talked for years and years ---- but never met. I imagine that meeting that way could get intense! Granted.... I was not looking for anyone nor did I have any interest in meeting anyone offline..... :cool2: ---but I got to know these men better than I have ever known anyone. Maybe one of these days we will actually meet. We still talk once in a while.

[cachehiker]

Just curious... would you have asked her out?

If I was later given the opportunity, yes. The "best friend" that joined me as my date at the dinner party I hosted has convinced herself that she's too old for me and not active enough to suit me. She might be right. No matter how cool she was about it, and regardless of whether we're inclined to get romatically involved, I am a gentleman and I was with her. Putting the moves on other women while in that situation shows a complete lack of class.


I have been head over heels in love :twisted: with a man or two on the net.... where we talked for years and years ---- but never met. I imagine that meeting that way could get intense! Granted.... I was not looking for anyone nor did I have any interest in meeting anyone offline..... :cool2: ---but I got to know these men better than I have ever known anyone. Maybe one of these days we will actually meet. We still talk once in a while.

Don't think I could ever manage that. Although it sounds like that gal from Arvada that I've exchanged email with off and on for a while could be quite infatuated. There's just too much make or break associated with the one on one, face to face interaction. After dating so long, you learn some very interesting things about yourself and it seems there are some very difficult to find qualities that have to be there for me.

[denaliguide]

[color=white]
But I also like the kinds of relationships... where the man is not a friend. We don't talk about stuff. He is simply a lover. [color]

can you say booty call? :naughty:

and dont ask if these pant make you butt look big. it's your butt that makes your butt look big. if i didn't like your big butt then why am i taking you to the golden corral for the all you can eat?

seriously though, what we are all looking for is someone who can just put up with our wierdness and we be able to tolerate theirs.

and finally it's all about the "hoo haa".

[hank moon]

I think security is a fairly reasonable thing to look for and desire in important relationships, be they lovers, friends, family, whatever.

The desire for security leads inevitably to disappointment, disillusionment, etc. because it does not and cannot exist. Entropy guarantees it on a physical level

[Randi]

[quote=Randi]I think security is a fairly reasonable thing to look for and desire in important relationships, be they lovers, friends, family, whatever.

The desire for security leads inevitably to disappointment, disillusionment, etc. because it does not and cannot exist. Entropy guarantees it on a physical level